Ldnn1

Some of the language in this thread is quite bizarre. Why 'shame on BA'? Ultimately it's a business decision. If enough people take their business elsewhere then maybe the dial will swing in favour of restoring long-haul service. That hasn't happened on other routes like CAI, AMM etc so far, albeit they have restored some food service in Y.

davidcamp6

I suppose RFS CE 50p e/w for LCA level avios may be a good thing ( but if I am travelling with my wife it will have to be LY as it stands)

orbitmic

Well, there are plenty of "if's" which can make pretty much everything in the programme potentially irrelevant in an unknown number of months or years and we can always rediscuss then, but with permission, whilst I have no issue with people sharing their thoughts on how they believe FFPs will evolve, I'm more of a "here and now" kind of guy.

From that point of view, in the current reality and the world as we know it, I see this progressive self-exemption of one's own rules over the past several years as problematic. It started many years ago and specifically in this Eastern Mediterranean and Near East region, for instance with LCA never got the long haul TPs despite being over 2000 miles. Then also a while ago, BA decided to downgrade CAI and AMM despite them being over 2k, and then, it also ended up downgrading earnings on RJ for the same LHR-AMM route to make sure people were not better off flying on the competition. And now TLV.

The LCA inconsistency dates back, I believe, to the 1990s, and the change of credit for AMM and CAI dates back to 2020, so unless the argument is that the hypothetical move to revenue based has been on the cards for 30 years, we can safely assume that the issue at stake is wholly unrelated to the question of whether BAEC will become revenue based or not, but it really is an erosion which has started last century/millennium and has continued since.

expataus

Prices for BA from TLV have jumped significantly today. I was looking at a few flights that were around $3500 TLV-LHR-JFK in CW/CW, that are now listed at $6900 in CE/CW. Is it possible that they've simultaneously halved the product and doubled the price?

For the first time that I remember, LY is currently signficantly cheaper than BA for business class travel to the US. Can't tell if that means they're still figuring out the new prices, or the reduced number of seats in CE means a huge price hike.

Ldnn1

I doubt they've doubled the fares, but the inventory will have been significantly cut, and possibly also capped (e.g. Y/J only etc) to allow for moves. So it's more a function of availability than pricing.

theroz

The idiots(BA) took us from WT+ aisle seats and put us into WT middle seats sitting apart, not gonna fly (pun intended) on with the TA requested a Full Refund, will get it eventually as our LHR-TLV is on a day that axed the flight, but they had my $$ since 6/23, and prefer to know its refunded so we can CX some other items we made that are refundable and get other tkts

Our June trip has the same problem no LHR-TLV on booked date and 321 out of TLV but that was booked via AA and right now AA shows its flying in June, when I see it Id believe it but wont touch that res yet since AA could put us on thier metal non-stop should they end up resuming service but I doubt they will.

* in case it helps anyone else just got off with the OTA and they checked and agreed since we were downgraded from WT+ to WT we can Cancel and get a Full Refund and thats exactly what we did for the April trip, and now to book it on another Carrier. The June we will wait with although we can also get a full refund today since AA is 2x what we paid and if they will offer it for $0 extra thats will work for us

PLeblond

Oh Lord no, of course not. That ship has sailed. I was referring to wide-body service

And yes, spend based earning is on the horizon. To quote Agent Smith: "That is the sound of inevitability [...] Goodbye, Mr. Anderson".

Rubecula

BA seems to fill their flights to Cairo despite moving to short haul aircraft. Short haul aircraft are cheaper to run. That gives more pricing flexibility but also frees up long haul aircraft.

momoflyingguy

This is definitely a reason for me to ditch BA, and a devaluation of my avios.
However, this times very well with the current Virgin status match being offered...

mikebg

Those incidents are not frequent. But when they do (rarely) happen they get a good deal of publicity.

salut0

Cue Finnair publishing a competitive J cabin fare TLV-HEL-LHR for 140+80TP each way? At least the LHR leg could be flat bed�.

Unlikely, I know, especially since TLV-HEL isn�t running right now either

:-(

cwl

Whether is is right or wrong to downgrade TLV to match the likes of AMM or CAI BA have several years of experience with doing this sort of thing and seem happy with the outcome.

BA do alright flying A320s on the AMM route -v- RJ operating B787. The product on BA is inferior to RJ in both cabins but BA deal with that in their pricing. The RJ business product leaves BA CE for dead but is usually double the price. BA undercut RJ whilst still achieving what appears to be a good yield using a shorthaull aircraft at I assume significantly lower operating cost. Those customers who aren't price sensitive will move to El Al or Virgin but that'll still leaves BA filling their aircraft by charging a lower price than the competitors whilst incurring operating lower costs.

Whilst we may not like the change it is a simple business decision which will only ever be reversed on business grounds. At present BA perceive downgrading TLV to shorthaul makes better financial sense than upgrading AMM or CAI back to long haul.

Tafflyer

That is old news. I was on LHR-CAI last week and the 321 was at best half full in CE.

I am also fed up with both the long CE service on this route along with significantly increased prices, so I tried the alternative of IB back CAI-MAD, which still credits 140TP. It's actually with Iberia Express and was one of the worst flights ever. The 23:30 departure time is bad enough but forget sleeping. All 5 crew met in the galley, laughed and shouted for almost the whole flight. My complaints and requests for quiet were first ignored and then just laughed at, it was shameful and disrespectful.

BA are shooting themselves in the foot on these routes, I believe. As well as downgrading the product and the tier points, they have kept Avios redemption rates at long-haul levels.

My next CAI trip is in 2 weeks time and I am flying Aegean via ATH. Yes it's still narrow-body and with a stop, but I can use that to my advantage for some down time and the A3 service is leagues ahead of BA. The RJ option to LHR has also been "nuked", so if RJ then it also needs to be via CDG or FRA, not good options.

It's sad when the only alternatives to BA are Easyjet or Ryanair. Perhaps they're telling me it's time to retire.

Rubecula

February is not the best time to assess a Northern hemisphere route (skiing destinations excepted).

mikebg

Well, TLV is VERY different from that. I fly TLV-LHR-TLV at least once a month, in CW (pre-October 23). In F when available, often connecting to NYC in LHR. The cabins in BA to/from TLV are almost always packed full. It is usually difficult to get an I class fare weeks before. WT+ and WT are also usually very full. ELAL is also pretty full on that rioute as well. Now, if they were filling two 777s (and a mid haul 321 in the summer as well before they were scrapped) or a 777 and a 351 DAILY, I have no idea how the capacity reduction to two short haul flights per day will work out.

Insofar as recovery after the current "war" ends (and it really is "war" - there is no sensible reason not to be flying at the moment, it does not affect 99% of the country), it will not take time to pick up. As soon as there are flights, they will be snapped up.