Jamoldo

Yeah - it pretty much means hooker. However, I was told this back in 2005, upon my first trip to China, though I've used the term selectively to get giggles from waitresses and loud laughs from guys. Definitely depends on the situation but one can use the foreigner card here, if one wants to.

FWIW, I've never said "美女“ to a waitress or anyone like that...

tauphi

Heh, I've heard exactly the opposite -- that it's more of a taboo in the south, i.e., Shenzhen/Guangzhou where this particular meaning originated. Of course there's also the suggestion there of substituting it with 靚女, the Cantonese equivalent of 美女.

Honestly I don't buy this taboo story as I still hear it used everywhere in the non-derogatory sense.

moondog

My friends in BJ are about as non-PC as you could possibly imagine, but they have banished "xiaojie" from their vernacular. I'm fine with the 美女 thing; never fails to generate a smile.

anacapamalibu

Xiaojie means miss or young lady. Its also appropriate to reference a female server, such as in a restaurant, as xiaojie. "surname" +xiaojie = miss "surname".

It was originally considered a derogatory name in south China, however with the
spread of mandarin its no longer considered offensive.

Its considerably more appropriate than Moondog's suggestion of
meinu which translates to " hey ...good looking".

PTravel

My wife would probably like that.

I've not been clear on xiaojie. I knew it meant "miss," and I used to use it in restaurants to get a waitress' attention. My wife told me it had a slang connotation, but I still hear it used quite often. Aside from the street meaning, is using "xiaojie" like using "garcon" (literally, "boy") in a restaurant in France?

anacapamalibu

It does have a slang connotation, depends on the context. Such as
"Xiaojie, yao bu yao". Meaning.. you want a "girl"?

moondog

I can guarantee you no waitress will ever give you lip about meinu. In fact, it makes them happy. If all FTers were to adopt the same policy, our image would
improve greatly... and you might get a chance to hook up with a hot waitress (assuming you're not attached; I am so I'm trying my best to behave like a boy scout during this trip).

anacapamalibu

Not if you are in the company of a date, girlfriend , or wife.

tauphi

Or if the target of the call has a boyfriend with Triad connections

mntblue

^^^

I started this thread but missed all the fun till now. Most of the servers did not explain the options when they presented me with the DCC receipts. I just signed and did not pick either options. They will then default to DCC. Sometimes they will even try to trick me into consenting the DCC options.

At the Shangri-la, a place I trusted. I was told that I should pick the option to "lock in the exchange rate right away", which is technically true, except for the fact that RMB exchange rate fluctuation could never justify the 5% hidden surcharge above the interbank rate.

I now just use my UnionPay card everywhere. I will convert to RMB when I want to at a rate I want to.

mnredfox

So despite China being way behind many other places in the world like Europe, Japan, Singapore, etc regarding credit cards, the ability to use foreign credit cards is slowly growing which adds convenience and SOMETIMES a better deal (esp vs exchanging money the old fashioned way). BUT, if you're not careful you may end up paying more when using your CC not just because of your bank's foreign transaction fee, but what I am calling the "great CC rip off".

This "rip off" is one of my biggest beef's about using CC's in China, so I thought I would share my frustrations as well as my tips for all of those who may read this thread.

For the places (shops, restaurants, TA's, hotels, etc) that accept foreign credit cards (Visa, MC, Discover, Amex, etc), they all use credit card machines (as like in the US). Each place carries its financial transactions with one of the main Chinese banks (Bank of China, CCB, ICBC, etc) and thus uses that banks CC machine.

Now, when you hand your card over to be swiped and when the CC machine sees that your card is a foreign card, it will usually automatically charge you in your local currency. In other words, the local Chinese bank (say BOC) will charge your bank (say Schwab bank) in USD (if you're American) for that particular transaction. Nothing wrong with that, EXCEPT that the Chinese banks give you a horrible exchange rate. Recently, with 1 USD ~ 6.67RMB the "rip off rate" has been around 6.4.

How can you tell they are doing this?

1. You can confirm after the fact by asking your bank whether it was charged in RMB or your local currency. This is how I discovered it. For me, all transactions charged in RMB to my bank are listed in RMB on my account statement and also show the conversion to USD (my bank as all should gives you nearly market rates, so again around 6.67 as of late).

2. On the CC receipt you sign, there will be text that says something to the effect of: "I declare that I have been offered a choice of payment currencies and my choice is final. I understand that the currency conversion is not provided by VISA." (or insert proper CC). Further more, you will see the total listed in RMB, you will also see a rate given, and the amount in your local currency (again USD for me).

Why is this so sneaky?

1. Most people don't watch their statements carefully or receipts they sign only looking for the total amount, so most foreigners doubtfully even know about this.

2. Almost all of the CC machines in China will automatically convert to your local currency for you, in appearance as a service to your bank. Really, it is a disservice to you as it is a "rip off."

3. Most importantly, nearly 95% of the cases the hotels/restaurants etc don't know this is happening, so if you try to tell them you want to be charged in RMB, they will claim that they are charging you in RMB (which to them is true - so really it isn't that the hotel is ripping you off, it is the banks. The place which is accepting the CC is really the innocent party).

4. It sometimes can be a hassle to get charged properly in RMB. In which case, foreigners are likely to just say "forget it" and pay the few extra bucks. The problem is multiply this on a mass scale and for every transaction, and the Chinese banks are making loads off foreigners.

How do I make sure I don't get ripped off?

1. When giving them your card, tell them you want to charge in RMB. In Chinese it's "我要刷人民币“ (wo yao shua renminbi). Again, keep in mind that about 95% of the desk clerks, waiters, etc already think they are doing this, so they will not properly select the function on the CC machine. In which case, this will get slightly more challenging as it is likely they don't know how to use their CC machine.

2. If they come back with a receipt to sign that has the text about "I declare I have been offered a choice..." and it shows a conversion rate and your local currency, DO NOT SIGN IT. Tell them it is charging you USD and that they should cancel it. This will take a lot of patience and grace, as these people actually think they are charging you in RMB (which is their intention, again they don't know of the Chinese bank rip off).

3. Tell them there is a function on their CC machine to not convert the currency. If the machine is simple, you are in luck. Some machines for instance have a function titled 转换(zhuan huan) which essentially means "transform" and they can simply select the "opt out" function. Others, are more difficult. Then you may be in for a fun time. So at this point, tell them simply that you don't want to convert to USD

我不要兑换人民币。我也不要汇率 （wo bu yao duihuan renminbi. wo ye bu yao huilu) - meaning I don't want to exchange RMB, and I don't want an exchange rate.

If you can't read Chinese, you'll likely be SOL trying to help them with the machine. And if you can't speak Chinese, you're also likely SOL as despite many of the Chinese workers at restaurants/hotels know English, good luck trying to explain this complex problem to them (I have enough troubles explaining in Chinese). But hope is not all lost. Go to step 4.

4. Kindly ask them to call their bank for help. Or ask for a manager and have the manager call the bank for help. Again, these people will honestly think they are charging your RMB so they are likely to get frustrated with you and think you're crazy (trust me, I've had this happen more often than not). When they call their bank, they will very likely be able to get it figured out and in the end realize what is going on. Keep in mind, EVERY MACHINE HAS SUCH FUNCTION.

5. When the correct function is selected, the receipt will not have the text about "I declare I have been offered a choice" and will not have anything listed about an exchange rate or your local currency. It will simply list RMB. Now you're good, as they Chinese bank will charge your bank RMB, and your bank will give you a market conversion rate from RMB.

6. Make sure you are kind and patient, this will require patience. But make sure you insist that you know this is an issue and that you know there is a function on the CC machine. Again, they will swear there is no function and that they have no ability to do what you want. Keep in mind, Chinese want to save face.

In my experience, this is a problem mostly with hotels and some of the more $$ restaurants. Please do your part by insisting they not rip you off, as it helps ensure education on the CC machines and less other foreigners getting ripped off. And please be kind to these people, it's easy to get frustrated but really it's a Chinese bank issue, not a restaurant/hotel issue.

Good luck, and hope to save you all some $$.

anacapamalibu

Check this thread.

I think you are refering to dynamic currency conversion.

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...-dcc-scam.html

moondog

Yes, and the current system seems to work okay; all you need to do is circle the RMB amount and that's what you should be charged (check your statement; my success rate was 95% last month).

susiesan

If it is so difficult to use a credit card in China and get a fair rate, so using cash is easier, what do you do about getting the large amounts of cash to pay for hotels? Do you pay a $500 hotel bill in cash? Do you carry around that much cash while traveling in China? Will ATM's in China disburse so much cash in one transaction or is there a limit as to how much you can get per withdrawal? I just don't like carrying the equivalent of hundreds of dollars around in the form of cash in case of it being stolen from a hotel room or being pickpocketed or robbed. Plus I'd like to get FF points for my spending while on vacation.

anacapamalibu

You can take up to 10,000USD out per person without a declaration. With
the possibility of an adjustment in the yuan, that might be a great
investment.