DYKWIA

I've just looked at the pprune thread. My god, even for pprune it's an eye-opener!

Mud wasps blocking the pitot tubes is my current favourite theory - despite the plane only being on the ground for a couple of hours.

rapidex

I quite agree. My point is , that as this is a B737-500 it has nothing to do with the max.

Waterhorse

Seems like you were suggesting, without any evidence, that it was down to Indonesian flight safety as well as stating it was not a MAX issue. Maybe I'm just losing the ability to comprehend English, but it seemed clear to me that your point was broader than just the MAX, my mistake.

Grace B

Doesn't the 737 (generic) have a long history of unexplained crashes?

Perhaps this is one of them...

Jagboi

I'm not aware of unexplained crashes. Some, like the dual servo valve failure causing a rudder hard over took nearly 10 years and 3 crashes to find the root cause, but it was eventually found

rapidex

No sorry, I was not clear enough. The B737-500 crash is a matter for Indonesian flight safely officers to investigate, and not connected to this thread.

opus99

https://skift.com/2021/01/05/america...s-many-feared/

For those who believe a lot of people will actively avoid the max...Unfortunately or fortunately (depending on your views) most people don't know and most times don't care to know.

rockflyertalk

This is very US based. I notice yields over the xmas period were 90% full according to AA. We live in strange times and I wonder if people just wanted to fly regardless after such a challenging year. The data from EU/U.K. flights might be more interesting. We live in unprecedented times and I think this might help the MAX. But time will tell.

Freddorick

I think for most people a 737 is �a small plane�, or just �a plane�. I also don�t believe that the general public will avoid the 737MAX, but I really hope that BA doesn�t buy the 737.

Yellowbelly

BBC reporting: "Boeing 737 Max cleared to fly again 'too early'"

See: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-55751150

Globaliser

At the RAeS event last week, it was interesting to hear from Hugh Dibley that even in those great days when the fabulously-engineered 747 was born, BOAC had to take some of the early aircraft back to Seattle for fuselage strengthening work. Which is remniscent of the continuing news in respect of an early example of a largely-composite airliner - the 787 - that Boeing is still finding production issues potentially having an adverse effect on fuselage strength, thus requiring rework.

So I think that one thing it would be interesting to hear from other experts would be views on whether and to what extent the types of problem that Ed Pierson points to in that paper are simply part of the BAU of airliner manufacturing: things which ought to be fixed, but which do not require alarm on the same scale as a poorly-designed and implemented MCAS.

Confus

For new aircraft, absolutely. But the point is that during development and certification the 7M8 was never considered a �new� aircraft, but rather an update on a previous model. This meant they could be treated differently precisely because they shouldn�t have needed such extra leeway.

SHT88T

The latest electrical issues which have re-grounded significant numbers of MAX�s are now being reported as worse than first thought.

Boeing would nearly be better canning the MAX and bringing back the NG with significant discounts to accommodate its higher fuel burn against A32xNEO.

The MAX is an absolute disaster.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/boeing-...ft-11618599393

opus99

it�s all part of the same problem that came from a paint coating that is affecting the grounding path.

FAA does not seem to think it�s worth a grounding but Boeing is being proactive. Takes 2 days to fix.

boeing should not and will not scrap the MAX. Believe it or not airlines love it, people aren�t avoiding it and this issue is minor and came from a production process change.

what you suggest is the worst thing any OEM can possibly do.

what I can tell you is, this is not the last problem the MAX will have in it�s in service.

let us also be aware of the timing of this. This problem was birthed just after the second crash, so it�s not just occurring now. Boeing is only just discovering it now because of the changes they have made to reviews and quality control.

let us put things into perspective.

SHT88T

How many more defects are there that remain undiscovered and how many of those may also be fatal? It has been well documented how corners we cut in trying to rush this aircraft to the market. Given the state of the original program it is almost guaranteed there will be a �next� problem.

The result of that rush is also well documented with over 300 people losing their lives and further issues being discovered since then.

Personally I have lost confidence in Boeing as a manufacturer and I find it very hard at this point in time to determine how long it will be before I feel confident to fly on a 737Max. I doubt I�m alone in that view.

I guess from IAG/BA perspective they�ll be hoping for some years of clean service by the time any firmed up MAX�s arrive.