Safety in China
#16

Join Date: Jan 2013
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Obviously the OP is trying to make the best decision based on the info he HAS. Of course he'd like to know the host better but that's not an option.
I spent quite a few years of my childhood in Wuhan, and I agree with previous comments the intentional harms are unlikely. Especially in populous areas like Wuchang. A foreigner is LESS likely to be kidnapped for obvious reasons.
Do check out the female host carefully. If she's a college student, then go for it. If she's a street merchant, avoid. Understand what her motivation is to be your son's guide! What would she get in return? IF that's not clear to you, pay extra attention. Practicing English isn't a bad reason, especially if she's a student.
Have a contact with a Chinese phone access who your son can call then you should be golden.
I spent quite a few years of my childhood in Wuhan, and I agree with previous comments the intentional harms are unlikely. Especially in populous areas like Wuchang. A foreigner is LESS likely to be kidnapped for obvious reasons.
Do check out the female host carefully. If she's a college student, then go for it. If she's a street merchant, avoid. Understand what her motivation is to be your son's guide! What would she get in return? IF that's not clear to you, pay extra attention. Practicing English isn't a bad reason, especially if she's a student.
Have a contact with a Chinese phone access who your son can call then you should be golden.
#17
Original Poster




Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 371
I can see how some of you may have been misled by my language. Was simply trying to explain that there were very good reasons to have Mark explore Wuhan. I wasn't seeking your opinions about what to do in particular but rather was asking about Wuhan. It appears that there are not portions of Wuhan that are extremely dangerous such as different parts of Los Angeles, Chicago or Cincinnati. Having been informed of that, it is my responsibility to make the best decision for Mark, how to investigate the student and how to deal with his relatives. I still haven't made my decision.
I was merely trying to be polite to people who spent their time answering my questions by giving the background. Obviously, I made a mistake by giving the context in the manner that I did.
I was merely trying to be polite to people who spent their time answering my questions by giving the background. Obviously, I made a mistake by giving the context in the manner that I did.
#18
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How did you come to know the potential 23-year-old English speaking guide? Did you advertise? Did she advertise? Is she somehow connected to your son's school in Wuhan?
#20
Original Poster




Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 371
In answer to several people who have questions about me questioning the relatives. An underlying dynamic here that I didn't mention in the interest of keeping my original post reasonably short (in addition to the safety issue) is that the relatives are very frugal and think that I am wasting my money by spending it for a guide. They are sometimes over protective of me, and this is part of the issue. Additionally, when they do take Mark out, they feel obligated to give him gifts. Several days ago he was taken shopping and not understanding the economics of the situation, he asked for and received an expensive shirt. (Gifts to children are the one area where the family is not always frugal.) I want to avoid that situation, and would like him to go shopping with the guide and be spending my money.
To Msp & UA: I found the guide on a Wuhan expatriate site where I placed an ad. She is a college student, who has been very forthright and generous so far. She even offered to leave her Ipad with Mark for the duration of his visit.
To JimA: The relatives live in towers with basically no children Mark's age. Before we visited I was hoping that he would be able to meet neighborhood children. So far, he has not met, and I did not see one boy his age. One advantage of the guide is that she has 2 nephews Mark's age and would introduce Mark to the nephews.
To make clear to all again. I have merely sought insights about China and Wuhan. I have to do what is best for Mark by evaluating the information that I have.
To Msp & UA: I found the guide on a Wuhan expatriate site where I placed an ad. She is a college student, who has been very forthright and generous so far. She even offered to leave her Ipad with Mark for the duration of his visit.
To JimA: The relatives live in towers with basically no children Mark's age. Before we visited I was hoping that he would be able to meet neighborhood children. So far, he has not met, and I did not see one boy his age. One advantage of the guide is that she has 2 nephews Mark's age and would introduce Mark to the nephews.
To make clear to all again. I have merely sought insights about China and Wuhan. I have to do what is best for Mark by evaluating the information that I have.
Last edited by DaileyB; Jun 9, 2013 at 7:03 am Reason: clarification
#21
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Join Date: Nov 2009
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As an ethnic Chinese educated and worked/business overseas I can understand your position better than other posters. This is just major cultural clash with family who has never left China and the different valuation everyone exhibits over goods and services.
If you feel comfortable with the student then I would definitely get Mark out to immerse in the real China. The phone idea is great and there are other methods to keep in touch with him. Seems like he knows what to do when he encounters difficulties.
I have a similar situation: I am dishonouring the family if I don't stay at the "homestead" when I am in HK for business or pleasure.
I am 55+ and my aunt has always been protective of the extended family. When I head out to social/business dinner or evening out she would always: "don't stay out too late, we will worry about you, so don't keep us up all night!"
I now stay with close friends for a few days before doing the family visit when I am in HK.
We had to make up an extended family trip to Macau excuse to basically stayed at Hotel on Kowloon side for a few days to give my son and daughter a experience of real night life in HK before LKF.
- Some will not pay and extra Yuan or walk an extra mile for a better bowl of noodles.
- There is an unwritten Confucian tradition of taking care of younger relatives in your care and make sure no harm comes their way.
- Chinese (most Asians) are very protective of the children; they hover around so much that the term "Helicopter Parenting" was coined. A story of a parents accompanying their university age offspring to China for a summer internship made front page in HK.
If you feel comfortable with the student then I would definitely get Mark out to immerse in the real China. The phone idea is great and there are other methods to keep in touch with him. Seems like he knows what to do when he encounters difficulties.
I have a similar situation: I am dishonouring the family if I don't stay at the "homestead" when I am in HK for business or pleasure.
I am 55+ and my aunt has always been protective of the extended family. When I head out to social/business dinner or evening out she would always: "don't stay out too late, we will worry about you, so don't keep us up all night!"
I now stay with close friends for a few days before doing the family visit when I am in HK.We had to make up an extended family trip to Macau excuse to basically stayed at Hotel on Kowloon side for a few days to give my son and daughter a experience of real night life in HK before LKF.
Last edited by tentseller; Jun 9, 2013 at 9:02 am
#22
Join Date: May 2004
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I know this is NOT what you are asking, but...
By the way, the 'amazing China experience' you want your son to have is probably to learn about real Chinese culture -- and that will come far more by living with real Chinese people, not rock climbing or taking photos with a Nikon or some other branded digital camera. And since the guide will speak English, how will it improve your son's Chinese language skills?
These arrangements sound like a summer camp/excursion in a city, with an English-speaking (local) babysitter. That can take place in any part of the world. It doesn't have to be in Wuhan. And from reading your threads about this summer trip for your son, I am certain he doesn't need to polish his English.
I think by the end of the day, what you need to ask yourself is what you REALLY want to accomplish by sending Mark to Wuhan this summer? And how to best reach those goals? I thought it was spending time with his (Chinese) families, studying the language (Mandarin), and immersed in the local culture. IMHO, that's not bundled with spending time with a 23-year-old college girl speaking English, no matter how good, generous and willing she is.
Before sending Mark to Wuhan, you've already known the language barrier between him and his Chinese relatives. I doubt you'll see any significant improvement in English from your Chinese relatives for the years to come. But they will always be Mark's extended family, if you want Mark to stay connected with families from his mother's side. I say learning how to successfully communicate with relatives that can't do English shall be a good part of Mark's "enrichment curricula" while in China. There's a much better chance for Mark to speak good Mandarin to the relatives in the future.

Anyone can, and will get bored when surrounded by people who don't speak a common language. You know your son well and how he can handle himself. That's a big plus for both of you. If I were you, I would think of some ways for my kid to overcome those cultural and language obstacles and really take advantage of those 5 weeks to experience China. Kids pick up languages much faster and easier than adults. When they know they need to speak the local language in order to survive and/or not get bored, they will learn the language in a heartbeat.
Spending more than a decade of my adulthood living in the States, I don't learn about American culture by speaking Chinese to my fellow Taiwanese. I tried my best to watch local TV/news programs, read books/magazines/newspapers, and speak English as much as I possibly could. I have American friends that showed me their local cultures. Some eventually become my best friends. I am not saying your son will be able to make a BFF from China in 5 weeks. However, to spend every possible moment in Chinese with Chinese people/relatives will definitely help him "see" China. That's probably one of the best ways to experience cultural shocks.

Additionally, when they do take Mark out, they feel obligated to give him gifts. Several days ago he was taken shopping and not understanding the economics of the situation, he asked for and received an expensive shirt. (Gifts to children are the one area where the family is not always frugal.) I want to avoid that situation, and would like him to go shopping with the guide and be spending my money.
Last edited by lin821; Jun 11, 2013 at 2:33 am Reason: typo
#23
Original Poster




Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 371
Tentseller really nailed it. The aunt and uncle have never been out of China and are very frugal and protective.
To Lin821: You make a number of good points. However, my deal with my son was that he was supposed to have fun in China his way and that if he got bored I would bring him back early. I will keep the deal. Right now he goes to an International School in the morning, and on nearly all afternoons there is nothing for him to do. I feel it is a real shame that his afternoons are all being wasted. His aunt and uncle are in their 60s, don't speak English and are not real good at entertaining children. Also, as I said before, there are virtually no children in the complex where my son is staying. If you have any particular ideas as to how to find more activities for my son, I am happy to listen
To Lin821: You make a number of good points. However, my deal with my son was that he was supposed to have fun in China his way and that if he got bored I would bring him back early. I will keep the deal. Right now he goes to an International School in the morning, and on nearly all afternoons there is nothing for him to do. I feel it is a real shame that his afternoons are all being wasted. His aunt and uncle are in their 60s, don't speak English and are not real good at entertaining children. Also, as I said before, there are virtually no children in the complex where my son is staying. If you have any particular ideas as to how to find more activities for my son, I am happy to listen
#24
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What's so terrible about being bored for a few afternoons? Can't he read a book?
#25
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Tentseller really nailed it. The aunt and uncle have never been out of China and are very frugal and protective.
To Lin821: You make a number of good points. However, my deal with my son was that he was supposed to have fun in China his way and that if he got bored I would bring him back early. I will keep the deal. Right now he goes to an International School in the morning, and on nearly all afternoons there is nothing for him to do. I feel it is a real shame that his afternoons are all being wasted. His aunt and uncle are in their 60s, don't speak English and are not real good at entertaining children. Also, as I said before, there are virtually no children in the complex where my son is staying. If you have any particular ideas as to how to find more activities for my son, I am happy to listen
To Lin821: You make a number of good points. However, my deal with my son was that he was supposed to have fun in China his way and that if he got bored I would bring him back early. I will keep the deal. Right now he goes to an International School in the morning, and on nearly all afternoons there is nothing for him to do. I feel it is a real shame that his afternoons are all being wasted. His aunt and uncle are in their 60s, don't speak English and are not real good at entertaining children. Also, as I said before, there are virtually no children in the complex where my son is staying. If you have any particular ideas as to how to find more activities for my son, I am happy to listen
#26
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,452
Plan A had been to find same age neighbours. OP is now at Plan B...
One obvious thing to check: the boy is at an international school in the morning. Has he found any friends at the said international school, who could hang out with him after school?
In any case, hiring the 23 year old girl with nephews included sounds even better than plan A. Whether hanging out with same age neighbours from the house or same age international school friends, this would have meant foreign child/ren without any adult guide/chaperone responsible to care for them. So getting him into a family with a young aunt hired to help/huide the bunch would seem safer.
#27


Join Date: Dec 2007
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I don't want to plough in again, since as I said, it's not my call. However, all I can say is if my nieces or nephew was entrusted to my care for the summer, if then, I get 'remote instructions' that override my sense of responsibility to the child (not talking about right or wrong here -- we all have certain pre-judgements/ values, and that's what makes cultural exchange both interesting and frustrating at times) -- it would really, really upset me.
And more importantly, likely jeopardise future such trips. OP needs to be clear what the purpose of this trip was, and what his relationship with his in-laws is likely to be going forward.
Living with one's extended family can be frustrating, boring, argument filled etc, but the reason we do it is because of our implicit trust, and love.
tb
And more importantly, likely jeopardise future such trips. OP needs to be clear what the purpose of this trip was, and what his relationship with his in-laws is likely to be going forward.
Living with one's extended family can be frustrating, boring, argument filled etc, but the reason we do it is because of our implicit trust, and love.
tb
#28
Original Poster




Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 371
TB I will use this response to you to hopefully put an end to this thread. If anyone has suggestions, they can send a private message. The purpose of the trip was to have Mark enjoy China so that he would want to come back later and see family members who live very far away. Just talked to him and he is discouraged in that he spends too much time cooped up inside and says that when he is out the uncle won't let him get more than 10 feet away. The longer it goes on like this, the less likely Mark will want to visit China in the future. There are many other things he could be doing. For instance, next week there is a Boy Scout camp that he absolutely loved last year. Sorry he will probably miss it this year, but there is some chance he may be home by then.
Mark, has done very well in just about all ways imaginable. Straight As the last 3 years. Many friends. Teachers love him. I understand the family's motivations and fears come from a good place. Yet, I am the ultimate decision maker (and so far things have been going pretty well) for what is best for Mark. If the family feels that they cannot in good conscience let Mark explore Wuhan, then the family should not be taking care of Mark, and it is time for me to bring him home under my direct responsibility.
TB your response comes from exactly the same place as the uncle's. The ultimate question is: whose judgment is correct? [Is Wuhan in the afternoon with a guide unsafe?], and if no agreement can be reached on an important matter then it is time for the child to come home. I appreciate where you are coming from, but disagree with your conclusion.
Mark, has done very well in just about all ways imaginable. Straight As the last 3 years. Many friends. Teachers love him. I understand the family's motivations and fears come from a good place. Yet, I am the ultimate decision maker (and so far things have been going pretty well) for what is best for Mark. If the family feels that they cannot in good conscience let Mark explore Wuhan, then the family should not be taking care of Mark, and it is time for me to bring him home under my direct responsibility.
TB your response comes from exactly the same place as the uncle's. The ultimate question is: whose judgment is correct? [Is Wuhan in the afternoon with a guide unsafe?], and if no agreement can be reached on an important matter then it is time for the child to come home. I appreciate where you are coming from, but disagree with your conclusion.
#30




Join Date: May 2008
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I'd like to add that practicing Chinese with his family would allow him to actually get real experience. Honestly, I've encountered too many students learning Chinese in large classes who have horrible tones because the class is too big for the teacher to correct all the students.
If your son has a decent foundation, it might prove useful to encourage interaction with the relatives.
If your son has a decent foundation, it might prove useful to encourage interaction with the relatives.




