BA crashes its NPS (Net Promoter Score)
Dec 8, 2017, 11:11 am
#31
Original Poster
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Brexile in ADB
Programs: BA, TK, HHonours, Le Club, Best Western Rewards
Posts: 7,067
Really? Removing duty-free trolleys is not the sign of a confused strategy. Even if you intend to generate increased revenue from inflight sales, it does not follow that it makes sense to pursue any kind o f ancillary revenue, even where the amount generated is negligible. I can quite see how removing inflight "duty-free" can make sense even for an airline that places more emphasis on ancillary revenue if the revenue generated by non-food and drink inflight sales is small.
Rather than relying on one isolated figure related to one particular individual and trying to extrapolate in the dark, why not take from the very same article figures that provide a little bit more information? That article tells us that typical sales targets are about €4.23 per passenger on a Ryanair 737-800 and that those targets are apparently barely ever achieved. Now, take €4 per person and substract from that food and drink purchases, do you really think that "duty-free" sales are a major money-spinner for Ryanair?
Rather than relying on one isolated figure related to one particular individual and trying to extrapolate in the dark, why not take from the very same article figures that provide a little bit more information? That article tells us that typical sales targets are about €4.23 per passenger on a Ryanair 737-800 and that those targets are apparently barely ever achieved. Now, take €4 per person and substract from that food and drink purchases, do you really think that "duty-free" sales are a major money-spinner for Ryanair?
Now I don't have BAs figures (maybe you do) but I often buy duty free items at the airport, because buy on board is too hit and miss. Probably spent the best part of £1000 over the last year, none of which went to BA due to my perception that they would not have what I wanted
Dec 8, 2017, 11:42 am
#32
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: London, UK
Posts: 5,681
All this talk about fares misses the point. Product and customer experience have most impact on NPS.
BA have been cutting at both. I just flew Lufthansa business class from London, via Munich to San Francisco. The journey was a bit longer, but the end to end product, was immensely better. Yes, the seat has the same (lack of privacy) that any aisle Club World seat has, but every other part of the experience was better. Munich is a joy to connect through with no security and no passport control from UK to US.
The NPS is in the toilet because of buy on board, because of no through checking of luggage, because of terrible food, because no aisle access in Club World, because of ground staff taking compliant bags off people, and finally because of dreadful service recovery efforts that are just insulting to passengers.
All of these are of BA's own making. A few £39 fares to Barcelona aren't going to make up for that.
BA have been cutting at both. I just flew Lufthansa business class from London, via Munich to San Francisco. The journey was a bit longer, but the end to end product, was immensely better. Yes, the seat has the same (lack of privacy) that any aisle Club World seat has, but every other part of the experience was better. Munich is a joy to connect through with no security and no passport control from UK to US.
The NPS is in the toilet because of buy on board, because of no through checking of luggage, because of terrible food, because no aisle access in Club World, because of ground staff taking compliant bags off people, and finally because of dreadful service recovery efforts that are just insulting to passengers.
All of these are of BA's own making. A few £39 fares to Barcelona aren't going to make up for that.
Dec 8, 2017, 11:48 am
#33
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: City of Kingston Upon Hull
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 4,946
Oh dear, I may have accidentally boosted their NPS today by completing a survey about my recent call to customer services regarding my LBA flight retimings. In my defence, my call was answered on the third ring and I was rebooked via MAN in less than 5 minutes.
Dec 8, 2017, 11:54 am
#34
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,408
Dec 8, 2017, 2:46 pm
#35
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Mexico City
Programs: Life Miles, Miles and more
Posts: 518
Not surprising, the signs have been there sometime. All those who repeatedly demanded evidence from anyone who suggested the public may not like BAs strategy are now getting it in spades.
Between this, and the rather poor financial performance compared to its peers (don't mistake IAGs performance for BAs) it's quite obvious why they just announced a bunch of U-turns. Too late? We'll see. But noting a lot of people here couldn't have told management before they went down this road. A lot of money wasted I would imagine.
Between this, and the rather poor financial performance compared to its peers (don't mistake IAGs performance for BAs) it's quite obvious why they just announced a bunch of U-turns. Too late? We'll see. But noting a lot of people here couldn't have told management before they went down this road. A lot of money wasted I would imagine.
Dec 9, 2017, 9:01 am
#36
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: ORD
Programs: US Air, UA BA LH AI DELTA MARRIOTT CHOICE SGP
Posts: 9,883
I guess the bigger question that shareholders care about, though, is whether profits have been impacted and, on the basis of recent reports, the only impact is upwards. However, it will be interesting to see what happens over the next year, once the short term benefit of cost cutting is removed and the effect on forward bookings becomes clear.
Is this not the same 'news' that was posted and mostly ignored several weeks ago?
YouGov - Brandindex - BA declines from 44.1 to 32.5 in a year
YouGov - Brandindex - BA declines from 44.1 to 32.5 in a year
Dec 9, 2017, 2:19 pm
#37
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: LON BCN SYD
Programs: BA, OZ, A3, VA, VS, DL, QF, former BD and others
Posts: 1,077
As a point of reference, I have just flown LH longhaul in Y. Connecting in MUC outward and FRA return. Excellent service, snack and drink on the shorthaul legs to/from the UK, much better connection experience in MUC and FRA than is offered at LHR, much better lounges, much better food, more attentive cabin service, better drink options. And the planes were pretty full.
I think a large part BA's sales to date are down to captive markets and inertia of regular customers, but for those routes where there is a competitor BA start losing customers as the public perception of BA shifts. Continuing to charge a premium while no longer offering a premium product will only damage BA in the long term.
I think a large part BA's sales to date are down to captive markets and inertia of regular customers, but for those routes where there is a competitor BA start losing customers as the public perception of BA shifts. Continuing to charge a premium while no longer offering a premium product will only damage BA in the long term.
Dec 9, 2017, 2:44 pm
#38
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BOS
Programs: BA - Blue > Bronze > Silver > Bronze > Blue
Posts: 6,814
They also target €800 per flight, given BA fly as I recall 600 a day, this works out at €175 million if BA could match Ryanair.
Now I don't have BAs figures (maybe you do) but I often buy duty free items at the airport, because buy on board is too hit and miss. Probably spent the best part of £1000 over the last year, none of which went to BA due to my perception that they would not have what I wanted
Now I don't have BAs figures (maybe you do) but I often buy duty free items at the airport, because buy on board is too hit and miss. Probably spent the best part of £1000 over the last year, none of which went to BA due to my perception that they would not have what I wanted
Even assuming 50% it’s really not all that much money in the big scheme of things. What was BA’s profit last 1/4 again?
the way to get NPS back up would be re-introducing a free drink, offering decent service recovery and getting staff standards back up to previous levels.
The first two two would be relatively easy and not too costly, the last a far tougher project
Dec 9, 2017, 3:04 pm
#40
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere between 0 and 13,000 metres high
Programs: AF/KL Life Plat, BA GGL+GfL, ALL Plat, Hilton Diam, Marriott Gold, blablablah, etc
Posts: 30,795
I guess the bigger question that shareholders care about, though, is whether profits have been impacted and, on the basis of recent reports, the only impact is upwards. However, it will be interesting to see what happens over the next year, once the short term benefit of cost cutting is removed and the effect on forward bookings becomes clear.
Thats a bit like assessing tge weather, you have the guys who look out of their window, high level of certainty but limited depth, those who try to read pressure maps - much longer forecast though more risk it might be disproved, and those who try to figure out what clothes they need to buy based on the season: fewer relevant points but if you feel winter is coming you won’t buy a short sleeved linen shirt.
if nps continues to deteriorate, the risk is that the group might become more attractive to speculators than to long term investors and if that becomes the case, it comes with challenges of its own, not least in that any long term strategy you might have in mind becomes largely irrelevant to them and it creates a vicious circle of expecting/needing short term results even if you always intended to balance long and short term goals in the first instance.
Last edited by orbitmic; Dec 9, 2017 at 3:25 pm
Dec 9, 2017, 3:18 pm
#41
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: NYC
Programs: BA Silver, UA 1K, DL Platinum
Posts: 710
Although short-haul and the IT meltdown are probably the main drivers, those fun-sized Mars bars and water cuplets on east coast US flights have damaged BA for years to come in my view.
Dec 9, 2017, 10:03 pm
#42
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: OOL/DOH
Programs: QF LTS WP, Avis Pres Club, HH Diam.
Posts: 3,192
After a long hiatus, I have flown 2 x LH CW, 2 x LH F and 1 x SH CE (the other leg cancelled, and the BA response was bloody awful) this year.
Admittedly I think I have been spoilt by the standards and quality of the Asia-pacific airlines and ME airlines I have been flying on more regularly.
I would rate the BA LH J product at a 3 1/2 star level, on par with SL and their F a 4 star - basically a very good J. The J SH product is appalling.
The CCR room in LHR is very good though, their other lounges, not so good.
Admittedly I think I have been spoilt by the standards and quality of the Asia-pacific airlines and ME airlines I have been flying on more regularly.
I would rate the BA LH J product at a 3 1/2 star level, on par with SL and their F a 4 star - basically a very good J. The J SH product is appalling.
The CCR room in LHR is very good though, their other lounges, not so good.
Dec 14, 2017, 7:38 am
#43
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 25
BA Club World
I flew JFK-LHR in Club World yesterday and found quite a difference. Instead of the plump container with booties, toothpaste, etc., there was a slimmer version with the same contents. Then I found a giant square parcel containing a huge comforter and a lesser blanket; then there was a large white pillow and a smaller pillow. In fact you couldn't see the seat! The meal was on a large classy triple-folded menu reminiscent of first class with choices of wine. The seating is the same with the annoying up and down window and clambering over someone's feet if you are against the window. And I was promised three times that my overcoat would be stored before I asked the fourth time and it was removed. So, as usual with BA, there were pluses and minuses.
Dec 14, 2017, 7:42 am
#44
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Switzerland
Programs: AY+ Platinum, SK Gold, LH M&M SEN, airbaltic Executive, Radisson VIP
Posts: 6,584
I flew JFK-LHR in Club World yesterday and found quite a difference. Instead of the plump container with booties, toothpaste, etc., there was a slimmer version with the same contents. Then I found a giant square parcel containing a huge comforter and a lesser blanket; then there was a large white pillow and a smaller pillow. In fact you couldn't see the seat! The meal was on a large classy triple-folded menu reminiscent of first class with choices of wine. The seating is the same with the annoying up and down window and clambering over someone's feet if you are against the window. And I was promised three times that my overcoat would be stored before I asked the fourth time and it was removed. So, as usual with BA, there were pluses and minuses.
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/brit...reactions.html