Can I help you

The cabin crew are the eyes and ears in the cabin for the flight crew and where we feel that there is a need we use our initiative and say something on their behalf.
I would always let the Captain know this when they speak to me before they make a PA to the customers.

BLHD

If I remember rightly... I bought you a pint to help you get over this!

corporate-wage-slave

Can we have a PNG for one of the 09 approaches? (In other words the approach over Windsor rather than the city of London).

KARFA

No problem. I use Navigraph charts which are based on the Lufthansa/Lido charts. The Lido charts are teh ones many airlines such as BA use. Some may be more familiar with the Jeppesen charts but these are too expenive for me.

Also bear in mind that whilst a transition route is shown from the hold points to the final approach fix, ATC will vector anyway so you never really follow that path exactly. For example for the 09 approaches you go a little further out west than indicated on the chart, and for the approach for the 27 ruways from Bovingdon you tend to be vectored out and turn over Canary Wharf whereas the chart shows the transition as not going quite as far east and turning over central London.

PJV33

Woah Karfa, that is a really really cool navigraph you posted. Very interesting.

I'd like to make my own observation. yesterday as well, maybe 1630, I was standing at Hatton Cross bus station waiting and doing my nightly plane watching, a Turkish Airlines jet (no idea which, wasn't using FlightRadar) was on approach, then right before crossing over head to land on 27L, I heard the engines fire back up and it disappeared back into the night on almost the same flight path as the BA flight you showed.
Are you able to find that one with your cool little tool? i'd like to see it.

KARFA

So it looks like the TK aircraft you saw was TK1971

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/a...c-jsn/#8482cd0

If you zoom in to the map you can see it followed pretty much the same course as BA995, so went to the south and then came back in for another attempt,.

From what you saw it sounds like the aircraft would have been around 200-300ft from the ground just as it was about to pass over Hatton Cross. You can abandon an approach at any time but there is a specific point where you need to make a positive decision to land or to throw it away and go-around. At LHR 27L for a normal ILS approach and when not under low visibility procedures that decision altitude (sometimes called "minimums") is 280ft - you can see the figure in the bottom left table in the chart on this earlier post under the CAT 1 DME heading:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/25878054-post10.html

It sounds like they were at that point as they were about to pass over Hatton Cross and clearly made the decision to go-around.

When you reach that point if you haven't received the landing clearance from the tower controller (maybe the previous landing aircraft was slow to vacate), or the approach is not stable, or you are not visual with the runway then you go-around.

The actions that would happen in the cockpit are that take-off/go-around power will be engaged (TO/GA), the flaps raised part way from the landing configuration, and pitch raised to climb the aircraft. Once they are climbing the gear would be raised as well.

For 27L the published missed approach course is that they would have continued flying runway heading 91 degrees until they past 1080ft, then they would have done a left turn to 149 degrees and continued climbing to 2000ft initially, then 3000ft. During that time on of the pilots is talking to ATC and they would probably start to get instructions on course and height to get them back in for another approach if the flight crew want to try again.

Hope that helps to explain it a little.

captainc747

Karfa thats a lido chart me thinks you could be a flight simmer bav prehaps?

Captainc747

KARFA

What do you mean? I am a real pilot! in my head

Yes, a simmer of sorts, although I don't have a sim at home but do go over every week to this one http://www.flightdeckexperience.co.uk/. Over the last 14 months I think I must have built up a few hundred hours on the 737-800 so I roughly know what I am doing.

I use navigraph which is pretty good for what you get, so about EUR 60 a year for all updated charts worldwide, and based on the Lido charts. Obvioulsy it is not rated for real world flying, but it is as good as you can get without having a very expenisve subscription to the commerical charts.

When I started I used the Jeppesen charts but they are too expensive for me to buy so I was only using out of date ones I found online. Initially I wasn't a fan of the Lido charts but I have got used to them.

Speedbird876

I've been wondering for a while about how they manage to get all the planes nicely lined up. Like KARFA says, the path shown in the charts is not exactly followed for each landing. There seems like a lot of information to pass on over the radio to get everyone into exact positions lined up nicely.

BApilotinsider

Wow... How much has that cost you?!

rapidex

Not half as much as his CCR card^

captainc747

I have been using Navigraph for years I now keep Lido on my tablet when I flight sim. I will not say how many hours I have clocked up over the years. But its all good fun and a good learning curve.

Do you get involved with world flight I have friends that run Simfest, 737-800 and now an 744.

Captainc747

KARFA

Nothing fortunately. I am friends with the guy who built and runs it so a few select friends go over one evening a week and fly around.

The CCR card is an investment. What price can one put on being part of the club?

I did worldflight for the first time last year, only two flight as I hadn't much experience then. For this years event I had a lot more, one every night during the week. I suppose that is a reflection of my much improved ability and experience since last year. I put a link to a post with some information in my signature, and here it is:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/flyer...ence-mind.html

Yes, enjoyed watching the simfest guys and the sims they have look very impressive. We (TOM1VB) saw them quite a lot during that week on the route.

ZKOKA

At least for Europe Eurocontrol EAD Basic is rather nice and available free of charge. Lido and Jeppesen (among others), simply put, take that same information and publish it in a harmonized way. EAD Basic is constantly updated with each AIRAC cycle.

golfmad

Sorry to go all pedantic on you here KARFA but it's hardly an investment. It's a cost. An investment has to have a strong possibility of a return. It also bugs me when the government (any colour) say they've invested an amount of money in some programme or other. These are often just costs too.

Got that off my chest now.