henners

This.

Much as we like planes here, trains are best for short hops. The key is single ticketing (and associated protection if you miss the connection).

paul4040

This is effectively a requirement of the franchise, as are 95% of the improvements Virgin and Stagecoach are trumping. It doesn't show Stagecoach/Virgin intention.

Why? Because under the Invitation to Tender, the average journey time KGX-EDB is supposed to be 4h17, but there are also stipulations on minimum calls for "slow" trains. This effectively means that slower trains may take up to 4h30 calling at many stations, leaving the only option to maintain the average journey time to run fast expresses calling only at Newcastle.

You can read just how prescriptive railway franchises are by viewing the documents here: https://www.gov.uk/government/public...tion-to-tender

The timetable is pretty much written out for the core route, as are most of the improvements the winners of the franchise are shouting about. It's like me purchasing a McDonald's franchise and saying how great the Big Mac I invented is.

Sixth Freedom

They do have the one express from Edinburgh that calls only at Newcastle, but there is not (I think) currently any other similar service operating southbound or a similar service northbound.

GSTBK

Hopefully they will improve it soon. I use Virgin between London and North Wales a few times a year to visit family, and whilst the new first class lounge at Euston is good, I'd be more impressed if they managed to have a decent wifi service on-board (and better on-board catering). Still far superior to FGW's offering though.

DYKWIA

It was great until the end of last year. Did Manchester-London every week, and apart from the odd glitch, it worked perfectly.

GSTBK

I remember it being great before, but then awful on the couple of trips I took earlier this year. I was hoping it was just me being unlucky, but judging by your comments it's obviously unfortunately a much larger problem.

paul4040

It's due to the age of the receiving equipment on the trains. This equipment will be replaced when the new 4G internet arrives on Virgin.

HIDDY

What harm has BA ever done to you to warrant such a verbal attack?

Even the low cost airlines haven't greatly impacted BA on the Scottish domestic routes.....if anything they did BA a favour by giving them an excuse to shut down those expensive to run bases thus making the routes more profitable.

The rail journey time between LON-EDI would have to come down to below 3 hours in order to attract the high yielding business people who commute between the two cities.
Anyway no matter how good the rail service is connecting passengers aren't going to be interested in jumping on a train to Scotland from LHR unless all flights are grounded due to weather.

clarkeysntfc

100% on board with this.

I would like to see as much domestic aviation (and flights to BRU and Paris) transitioned to high speed rail as possible.

This would open up more slots at LHR to long haul, which BA (it would appear) make more cash on anyway.

Calchas

If the infrastructure were in place, perhaps.

BA is a business, I don't think they have any obligation to run domestic services if they aren't profitable ...

LondonAndy

No, but if they didn't run flights from EDI / GLA / BHD they really would become "London Airways" and would push those outside the M25 to overseas airlines - if you are going to have the hassle of getting to London by train and then getting the LHR / LGW, why not fly from a regional airport to BRU / DXB / DUB or wherever, and continue your journey from there?

Calchas

Yes of course. And that is presently a profitable activity. If high speed rail deprives BA of substantial O&D traffic they will have to take a look at the figures and decide if it is worth retreating from the regional markets and leaving them to the Germans, French and Dutch, or whether it remains the best use of the slots to operate a domestic schedule with the changed feed/O&D mix.

I suspect the connecting traffic is not as lean as clarkeysntfc implicitly suggests (certainly on the MAN route I think most folks are connecting), and surrendering it to the foreign operators would be rather unpalatable from a shareholder perspective.

paulwuk

BA are doing a good job at not getting O&D from Manchester. Despite a £400 return fare for today, all the flights had avios availability, and the flight was maybe 40% full, probably less. There were 5 people across the 12 emergency exit seats this morning.

Virgin little red is never this empty.

I was in row 12, so followed a fair few people up the airbridge from A7. Nobody ahead of me went on to the domestic exit.

BA paid for me to fly this £35 + avios return -- it cost them £24 APD and then say £30 Heathrow handling.

Had they charged £150 return I'd have probably bought the ticket, but wanting £400 tells me they aren't interested in O&D. On the other hand they have decimated the MAN schedule over the last 2 years, with no early or late flights, playing havoc with connections to/from certain places.

JAT74L

Why would underfloor Diesel engines be fitted to electric trains?

JAT

paul4040

The Class 800 will be an electro-diesel, with both types of traction. Not all of the routes in the East Coast franchise are electrified.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_800

Underfloor diesel engines rarely make for a popular train. They mean vibration when running, as well as higher floor levels from the platform.