You mean I get my breasts played with again? -- You know when they start feeling mens genitals - thats when the TSA will probably finally get their hands slapped . ( and yes I do consider the "top of the breast " a private part)

Soon we'll have a definition of private parts like the tortured (haha) definition of torture that our government has asserted: a private part is an organ essential for bodily function, like lungs, the heart, liver, etc. We didn't mess with your liver so we didn't touch a private part when we gave you a body cavity search because you refused to remove your baggy sweatpants.

Many times in the past the TSA people on here have refused to support idiotic policies that the "leadership" is passing down. Why are TSA people defending the pat-downs? There is no logic behind them, they won't decrease in any meaningful way any meaningful risk, they are un-American, and they are degrading to both the perpetrator and the victim.

When criticizing these idiotic policies we (at least the vast majority of us) are not criticizing the people who are forced to carry them out, we're criticizing the policies themselves and those who created them.

Forced?

Increasingly, I will criticize those who CHOOSE to carry them out, as I'm not aware of any TSA employees who are compelled to work there.

People who violate other people (in what you admit are un-American ways) so that they can collect an above-market paycheck are increasingly hard for me to separate from the un-American leaders for whom they toil.

YMMV.

Sure it's un-American to fondle and grope the way we now do, but like any job, somebody's gotta do it, and it might as well be me, especially since the pay is so much better than it was before the TSA was created.

Sorry, I don't buy it, and I predict that fewer and fewer Americans will buy it either.

Giving the TSA folks some benefit-of-the-doubt, I think it's too early to see some of the stupidity that will IMO certainly come out of the outer-garmet and patdown policy.

Just like the concept of the shoe policy made some sense (screen big bulky shoes like work boots, giant high tops, etc.), there is some sense in the concept of removing winter coats or patting-down extremely bulky billowing garmets.

The problem is and will be the implementation--overzealous checkpoints that will "recommend" removing regular shirts, or all but undershirts, or whatever, and then punish those who don't comply with an aggressive pat down.

Once those problems widely reported (which I have no doubt will happen, just like it did with shoes), I expect some of the more level-headed TSA people here on FT to condemn the policies and the overzealous airports. We've already have a TSAer critize the report of sock-removal from DTW.

What is unfortunate is that it is improbable such rational people will ever be put in charge where they can make a difference. It is my opinon that TSA leadership is out of control. (and yes, I have written my congressman to express that opinion)

I completely understand your sentiments but I think you're taking it a bit far. We are all making compromises (at least the vast majority of us are) in regards to our principles versus the various realities of our jobs. I personally have made such sacrifices. (I have stood by and done little with the exception of writing letters to the editor and to my Congressional representatives, and made political contributions, while my government illegally tortured and illegally held without any due process over 600 people [we think] at Guantanamo Bay. I could have done more.)

Some people took these screener jobs thinking they were doing a service to the public after 9/11. They have stayed because these jobs are decent jobs with good benefits. Many of them disagree with the policies. Should we insist that they all quit and jeopardize their families' well being? Most of us are making a similar value-judgment that the screeners are when we agree to taking off our shoes or going through a feel-up secondary search beause we simply MUST make it to that important meeting. Why shouldn't we be following our principles and get arrested rather than make that meeting?

So what would be the "American" way of handling this?

They don't have one. This is a place where they are free to name call, bash and threaten persons but god forbid you attempt to react then they are quick to click the Report TOS icon.

Can you defend these policies? What purpose do they serve? What is the nexus between the degradation (of the idea of America, the perpetrators, and the victim) and the benefit gained? See my posts above -- I'm not attacking the people enforcing these policies, just the policies themselves and those who put them into place.

I'm amazed that after almost 3 years and ZERO terrorists caught, most of the TSA employees posting here still apparently believe that they are doing something useful for the country. I realize that they are putting food on their own tables, but what are they doing for everybody else? How can they feel good about their jobs? It really amazes me.

Bruce

Bruce,

They are no different than most government employees. Honestly, how many government employees have you come across who feel "good" about their jobs? Most that I know are pretty proud of their "hack" status and will continue to mooch off of the government for as long as they can.

I'm not condoning these idiotic, un-american and possibly un-lawfull practices the TSA Screeners are performing, but now that they are government employees they can never be expected to think like "Real World" employees.

That what you said is true? Are you referring to the fact that the omnipotent media hasnt said TSA caught terrorists? Can you prove that our efforts have not deterred terrorists? This is an enigma! If you catch one it is working, if you catch none it is working. IF you miss one is it not working?

You have no idea about the issues that we face outside of our screening duties "as employees of the Federal Government." I was laid off from a 58k/yr job as an IT specialist before TSA called me to go to work. It was a 67% pay cut. There still is nothing out there for me to go to. There are a myraid of problems with this so called hack. Most of us stay because we are patriots.

I feel VERY sorry for anyone who thinks that any job within the TSA is patriotic.

VERY sorry.

I've come across a lot of (US) govt. employees that feel good and/or proud of their current or former work and who are not "hacks." Granted most of my expereinces have been with military or civilian DoD types, but I still think the above is a little harsh and overly broad. Maybe we've met different people. I've definately known of a few "hacks" and/or people who admitted they were being paid to do nothing, but it wasn't the majority. It doesn't much if at all better in private industry, especially when unionized workforces are involved and you can't hire/fire based on merit.

I dont need your sympathetic response, Just look at the definition of patriot and tell us where you stand.
pa�tri�ot ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ptr-t, -t)
n.
One who loves, supports, and defends one's country.