Jun 19, 2017, 9:34 pm
Last edit by: ernestnywang
oneworld Multi-Carrier Awards Wiki v0.1
Rules
1. You need two non CX/KA carriers
2. You are allowed 5 stopovers, 2 transits (<=24hrs) and 2 open jaws. You can use your stopover allowance as a transit, possibly by asking for it to be ticketed as such (extra taxes?). [Using stopover for transit is no longer possible since 2021/22?]
3. The open-jaw points do not count towards your stopover allowance. Neither does the final city on the itinerary
4. You must start and end in the same country.
5. To determine the miles required, add up all flight sectors on your itinerary and look up the award chart (ignore the distance between open-jaw points). gcmap.com is handy, though best to go via asiamiles' calculator.
6. Co-terminals (NRT/HND, LHR/LCY) do not count as an open-jaw (takes up 1 stopover/transit allowance).
If an itinerary clears the above, it is valid, though you may have to argue a lot back and forth. Keep your patience suit on and and keep referring to the terms & conditions ("What in the T&Cs makes this invalid" tends to work).
For the examples below, x=transit, o=stopover, and capitalized alphabets represent airports.
Some valid routings that have commonly been pushed back on
1. "You cannot go through the start, destination, or enroute point more than once". A-oB-oA-oC-oD-A is a valid itinerary.
2. "An open-jaw point is a stopover". A-oB-oC-D//E-oF-G//H-oI-oJ-A is valid, as is A-oB-xC-D//E-oF-G//H-xI-oJ-oK-oL-A.
Other tips
1. Tickets are valid for 1 year from the date of issuance. Potentially a pain when planning that dream RTW trip involving LATAM/AA which release seats 330 days out, that you're trying to tee-in with CX award seats released a year out.
2. A combination of BA/AA/LATAM/QF sites works well to research availability (look for saver availability)
3. You can go crazy on the routings- A-oB-A//C-oD-C//E-A is fine if A,B,E are in country/Region # 1, and, C,D are at the other end of the world.
Rules
1. You need two non CX/KA carriers
2. You are allowed 5 stopovers, 2 transits (<=24hrs) and 2 open jaws. You can use your stopover allowance as a transit, possibly by asking for it to be ticketed as such (extra taxes?). [Using stopover for transit is no longer possible since 2021/22?]
3. The open-jaw points do not count towards your stopover allowance. Neither does the final city on the itinerary
4. You must start and end in the same country.
5. To determine the miles required, add up all flight sectors on your itinerary and look up the award chart (ignore the distance between open-jaw points). gcmap.com is handy, though best to go via asiamiles' calculator.
6. Co-terminals (NRT/HND, LHR/LCY) do not count as an open-jaw (takes up 1 stopover/transit allowance).
If an itinerary clears the above, it is valid, though you may have to argue a lot back and forth. Keep your patience suit on and and keep referring to the terms & conditions ("What in the T&Cs makes this invalid" tends to work).
For the examples below, x=transit, o=stopover, and capitalized alphabets represent airports.
Some valid routings that have commonly been pushed back on
1. "You cannot go through the start, destination, or enroute point more than once". A-oB-oA-oC-oD-A is a valid itinerary.
2. "An open-jaw point is a stopover". A-oB-oC-D//E-oF-G//H-oI-oJ-A is valid, as is A-oB-xC-D//E-oF-G//H-xI-oJ-oK-oL-A.
Other tips
1. Tickets are valid for 1 year from the date of issuance. Potentially a pain when planning that dream RTW trip involving LATAM/AA which release seats 330 days out, that you're trying to tee-in with CX award seats released a year out.
2. A combination of BA/AA/LATAM/QF sites works well to research availability (look for saver availability)
3. You can go crazy on the routings- A-oB-A//C-oD-C//E-A is fine if A,B,E are in country/Region # 1, and, C,D are at the other end of the world.
oneworld Multi-Carrier Awards - sharing ideas
Jan 26, 2020, 2:48 pm
#871
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: TPE / HSZ
Programs: CX GO (=SPH), IHG Diamond Amb, Hertz 5*, Accor, Hilton, National
Posts: 6,437
Feb 1, 2020, 5:04 pm
#873
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 134
Ok, back with another rookie question, but my window to purchase (award) is opening soon and I'm trying to be prepared.
I've read all 59 pages now (yes, really) - and I'm still vague on a tiny point or two. I read the rules at Cathay, too, all of them. Still vague. Bear with me.
I’m going to book my first leg of the MCA the moment I see it available. When I do that – assuming my first leg lands in a lengthy open jaw – I cannot book my 2nd leg until award availability appears, which will be a couple of weeks from now, 360 days before I’m taking the 2nd leg. Then I’m going to call and add it on – and so forth - until my allotted number of travel miles (25K or 35K, haven’t decided) is consumed. I figure this isn’t too weird, especially if you’re trying to take the family.
Yes – I know there’s a fee each time.
My question is – clearly the 2nd (and all subsequent legs, in fact) will be more than one year from now – from when I buy the first leg. It’s just the math of it. If I book the first leg Feb 6th for an award on Feb 1st, 2021 – that is one year from now, before I depart. Then I have an open jaw. And the 2nd leg will be 1 year and one month from now, March 2021.
Much more than 12 months from when I book the first leg. Ya see my quandary? Now, I know this sort of thing happens all the time – so there is SOME way it works out – but no one has cleared it up for me using an example as succinct as this one (if you want to call it that…).
I can’t wait six months to book the first leg – there won’t be any availability! But "tickets are good for 12 months..." What am I missing?
I've read all 59 pages now (yes, really) - and I'm still vague on a tiny point or two. I read the rules at Cathay, too, all of them. Still vague. Bear with me.
I’m going to book my first leg of the MCA the moment I see it available. When I do that – assuming my first leg lands in a lengthy open jaw – I cannot book my 2nd leg until award availability appears, which will be a couple of weeks from now, 360 days before I’m taking the 2nd leg. Then I’m going to call and add it on – and so forth - until my allotted number of travel miles (25K or 35K, haven’t decided) is consumed. I figure this isn’t too weird, especially if you’re trying to take the family.
Yes – I know there’s a fee each time.
My question is – clearly the 2nd (and all subsequent legs, in fact) will be more than one year from now – from when I buy the first leg. It’s just the math of it. If I book the first leg Feb 6th for an award on Feb 1st, 2021 – that is one year from now, before I depart. Then I have an open jaw. And the 2nd leg will be 1 year and one month from now, March 2021.
Much more than 12 months from when I book the first leg. Ya see my quandary? Now, I know this sort of thing happens all the time – so there is SOME way it works out – but no one has cleared it up for me using an example as succinct as this one (if you want to call it that…).
I can’t wait six months to book the first leg – there won’t be any availability! But "tickets are good for 12 months..." What am I missing?
Feb 1, 2020, 7:08 pm
#874
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,801
You can cancel and reissue, which will reset the validity
You will still hang on to any segment you took earlier (read my post on QR sharp practices though)
You will still hang on to any segment you took earlier (read my post on QR sharp practices though)
Feb 3, 2020, 10:24 am
#875
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 134
Percy - thanks for the info - I did go back and read your QR experience - and my trip does, indeed, have QR segments at the front end. This sounds like "cancel and re-issue" is not a great plan for me, at least not in the late stages (good availability in the early going).
I'm still don't see how else you would do it, though, if you want to book your award at its first appearance (360 days out) but presumably your return trip would be sometime later...clearly more than one year from booking the first departure.
I feel like cancel / re-issue would be the normal practice for every person booking far ahead - that doesn't seem right!
And yet I know people book return trips on the first day of availability...of the outbound leg, at least. If I were buying a round-trip - then I'd be forced to wait days or weeks past the 360 days (depending on the length of my stopover) - because I wouldn't be able to even search for availability until 360 days before my return flight...so in that case, seems like round-trippers suffer a little. UNLESS. They book a one way. Wait the "stopover" time, for more awards to appear. Then re-book as a round trip. Is this a "cancel / re-issue" ?
For MCA - I might have 5 or 6 airlines here, all told, including QR - am I risking this whole itinerary each time I call in to add a segment (as the awards appear...360 days out...)?
I'm still don't see how else you would do it, though, if you want to book your award at its first appearance (360 days out) but presumably your return trip would be sometime later...clearly more than one year from booking the first departure.
I feel like cancel / re-issue would be the normal practice for every person booking far ahead - that doesn't seem right!
And yet I know people book return trips on the first day of availability...of the outbound leg, at least. If I were buying a round-trip - then I'd be forced to wait days or weeks past the 360 days (depending on the length of my stopover) - because I wouldn't be able to even search for availability until 360 days before my return flight...so in that case, seems like round-trippers suffer a little. UNLESS. They book a one way. Wait the "stopover" time, for more awards to appear. Then re-book as a round trip. Is this a "cancel / re-issue" ?
For MCA - I might have 5 or 6 airlines here, all told, including QR - am I risking this whole itinerary each time I call in to add a segment (as the awards appear...360 days out...)?
Feb 3, 2020, 3:41 pm
#876
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,801
My QR data point is a bit old. Try see if someone else had managed to hold onto their segments during reissue on QR.
Otherwise you're SOL on oneworld award/MCA.
Otherwise you're SOL on oneworld award/MCA.
Feb 3, 2020, 4:32 pm
#877
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 134
Thanks, Percy, I was afraid of that - maybe someone will chime in with a recent experience.
Let me ask this - is it a cancel / re-issue just to add a segment to the beginning or end of the MCA? Or is that a "change" or a "rebook?" (I'm not changing dates, places, or airlines for the "middle" part - the part I'm booking right now...I'm just adding a segment, both ends.)
A very practical example of this - without anything exotic - is that I need 2 Js, so earlier the better - and I'm going to get them the first instant I see them. However..my "pre-positioning" leg is on AA - can't get them for another month - at which point - I need to
add a segment to the front end of my trip. QR or no QR - I see no way of avoiding this piece-meal method while still booking early. Yes, I could just revenue the AA, or use AA miles directly, but it will sure be convenient to have them linked.
Let me ask this - is it a cancel / re-issue just to add a segment to the beginning or end of the MCA? Or is that a "change" or a "rebook?" (I'm not changing dates, places, or airlines for the "middle" part - the part I'm booking right now...I'm just adding a segment, both ends.)
A very practical example of this - without anything exotic - is that I need 2 Js, so earlier the better - and I'm going to get them the first instant I see them. However..my "pre-positioning" leg is on AA - can't get them for another month - at which point - I need to
add a segment to the front end of my trip. QR or no QR - I see no way of avoiding this piece-meal method while still booking early. Yes, I could just revenue the AA, or use AA miles directly, but it will sure be convenient to have them linked.
Feb 17, 2020, 7:12 am
#880
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,801
Feb 22, 2020, 6:11 pm
#881
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 3
Just got a bad data point from a British Airways Avios rep on the phone. My booking of:
YVR-LAX-DOH-HAN-HKG-LHR-YVR
Got priced as 3x (first class for the whole booking).....the only two legs in first were HKG-LHR-YVR, and the middle east flights are in business. The agent is bringing the flight back to pricing to see what he can do, but when he brought it up the line the manager told him to charge what the pricing agent had set. The longest leg is LAX-DOH and all business legs come to more in miles than the two first legs.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated - just waiting now on the call back from the agent.
YVR-LAX-DOH-HAN-HKG-LHR-YVR
Got priced as 3x (first class for the whole booking).....the only two legs in first were HKG-LHR-YVR, and the middle east flights are in business. The agent is bringing the flight back to pricing to see what he can do, but when he brought it up the line the manager told him to charge what the pricing agent had set. The longest leg is LAX-DOH and all business legs come to more in miles than the two first legs.
Any advice would be greatly appreciated - just waiting now on the call back from the agent.
Feb 22, 2020, 6:15 pm
#882
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NYC/SIN
Programs: CX DM, SQ KF
Posts: 2,171
Avios? No idea about BA’s rules for their version of the award- probably better asked on the BA forum
in CX-land, you’ll be charged the miles for the highest class of travel (even if just 1 segment), for the whole itinerary.
in CX-land, you’ll be charged the miles for the highest class of travel (even if just 1 segment), for the whole itinerary.