Would you turn down a really good job if the travel policy was all Y?
#211
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Helsinki, Finland
Programs: BA Gold (OWE) since 2007, Star Alliance Gold, Jetairways Gold, Sky Team Silver
Posts: 24
Reality check from the Nordics. It is very uncommon, if not exceptional, for anyone to travel business class in the Nordic countries for work purposes. It is considered a waste of money and superficial. Only top executives of international companies in Finland / Sweden / Norway would dare travel business class. Any other company travel in business would end up with very bad reputational risk and headlines in tabloids. Even the president of Finland usually travels economy class...
#213
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Leicestershire / Dubai
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Posts: 663
Reality check from the Nordics. It is very uncommon, if not exceptional, for anyone to travel business class in the Nordic countries for work purposes. It is considered a waste of money and superficial. Only top executives of international companies in Finland / Sweden / Norway would dare travel business class. Any other company travel in business would end up with very bad reputational risk and headlines in tabloids. Even the president of Finland usually travels economy class...
#214
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: BRS
Programs: BA Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 4,993
#215
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: London, UK
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Posts: 1,308
Reality check from the Nordics. It is very uncommon, if not exceptional, for anyone to travel business class in the Nordic countries for work purposes. It is considered a waste of money and superficial. Only top executives of international companies in Finland / Sweden / Norway would dare travel business class. Any other company travel in business would end up with very bad reputational risk and headlines in tabloids. Even the president of Finland usually travels economy class...
But the basic point is correct around the culture. Even with the more generous than normal policy, we frequently ended up paying more for J than F, which was total no-no.
#216
Join Date: Dec 2007
Programs: M&M, BA Silver, Accor LeClub Gold
Posts: 490
Interesting thread. I'm talking to a company about a role where I'd need to take 8 long haul trips in Y (most with a connection), plus +/-12 short haul trips (some on Ryanair, some on company charter flights). Due to the location of the role, I'd also need to add on significant personal travel (sometimes direct with a LCC, sometimes connecting via a European hub). Travel policy depends on grade and they have made it clear that J isn't up for discussion on the long haul flights, but that W could be up for discussion - However, that would likely be reflected in their salary offer. So, how much would you sacrifice in salary if you knew that those W flights would likely be on flights where the J cabin was full so no opup possibility?
#217
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 344
Interesting thread. I'm talking to a company about a role where I'd need to take 8 long haul trips in Y (most with a connection), plus +/-12 short haul trips (some on Ryanair, some on company charter flights). Due to the location of the role, I'd also need to add on significant personal travel (sometimes direct with a LCC, sometimes connecting via a European hub). Travel policy depends on grade and they have made it clear that J isn't up for discussion on the long haul flights, but that W could be up for discussion - However, that would likely be reflected in their salary offer. So, how much would you sacrifice in salary if you knew that those W flights would likely be on flights where the J cabin was full so no opup possibility?
#218
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: USA
Programs: BA Silver
Posts: 812
Interesting thread. I'm talking to a company about a role where I'd need to take 8 long haul trips in Y (most with a connection), plus +/-12 short haul trips (some on Ryanair, some on company charter flights). Due to the location of the role, I'd also need to add on significant personal travel (sometimes direct with a LCC, sometimes connecting via a European hub). Travel policy depends on grade and they have made it clear that J isn't up for discussion on the long haul flights, but that W could be up for discussion - However, that would likely be reflected in their salary offer. So, how much would you sacrifice in salary if you knew that those W flights would likely be on flights where the J cabin was full so no opup possibility?
#219
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Arizona
Programs: US Airways, Marriott
Posts: 6
Who is paying for your travel?
My company is a Y only policy for anyone below GVP. The exception is if you make 4 trips of 10+ hours on a single flight /year, you can fly Business if it is for internal company business. If the customer is paying for your travel, you cannot expect them to pay for you to fly Business Class.
I've flown Phoenix to Bangalore in Coach and lived to tell about it.
I've flown Phoenix to Bangalore in Coach and lived to tell about it.
#220
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: South East England
Programs: Status with BA Exec Club; KrisFlyer; Hilton Honors; IHG One; Marriott Bonvoy
Posts: 543
In terms of the OPs dilemma, I would remind them of the quote from Orbital (from the intro to Satan)
It is better to regret something you did do than regret something you didn't.
In this case, taking the offered job. I guess there's a big risk you'd kick yourself in a few years time if things aren't perfect career wise and you didn't take the role just because you didn't fancy long haul Y. I pay for upgrades on work trips sometimes, often AUPs, it doesn't hurt too much. With the uplifted salary you should do the same if possible when the need or desire is there.
It is better to regret something you did do than regret something you didn't.
In this case, taking the offered job. I guess there's a big risk you'd kick yourself in a few years time if things aren't perfect career wise and you didn't take the role just because you didn't fancy long haul Y. I pay for upgrades on work trips sometimes, often AUPs, it doesn't hurt too much. With the uplifted salary you should do the same if possible when the need or desire is there.
#221
Join Date: Feb 2018
Programs: BAEC Gold, Hilton Diamond, Bonvoy Silver
Posts: 175
The other possibility is negotiating time off to compensate. My standard policy is that I will get off a plane and start work right away if in Business class (or higher). If in Economy (or Premium Economy) LH, I'll plan on at least a day to recovery in each direction. Thankfully, I've had employers who were reasonable about these things and accommodated that.
#222
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: West Sussex
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 897
Reality check from the Nordics. It is very uncommon, if not exceptional, for anyone to travel business class in the Nordic countries for work purposes. It is considered a waste of money and superficial. Only top executives of international companies in Finland / Sweden / Norway would dare travel business class. Any other company travel in business would end up with very bad reputational risk and headlines in tabloids. Even the president of Finland usually travels economy class...
#223
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London
Posts: 778
More and more large and successful companies are going to Y class only. It's a fact of life and an easy cost to control. My reflection on reading some of the comments is that these folks must be REALLY valuable to be able to pick and choose which employer to work for based on their travel policies. In the real world, it is expected to fly from the US to EU on Y, arriving morning next day with meetings scheduled at 12:30 on the arrival day. That is SOP. Tired? Jet Lagged? Tough! You have a job to do! Working on Thursday in San Francisco with meeting in Boston on Friday? Take the red-eye in Y, get up and get to work in Boston. That is what coffee is for. As a father of four, weekends are of course paramount. But if meeting in EU start on Monday, I need to kill most of a Sunday to get there. If I won't go, there are plenty of people applying to HR every day for my job who will.
There are plenty of companies out there that do not see employees as promptly replaceable, and plenty of Executives who do not share this perspective. I would never, ever want my team - at any level - to work under a similar culture. I don't see how depriving staff of sleep and rest, or even worse forcing them to sacrifice their family life, would ever lead to positive outcomes for the business in the long term. And, yes, I do consider them REALLY valuable.
For full disclosure, this is the managerial point of view of a large global company. I really wish people would stop thinking that perspectives like the one above are normal, or that they are "SOP". It is thankfully untrue.
#224
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Sapporo, Japan
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#225
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Ipswich
Posts: 7,543
So while this perspective may well be untrue in your reality, others are not so fortunate.