Genetk44

Looks like BA has been "Rouged". If you dont understand the reference just type in Rouge in the search box, or Google "Air Canada Rouge reviews" to see the passenger feedback of these types of "improvements/enhancements.

A P Yu

Airlines replace seats all the time - they have to and each new breed of seat is lighter etc so rather than an investment, over a short period of time actually is a cost saving measure (and is in the interests of the business just as much as the passenger - if not more)

Re:If they were planning on getting rid of CE, they could have just not bothered and saved the design time and fitting

Because if they would have done that straight away more people would be up in arms about this. This provides them with an interim step, moving the product slowly towards the other product until such time as the 'merging the products' becomes obvious - its Change Management genius.

A P Yu

If you have any flights booked on an A319 next year check out the seatmap. A pair of seats 25 A and B have appeared where the toilet used to be (rows 23 and 24 are new too!)

(Sample LHR-BRU BA400 2nd April)

angatol

.....

ALEX2575

As someone who for years only ever flew BA club or first and never looked at Economy or low cost carriers Ba are making a real effort to make me look to move my spend.

If the seats now offer 4' less legroom and less recline but I'm sure prices won't go down what's the point? I'm 6'2 and have put up with ba trashing the ce offering for years and introducing inedible food options despite raising prices for the leg room and seat width or that awful tea option. There now really seems no point?

But if there is no point flying ce what's the incentive to stay with ba for long haul routes either as at present I do all my monthly transatlantic flights with ba as no other carrier has the complete footprint I need of london to nice and to the us. If I no longer fly the nice route I and many other passengers can chose a new alliance for their high value and margin transatlantic business or first flights as there will no longer be a feeling of trying to maximize points and status on one airline.

Aside from the slip in on board catering and this now massive downgrade in planes the customer service and lounges have also been in free fall. I got food poisoning from a piece of salmon on the buffet that was frozen in the middle in the first lounge at heathrow t5 over three months ago. Despite constant chasing of the gold guestlist team,customer services and even special services I keep being told it's 'under investigation' but that's only when I ask. Seems ba have hoped they can ignore problems with their customers, which is crazy given I brought the salmon from the buffet to the lounge manager who felt the bottom of the plate and acknowledged it must still be part frozen in the middle for the plate to be that cold, and yet 3 months later it's still being investigated.....

At least from what I hear easyjet are honest about being no thrills, wish ba would stop hiking up prices and making empty promises whilst constantly worsening their offerings....

our_kid

I personally pay for CE due to the extra room and space to get work done. That 4 inches might not sound much but when you've got the laptop out and working it does make a difference. The food is much of a muchness, flying into OTP yesterday in row 4 (in ET) we had a pretty decent meatballs and pasta. Ok I had the legroom for CE in the older seats but now I wouldn't pay for a product that has little benefit to me.

I agree with a lot of the posts on here that this is a step towards CE being declared an anachronism.

Genius1

Of course this also means the end of the two front CE configured seats in ET

gordon0808

I prefer the KLM type of product where, in addition to always having an empty seat next to you, you also get 2 or 3 inches of additional pitch. When all the rows with the extra pitch aren't needed for business class, which is usually the case, they're sold as "Economy Comfort" at a small surcharge over any Y class fare.

EvilDoctorK

How come they're only getting 1 extra row of seats in the A320 out of this .. If they're taking 4" out of 15 (?) convertible seat rows that used to be in the A320 and perhaps 1" out of the remaining 12 (?) then they should be gaining enough for 2 extra rows rather than one ? (Not that I want to be giving them ideas!)

Looks like they're going to end up with 28 rows here .. by way of comparison Aer Lingus have 29 rows and that's certainly fairly tight

nobbyclark

I was on a refurbished ex-BMI A320 twice yesterday. By chance it was the same plane flying EDI-LHR and then LHR-CPH an hour or so later.

For the LHR leg, I was in 3D and the leg room was lacking (I'm 6'4, or 1.9m in new money). I dreaded the chap in front reclining as it would have made matters worse. Fortunately he didn't, but I sat for an hour or so with my knees jammed against the seat in front, not to prevent him reclining but because it was the only way to get comfortable. The gent in 3C spent most of the flight with his legs stretched out in the aisle.

For the CPH leg, I was fortunate to be in 1D. I say that, because if I had paid CE prices for a seat such as 3D, I would be disappointed. Setup is as per a picture earlier in the thread, with a table over the "E" seat, which folds down from the seat back. Not sure if there is less space between the seat and bulkhead, but you certainly can't stretch out, although you can cross your legs, which is not an option in other rows.

Overall, if this is the shape of things to come, domestic flights on these planes are going to be uncomfortable. And before anyone pipes up with the inevitable "it's only an hour", yesterday's flight required bum on seat for almost 2 hours - 20 minute slot delay before take off, 1 hour flight and 30 minutes of holding and finals.

Hoch

I think you have hit the nail right on its head. If the enhancement is such that it proves to be unpopular and thus unprofitable, then a quick turn of the screws and every seat is ET. Would BA go to such lengths to phase out CE? I don't know.

I'll patiently wait until I have tried it to condemn it

H

710 77345

So now it's only the addition of some extra food and Monopole that's causing premium APD to be charged on Club Europe... this makes the afternoon tea (consisting of a sandwich and a scone) more expensive than the Ritz!

HMRC specifically state that a cabin with no extra legroom (but the middle seat free) that offers priority boarding, lounge access and extra baggage allowance is not a premium cabin for tax purposes.

edi-traveller

Most of the debate here revolves around reduced pitch in CE - which affects me at the moment mainly as a domestic traveller who always picks a seat in the 34in zone.

And taking the "pitch is the same as Lufthansa" comment which suggests that BA are happy being the same as the competition - now ET and UK Dom will be worse than Easy Jet.

If I'm rushing home and haven't time between meeting to grab a bite to eat or eat in the lounge I get 30/29 in on my A319/A320 a thimble of coffee or drink and a packet of crisps with 5 crisps inside.

On Easy Jet I get the same pitch and the ability to by a decent sized coffee, and a bacon panini.

Just what is BA's proposition now on short haul economy.

Full service airline?

I'd say it's now aiming lower than the low costs.

BahrainLad

That's interesting. Can you tell me when BA introduced the current CE convertible seat design?

edi-traveller

They had cloth covered convertibles when I started flying BA back in 1993. They were recovered in leather in the late 1990s early 2000s so they've been around for 20 years.