Their 0-Covid-Strategy (just as the one from NZ) has worked extremely well up to Delta.

I do believe the mRNA vaccinations are somewhat better than old-school vaccinations, though, and I certainly agree with others that it would be better to push mRNA much more. It's not "experimental" anymore, and those that claim so are clearly in the Dotard camp.

Now, with Omicron, it's my opinion they should shift towards "living with Covid", but that's entirely up to them.

With vaccines + available treatments against covid + the much less dangerous omicron (less doesn't mean zero) variant, the 0-covid-strategy imho has run it's course.

But till Omicron/Vaccines (ie, till fall 2021) it was clearly a superior strategy to the western approach (can't call that a strategy) "hey, let's do some half-arsed lockdowns that don't really work, but strangle the economy just enough, annoy everyone, and not lead anywhere, and still result in millions death"

So yeah, 2022 isn't 2020/2021 anymore, and I hope the PRC will eventually adapt. Guess they're having a good look onto other Asian countries like Singapore who now are "living with it" - super-high vaccination rate + omicron = looking good.

There's no reason to expect long term side effects. This isn't the first time we've injected materials intended to make the body make targets for the immune system to go after--it's just in the past they were attenuated viruses. The mRNA and viral-vector Covid vaccines simply distill this to it's essence--making the body produce only the best target rather than whole viruses. Unlike attenuated-virus vaccines there's no risk of producing the actual disease.

It's a matter of face. China isn't going to meekly sit by and buy somebody else's vaccine, they're going to make their own. Never mind that we've never had a vaccine against a coronavirus before because killed-virus vaccines quickly become ineffective. They went ahead and did a killed-virus vaccine--and the real world data seems to show exactly what was expected, it worked well at first but doesn't do much against the variants.

Yup. While the R[sub]0[/sub] was low enough it worked very well. Throw down a ring fence around any infection and they contained it--inconvenient for those caught in the rings but better than the tens of millions that would die without.

The problem is their vaccine does almost nothing against Omicron. They have a population that's basically unprotected--and against that Omicron has about half the fatality rate of the original. Given the hospital crash that would be inevitable that could easily be ten million dead. They have painted themselves into a corner pretty badly at this point.

Key: Super high vaccination rate.

i know this isn’t a thread about vaccines. I would just like to point out:
my “no history of long term side effects” vs. your “no reason to expect long term side effects” are not necessarily in opposition, just one of us is not pretending to know the unknown. To my knowledge we’ve never coded the body to actually PRODUCE cytotoxic entities so that our body could then mount a immuno-response to those very cells it was making. Its a fascinating strategy, logically it’s not without risk, and its conceivable that while Israel went 100% into mRNA, China opted not to for reasons other than face.

also, i would check your condemnation of the quickly deteriorating effectiveness of chinese vax...for a moment I thought you were describing the rapid loss of utility of the mRNA technology.

USA to China flights?
 

Where can I find a list of valid flights from USA to China?
Either a direct flight or the ones that make "crew-change" stop?

I guess I keep looking in the wrong places?

None of the vaccines work particularly well to stop asymptomatic spread of Omicron, even with three doses. But all vaccines, Chinese or otherwise, appear to still be effective in preventing most severe illness, hospitalization and death. The notion China's vaccines are worse than the rest or totally ineffective was never true (78 percent efficacy was not THAT big a drop from 90-92, despite what US newspapers wanted us to think) but it's especially laughable now that Omicron has put everybody on a level playing field.

As far as Omicron spelling doom for zero-Covid, there have already been several local Omicron outbreaks, most notably in Tianjin, that were brought under control. Qingdao and Dongguan are seeing big swings right now, but they're also testing everyone. If case counts start moving into the 4 or 5 digits, that would be the time to declare zero-Covid dead.

I think people are projecting a lot of their previously held opinions on China onto its epidemic control policy and ignoring some important facts.

I just heard from a colleague that China has added a new test requirement for an antigen test before being allowed to board the flight from the USA to China.

I guess that makes one blood test, 3 PCR tests and 1 antigen test in order to get into China.

They keep making it harder as the rest of the world is trying to make travel easier. Strange.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/...tions-83266824

Did he have to endure Q?

The article says three weeks Q at his residence. ;)

"Burns arrived Friday with his wife Libby and a group of other U.S. diplomats and their families and will undergo three weeks of quarantine at his official residence as China requires...."

-Nonstop flights are only offered by Chinese airlines.
-You need to go to your gateway city 7 days before you fly.
-Most of us use UA 857 because Shanghai quarantine isn't so bad.
-If you have extra time to spare, you will save a lot of money by connecting in a third country, but you're looking at a 14-day transit, and be sure to confirm in advance with the PRC consulate in your third country.
-It has been reported in our Wx thread that Taiwan quarantine counts for the PRC, but you need a business visa to enter Taiwan.

I'm on the thread and didn't see anything on this... Also people coming in from TW are still required to quarantine as far as I know.

But I'm looking into this as I'm considering this route for this summer. Flights to the US are (relatively) easy, so it's the return into China that's giving me problems. Also from Taiwan you won't be required to to take a blood test as far as I know (I'm also working on confirming).

https://qinius.ts960.com/%E5%BE%AE%E...1208165346.jpg
By the way the above is a list of hotels that accept +7 stays (the 7 days of self-monitoring after the 14-days of quarantine). I won't translate everything but in Jing'an the hotels listed are UrCove by Hyatt, Puli, Hanting (Zhongshan N. Rd. by train station), and the Portman Ritz Carlton.

Disclaimer: this is compiled by a TW association and I don't vouch whether it's correct or up-to-date.

Well I'm interested. As I reported in https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/asia...l#post34049033 the gold card for Taiwan is possible again. Still not sure how I can get a China visa but it’s a step closer.

If you need an entry visa for China, just reach out to moondog and he will share Vincent’s contact info. Amongst other extremely accurate information.

I want to make it crystal clear that I receive no kickbacks from Vincent. In fact, many other firms provide nearly identical services. I stick with Vincent myself because he has all of my paperwork on file.

UA857 is expensive. are there cheaper options?

lots of those are sold out Or not working anymore?

Is it any different about changing plans if the passenger is Chinese Citizen?
Can I chinese citizen transit through taiwan?

The current rule is that if there are direct flights from your departure country to China, then you have to take that. Otherwise you won't get a green code. For this purpose, the Delta, UA, and AA flights that stop briefly at ICN are eligible (ICN is not really seen as a stop).

As a Chinese citizen you CAN transfer through Taiwan (https://www.roc-taiwan.org/pl/post/3354.html) but the airline won't let you board in the US because the Chinese consulate / embassy won't issue you a green code because of the above rule.

There are other ways, such as staying for 30 days in Korea or Thailand. Flights from Thailand to China or super expensive now though.

These questions are probably better discussed on the other thread, Current China Entry Policy

If anything Chinese passport holders may face more hurdles because of lack of visa-free access to third countries on route.

Transit through Taiwan is not allowed. The only way to fly through Taiwan is if you have Taiwan residency and can enter Taiwan and then fly as a local passenger. That or the departing country's check-in clerk makes a mistake and allows you to board the flight to Taiwan, the transit ban is not necessarily enforced once you land in Taiwan.

This information is inaccurate. First of all transit flights to China was never allowed by the Taiwan authorities. But more importantly all transits were banned (still ongoing) due to the May 2021 Alpha outbreak in Taiwan.

The PRC consulate in Bangkok gave me approval to try Thailand transit if it was a business trip. This wouldn't have been cheaper than 857 (at the time) though. IIRC, BKK-CSX wasn't nearly as expensive as BKK-PVG. You would need to spend 2+ weeks in Thailand...not a deal-breaker for me, but this could be an issue for people with tight schedules.

I’m sure the 3 weeks in a Changsha hotel quarantine is a primo China experience.

Ok I stand corrected. The info I posted is old, and I'm unable to find anything newer.

My current plan (if I do leave China to go to the US) is to fly from the US to Taiwan first, endure quarantine, and stay for a couple of weeks. Then I'll fly to Shanghai and endure more quarantine. TW quarantine is 10 days now and I can get a place with a yard so that'll be bearable. Also flying from TW I won't need to get blood drawn or get an antigen test. Just a PCR test.

You might be a bit confused. The blood test is to check for antibodies (as a result of vaccination or a previous infection, presumably), PCR and antigen tests typically (but not always) use a nasal swab, with the PCR test being more expensive, often slower, and generally more accurate.

I think when they implemented the 7 day before the flight testing requirement they got rid of the blood test for those who are vaxed with the Chinese vaccines. Folks vaccinated with the western ones still need the blood test.

I know this is the case flying from the US. Flying from Taiwan, I think only a PCR test within 72 hours is required.

So, after a month of stress and worry, this morning I finally got my green hdc code....this evening I fly LHR to Helsinki, 17 hour lay over for more tests and then on to Shanghai....2 SinoVac shots, 2 Moderna shots, numerous PCR tests and how ever long in quarrantine or isolation in both Shanghai and Handan will be worth it to see my wife again....

They're not confused. You don't know about China's entry requirements. They require antibody testing.

I personally admit that I am confused by the vast barrage of tests we have to endure. It doesn't really matter though; the specific rules change frequently and "doing what you're told" is a fact of life. My most unpleasant test to date was the nasal swab on day-3 of quarantine (she reached a part of my nose that I didn't know existed). I'm now completely fine with blood tests.

Flight path on 24 February 2022 from CDG -> ICN: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/...852Z/LFPG/RKSI (9hr 54min)
Flight path on 28 February 2022 from CDG -> ICN: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/...825Z/LFPG/RKSI (12hr 14min)

Adds a little over 2 hours. I can't see the distance on this website but looks like the 77W can make it without a problem.

Starting Monday, March 14th, passengers entering China from Korea will require an antigen test, in addition to PCR. I think Korea is the only country besides the US now to require this extra test.

关于自仁川机场赴华乘客增加1次登机前快速抗原检测的通知
(Chinese embassy in Korea only has Korean and Chinese)

Not directly related to China, but:

Korea drops quarantine requirement for fully vaccinated travelers. Effective March 21 for those vaccinated and registered in Korea system; effective April 1 for all vaccinated, whether registered or not.

It's China related in that more and more countries are opening up, including neighboring countries.

They are opening up, because they now [suddenly in some cases] have so many cases themselves (S. Korea is at ~300'000/day), it seems futile to still require quarantine. New Zealand did the same thing.
China hasn't got many cases, so they won't open up, IMO. In fact, the more the gap is between other countries count, and China's, the more likely they'll increase quarantine.
Of course.....this will all change if/when the cases start skyrocketing in China also....

Lol Hong Kong still doesn't care, see the Hong Kong thread (flight bans still continue).

Cases are still increasing in mainland China though, we shall see..

It appears that Shanghai is now approaching "bad" status in terms of case numbers. And, the effects are starting to show. For example, both JA Kerry Centre and Reel Plaza were locked down last night. Furthermore, if any of us fancy going to Zhejiang, we need to quarantine there. Finally, some of the international schools here have implemented insanely intense testing regimens (e.g. 2 tests per day of various flavors).

I got a message from someone that today's case count in China for symptomatic and asymptomatic is over 1000? Could that be right?

https://weekly.chinacdc.cn/news/Trac...htm#NHC22Mar11

March 11, 2022
Confirmed: 555 new, 5,024 current.
Asymptomatic: 814 new, 3,972 current.
Recoveries: 141 new. Deaths: 0 new.

Yeah it’s over 1000/day. I think there were 1100 new cases yesterday. Anyhow, it seems to have come to shanghai so I’m kind of dreading being here for the next few weeks of what I’m sure will be numerous nose jabs and few opportunities to enjoy myself.

Well, we better brace ourselves, is what I am predicting: the next few weeks might get real brutal...and not only in Shanghai.

Upon checking into my Shanghai quarrantine hotel this afternoon I was suprised to be told I'd be released after 14 days if tested negative to continue my journey back to Handan, I was expecting to have to do another 7 days somewhere in Shanghai....