Oh. :(
Thanks very much for the info. I hope those circumstances/conditions will have relaxed by the time I re-enter China, likely around October/November 2022...
Doesn't sound like fun as it is right now.
(The highlight of my whole late 2021 arrival experience was the 3rd week in Shanghai.)

I am seriously considering to cancel my upcoming trip to China in summer.

I have the best airfare deal: 35K saver Y award each way on United, and expect to get upgraded to J (the return PVG-SFO already cleared).

But this kind of forced quarantine 14+7+.... is pushing the limit. The Kingdom is testing my tolerance. Although I have 2 cell phones and should have the green code on the second phone, I wonder if I risk arrest should I use the 2nd phone to go out of hotel when the 1st phone shows yellow code.

No fun to travel inside China with this massive paranoid and arbitrary detention (quarantine) when a city has ONE case.

Not to mention this stupid 7-day self quarantine at departure city SFO required by the PRC Consulate. Whose idea? Seriously?

I fully anticipate that most of the world would open, Europe, S. America, and most of Asia. How long will China's zero COVID policy continue?

Planning a spring break trip to SIN and Thailand next month, I am very excited.

The trip to China in summer becomes more and more dreadful.

Compared to 2021:

• A lot of South America had quarantine (Bolivia 10 days, Argentina 7 days, Chile 10 days, Uruguay 14 days, Ecuador 10 days, Peru 14 days, etc). Those have all been dropped.
• Europe has been open since last summer with no quarantine.
• A lot of countries in South/East/Southeast Asia are opening up, see post #150 and beyond. https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/asia...opened-11.html
• Australia announced today that they are opening the border to tourists. The self isolation procedures vary by state but are not that bad. For example for NSW (Sydney) you just need to self isolate until a rapid antigen test comes back, and then take another test on day 6.
• New Zealand is supposed to open in October 2022? Who knows. https://covid19.govt.nz/internationa...-borders-open/
• If one gets a Gold Card for Taiwan they can enter (with quarantine etc), but they just pushed back the processing date for new applications from today (2/7) to 2/28 at the earliest. https://goldcard.nat.gov.tw/en/news/...-announcement/
• Can't get into Hong Kong

Taiwan CDC also just announced they are reviewing quarantine procedures with an eye to reduce to 10 days in March, While not leading the pack, there is some movement in the right direction.

I recommend to DEFINITELY hang on to that flight until the last minute.
Should there be less restrictions by summer (unlikely, but possible), there will be 50x more flights flying, and 1000x more people wanting to suddenly go.
I recommend to DEFINITELY hang on to that flight until the last minute!

Yes I will.

Not easy to get saver Y awards for both outbound and return at 35K each. It's always 150K-250K each way.

It took many tries to find a small window when UA releases T class so I could request agent to convert to XN.

Clearing to J using PP is unbelievable deal as typical J award is 350K-400K each way!

Why bother if you have no business reasons ( likely won’t be the reasons for me to make the jump) or significant personal reasons to do so?

Taking advantage of a saver Y award with upgrade is not a reason to make the trip. It is not just the quarantine, travel restrictions and testings before, during and after the trip, there is not much going on to “enjoy” during your visit unless you have family here.

I had ten PCR tests between Jan 7 and Feb 7 during my monthly long “journey” from DC to Beijing, and most of the time except for 2 days at the beginning and 2 days at the end were in quarantine.

I had promised to visit my 93 years-old in-law in Shanghai, because his children in the US are unable to obtain Chinese visa to visit him for more than 2 years.

I also have relatives and friends in China, and that's why I was granted RP for family visits.

No business in China for me. I don't like to work anyway.

My last trip to China lasted 13 month (2020-2021). I toured more than half of the country (23 provinces to be exact) and really enjoyed it.

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...ce964d7189.gif


I only had a total of TWO PCR tests: one after landing at PVG, one near the end of 14-day quarantine. Zero PCR tests for more than a year.

But things get ugly now in China....... People in the Kingdom, encouraged by the authority, are just so paranoid and irrational about COVID.

Can anyone please share any info on the procedure if foreign resident (work permit visa) tests positive either in quarantine/isolation or by random surveillance test out in the wild? I’ve looked around but not really found much current info. Are you immediately admitted to a hospital or like in US you can stay home? Thanks

Used to be STRAIGHT to hospital (they picked you up under tight security)....not sure if still current info though.
(Not experienced personally....touch wood...)

You will go to the Covid hospital until your body shows no traces of Covid on their super sensitive PCR tests twice in a row. This could take 2 weeks or many months but until you get these 2 tests you’re stuck in the Covid hospital. Usually shared room with other Covid positive foreigners. Once you clear the 2 Covid tests you’re sent back to regular quarantine hotel for 3 weeks normal quarantine before you’re released.

This is in Shanghai, usually the most “liberal” place when it comes to Covid restrictions. I’d add a few weeks of quarantine to that timeline if anywhere else in China. So testing positive gets you anywhere from 6 weeks to half a year in basically what is jail.

can you request exit from China if tested positive (assuming some carrier is willing to take you)

i just can’t see them letting you roam free at PVG. You’re in it for however long it takes to be considered not a Covid risk.

This, although I thought it was 3 tests. I have one friend of a friend who had this happen during his arrival quarantine, and 2 months later he finally got cleared enough to just fly home and erase China from his life.

Testing positive for covid is about like being convicted of a moderate crime in China. Somewhere between dealing drugs and vehicular manslaughter. And a nice duffel bag of RMB can get you out of those but not out of a covid positive test.

Heard something similar. Until it happens to someone who you know it is hard for people to understand the consequence of being test positive in China. If there is no reason of being in China, go somewhere that you can enjoy yourself. A social visit may lead to a few months of unnecessary stress.

Thanks for all the input. I’ve been concerned about the positive test procedures/hospital requirements and even tho the current transmission is low the repercussions are harsh. If anyone has other comments or resources I’d appreciate hearing them. Please post or you’re welcome to PM. Thanks again.

I did see a post a while back about an Italian foreign resident who was allowed to finish quarantine/isolation (not a positive case afaik) at the Italian Embassy, I think it was on FT. I wondered if the Embassy/Consulates are of any help.

Thirteen months and no pilgrimage to WUH?

Well, he did make it to Zhengzhou and Changsha, which are kind of the same as Wuhan in my book. I guess I kind of like Changsha though.

For some reason I skipped WUH. Maybe a little bit psychological.

I did visited CGO, CSX and LYA, Changde 常德, Hengyang 衡阳 and Zhangjiajie 张家界.

My most favorite places in China are Shanghai, Nanjing, Hangzhou, Fuzhou, Chengdu, Chongqing and Sanya.

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...6338e152bd.jpg

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...aed667f559.jpg

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...4a9fb1cb5d.jpg

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...93e0b23e20.jpg

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...a3ee07b2c9.jpg

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...e7dee393d2.jpg



You folks really should visit Zhangjiajie 张家界 in western Hunan Province. The scenic views are stunning.

Ugh, jealous! Great photos. It's on my list...

My optimistic hope is that I can get into either Taiwan or Hong Kong by the end of the year.

Well surprisingly Paxlovid was approved: https://www.reuters.com/business/hea...id-2022-02-12/
And the BioNTech vaccine still isn't.

The Global Times is still trying to put a positive spin on it but to me it's a positive sign that the narrative is starting to shift away from the existing status quo. Like I said last year they will really start to feel the pressure if every other country drops restrictions, which started to happen in summer 2021 but then stopped because of Omicron.

It also doesn't look like Hong Kong can maintain Covid Zero any longer so that might open up too.

Apples and oranges. They haven't been touting any China-developed antivirals, so there isn't really a loss-of-face element.

I skimmed a Global Times article on Paxlovid (probably the same one you referred to), and my recollection was that there will (almost) no changes to the "zero-Covid" policies as a result of its introduction here, but that they are hopeful that it will reduce strain on the medical system (e.g. by preventing infections from advancing to critical stages).

Further reinforces my understanding of Chinese socialism medical policy - if it isn't available for everyone, it's not available to anyone.
All or nothing.

In some ways I understand the reasons behind this - medical policy is perhaps not one of the areas where "you want to let some people get rich first".
Especially during a pandemic.
A bit like NHS in the UK, but in the socialism with Chinese characteristics sort of way.

But then again that "national standard" level is not something I'm happy with.
This was something that weighed on my mind against moving to Mainland permanently when I racked up enough public firm experience to get my CPA/CA.

They are launching vaccine passports for international travel and slowly allowing people to renew passports. The Pfizer meds are also another sign.

I think zero Covid is hurting them more than they are letting on now and I’d expect the media to transition over to a more “we need to live with it” message over the next 6 months culminating in some sort of managed opening after the big October conference. The nomenklatura is getting restless and misses their waits for LV bags on the Champs Elysees. It’s not the same feeling buying your bag in Xujiahui or Xidan.

Fosun (BioNtech) could have easily been available to all. At the risk of drifting into conspiracy-laden waters, I'll stop there.

Do you know whether that agreement is only about the ancestral strain vaccine or would it include the currently under development Omicron specific vaccine?

That's a bit of a moot point but if they had been cranking out product for the past year, I'm guessing the upgrade would have been approved without issue.

I agree with everything you stated, but to wait until after October can mean 2022 is gone. We all know implementation takes time. For example, airlines won't have all the staff ready on moments of notice after almost three years of hiatus. Many have been laid off.
It is really frustrating. Hong Kong is probably worse with its lower vaccination rate, lack of infrastructure for mass testing and adverse to change mentality.

I've not contributed to this discussion so far because I still had a spouse and cat trapped in HK but they're now free and will touch down in Bangkok in about 20 minutes. Having spent the Great Plague in both Shenzhen (Aug 2020 - March 2021) and HK (March 2020 - August 2020 + March 2021 - Dec 2021) I can say that day to day life in Shenzhen was a lot more normal than in HK with pretty much no mask wearing by locals or foreigners in Shenzhen (apart from on the metro) and all the bars, restaurants, shops, gyms, and services open and operating as normal in Futian. HK, on the other hand, suffers from the ever-present risk of arbitrary detention in Penny's Bay (yup, I was rounded up and incarcerated for bizarre, spurious reasons) and random, inconsistent rule changes which have got even worse since I escaped at the end of December.

I also think that HK's covid quarantine policy is worse and more debilitating than the mainland making it more isolated from the rest of the world even taking the mainland's challenging visa requirements into account. We had planned on living in HK until at least August this year and possibly another two years after that. After my experience since last March with the administration there, I will never return. Ever. What's happened to HK (and, as we're on Flyertalk, by extension Cathay) is a tragedy but at some point you have to move on from past experience.

In addition to Hong Kong's low vaccination rate, it surely has a bigger fraction of its residents who are elderly and therefore at higher risk of death from a COVID-19 infection compared to Shenzhen.

And from what I know, it's precisely these elderly HKers who haven't gotten vaccinated (I avoid making judgment by using the word "refuse").

Following is my current assessment:
1. Any determined individual can score an RP; this won't cost more than $750
2. Even if you hate UA, book 857 (hopefully for $2k instead of $6k)
-there is a reason why XMN costs less

This drill honestly does cost $10k, even if 857 fares drop.

But, if you have the stomach for it, make it happen!

Ok since you’ve discussed this several times before I’ll take the bait. Assume someone is a US citizen currently outside China with no relatives in China and no job in China and no intention to work in China and has no existing visa and no existing residence permit. They only want to go there as a tourist and are willing to pay whatever fee is necessary including quarantine. Also assume this person is ridiculously stubborn as they are on FT.

How do they get a residence permit? You know an agent who can get a PU Letter for a job that doesn’t exist (and that this hypothetical person doesn’t even want to do, except for on paper)? And can shortcut the line in front of all the English teachers and other people applying for legitimate jobs?

Thanks in advance.

On a separate note there are signs that students might be let back in (only a very very very small handful of schools have been able to issue visas since March 2020, the rest of the students are doing online classes in their home countries at odd hours).

https://www.studyinternational.com/n...rean-students/

Some particularly motivated person mentioned above might gamble on a Fall 2022 school program to get in.

I honestly think you’re dreaming if you think any “determined person” can get a RP for $750.

Once you are in China, maybe, maybe you can get RP for $750. I trust moondog as he is most resourceful.

My question is, how do you enter China as a US citizen? Even if you have family members in China, you are unlikely to get a visa.

Can you get a work visa without an actual job?

For the cost, the lowest RT fare SFO-PVG-SFO would be around $4K-5K. Yes, the drill will cost $10K if you stay in China for 3 months.

The "moondog-$750-special" is likely of somewhat dubious nature, that may work.....sort of.
Likely start your own company (probably in Shanghai), then get a Visa to visit and set-up said company?

They aren’t handing these out anymore. People are setting up companies to stay now and getting visas valid for 3 months as the PSB wants to see profits before granting a year long visa.

$750 for a work permit based 1 year RP attained through an agent’s dodgy methods was possible pre 2020 for people already here. Now it is impossible and it will be impossible from this point forward. China is using Covid to strengthen its immigration policy as well.

No they cannot. They need to prove residency in the country of departure just like everyone else.

However, note that some jurisdictions do allow non-residents to fly to China after a certain period of time has passed. For example, the Seoul Embassy will issue a green code to anyone who has stayed in Korea for over 30 days.