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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   TSA behavior detection program (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1241951-tsa-behavior-detection-program.html)

FliesWay2Much Aug 1, 2011 5:44 pm


Originally Posted by RichardKenner (Post 16838600)
No, but in the highly unlikely event somebody were to persue this and they brought six witnesses into court and all said that you had pronounced your name to them the same way and it was different from the way you pronounced it to the TDC, I think it would be hard to find a jury that agreed with your theory above.

...until my Public Defender reminded the court and jury that there is no law requiring me to pronounce my name the way it's spelled or even to be consistent. The civil suit I would file would be fun.

FliesWay2Much Aug 1, 2011 5:51 pm


Originally Posted by Lurker1999 (Post 16839852)
Apparently my home airport has been chosen to have the honor of being the test subject for this colossal waste of tax money.

http://www.boston.com/Boston/busines...hOP/index.html

Fellow citizens from Boston: PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE video-record several of these interrogations! Do it for your country!

TheGolfWidow Aug 1, 2011 6:58 pm


Originally Posted by cardiomd (Post 16840108)
I'm in and out of there really, really often. They are already doing this -- they suddenly started about two months ago. It was a distinct and annoying new security "feature."

Basically the guy comes up to you and keeps on asking you dumb questions aggressively. OF COURSE you want to ignore the dude. It is infinitely stupid. The questions they ask reflect a collossal lack of intelligence, that any sentient person would roll their eyes, a reaction I'm not convinced is different from a truly suspicious person. The guy asks me if I was on vacation when I'm dressed in a business suit. :rolleyes: Is this to "throw me off guard???" :rolleyes:

Here is a description of one of my encounters a week or so ago:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/trave...l#post16803029

Was your interrogator actually licking his chops or did you just intuitively pick up on his excitement?

tkey75 Aug 1, 2011 7:09 pm


Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 16840216)
Fellow citizens from Boston: PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE video-record several of these interrogations! Do it for your country!

Unfortunately, that'd be illegal in MA.

I'm really bummed this is happening at my home airport. On the other hand, I look forward to ignoring many a TSAer.

saulblum Aug 1, 2011 7:20 pm


Originally Posted by tkey75 (Post 16840584)
Unfortunately, that'd be illegal in MA.

I'm really bummed this is happening at my home airport. On the other hand, I look forward to ignoring many a TSAer.

This application by cops of the Massachusetts wiretapping laws is currently being challenged in court --

http://www.universalhub.com/2011/cou...-you-have-righ

studentff Aug 1, 2011 7:29 pm


Originally Posted by Lurker1999 (Post 16839852)
Apparently my home airport has been chosen to have the honor of being the test subject for this colossal waste of tax money.

http://www.boston.com/Boston/busines...hOP/index.html


Originally Posted by saulblum (Post 16840628)
This application by cops of the Massachusetts wiretapping laws is currently being challenged in court --

http://www.universalhub.com/2011/cou...-you-have-righ

BOS *always* seems to be the guinea pig for whatever terrible pilot program TSA thinks of, and it seems that every pilot program "succeeds" and ends up getting widespread deployment.

BOS was the pilot of the first behavior detection program. And the "enhanced" patdowns were going on there long before Oct/Nov 2010. And now this. :mad:

It disgusts me to see the city that was the cradle of liberty abused this way.

And I hope that idiotic wiretapping law (or interpretation thereof) eventually gets struck down or repealed. Public officials should have no expectation of privacy when performing their duties in a public place, and should have no expectation of privacy against the owner of a house or a car they are in. If most LEOs were truly honest and decent, they would embrace citizen recordings for providing a record.

cardiomd Aug 1, 2011 7:41 pm


Originally Posted by tkey75 (Post 16840584)
Unfortunately, that'd be illegal in MA.

I believe the Glik case hinges in regard to the purported "secretive" nature of the cellphone recording; if you have your cameraphone obviously recording at the checkpoint (and are not 'interfering' with the screening process :rolleyes:) you are all right even in MA.

It might be fun to record the people in front of you as they are chatted up by the BDO. It will pretty much guarantee you the patdown though in my experience. I have been selected 100% for cancer box at BOS in past 3 months. It gives me a nice conversation starter, "did you hear about the cancer cluster that was seen in your airport's TSA agents?"

jkhuggins Aug 1, 2011 7:42 pm


Originally Posted by studentff (Post 16840667)
BOS *always* seems to be the guinea pig for whatever terrible pilot program TSA thinks of, and it seems that every pilot program "succeeds" and ends up getting widespread deployment.

Do you suppose Pistole is a Yankees fan? :)

RichardKenner Aug 1, 2011 7:43 pm


Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 16840182)
...until my Public Defender reminded the court and jury that there is no law requiring me to pronounce my name the way it's spelled or even to be consistent.

That's why the example I gave had as testimony a number of people saying what answer you gave them when you're asked your name. If you give a different answer to a governmental agent, that's "materially false".

the810 Aug 1, 2011 7:59 pm


Originally Posted by res1968 (Post 16817915)
I would not be surprised if the behavior detection will be along the lines of answering questions similar to the ones passengers answer when checking in for international flights in Europe.

Just out of curiosity: What do you mean by "questions similar to the ones passengers answer when checking in for international flights in Europe" - every year I take number of international flights in Europe and I'm never asked everything..

Classic is Niki check-in (or baggage drop-off) at VIE:
Me: Hello.
(I present my BP and ID to counter agent)
After 1 minute:
Agent: English or Deutsch?
Me: English
Agent: This is your gate, please, be there at this time.
Me: Sure, bye

And that's it:D:D:D

Pesky Monkey Aug 1, 2011 8:00 pm

So let me get this straight. The TSA is publicly announcing that they're rolling out a new (highly annoying) system designed to find terrorists and they publicly announce the one airport it's being used. :confused:

jkhuggins Aug 1, 2011 8:03 pm


Originally Posted by Pesky Monkey (Post 16840813)
So let me get this straight. The TSA is publicly announcing that they're rolling out a new (highly annoying) system designed to find terrorists and they publicly announce the one airport it's being used. :confused:

Big deal. Even if they hadn't announced it, all the FT members at BOS would've reported on it soon enough.

And, as a scientist, I see nothing wrong with the concept of a one-airport test ("pilot") program. Far better to test it at one airport first, and make an honest assessment as to whether or not it makes sense to deploy nationwide.


(Insert your own snide remark about "honest assessment" here.)

Pesky Monkey Aug 1, 2011 8:28 pm


Originally Posted by jkhuggins (Post 16840834)
Big deal. Even if they hadn't announced it, all the FT members at BOS would've reported on it soon enough.

And, as a scientist, I see nothing wrong with the concept of a one-airport test ("pilot") program. Far better to test it at one airport first, and make an honest assessment as to whether or not it makes sense to deploy nationwide.


(Insert your own snide remark about "honest assessment" here.)

But it's supposed to find a one in a billion terrorist by... talking to him.. at a pre announced airport... to see if it works. :confused:

Is this not the most idiotic idea EVER, even by the TSA?

I'm well versed in science, this is not it.

jtodd Aug 1, 2011 8:32 pm


Originally Posted by jkhuggins (Post 16840834)
Big deal. Even if they hadn't announced it, all the FT members at BOS would've reported on it soon enough.

And, as a scientist, I see nothing wrong with the concept of a one-airport test ("pilot") program. Far better to test it at one airport first, and make an honest assessment as to whether or not it makes sense to deploy nationwide.


(Insert your own snide remark about "honest assessment" here.)

I won't even go as far as a remark about assessment. They don't have an assessment for their test, they're going to implement it regardless. Test is just a word they add to give the appearance of propriety.

halls120 Aug 1, 2011 8:41 pm


Originally Posted by RichardKenner (Post 16840732)
That's why the example I gave had as testimony a number of people saying what answer you gave them when you're asked your name. If you give a different answer to a governmental agent, that's "materially false".

Which is why it's best to say nothing. Other than a casual hello if I think the clerk is a decent human being, I refuse to engage in any conversation with TSA clerks. So far I've never been pressured into playing their games.


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