Cabin Crew vote for a Strike [now postponed]
Dec 14, 2009, 9:55 am
#91
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: UK
Programs: BA Blue, IC Spire Ambassador
Posts: 5,228
this is clearly a very very controversial topic. However, I am fed up with being PC and am going to say what I think.
The whole thing strikes me (no pun intended) as being wholly immature. The union are suggesting a 12 day strike over Christmas, whilst BA has a message on all of its telephone channels saying how disappointed they are and slating unite. Neither party seems willing to back down.
I think we should all remember that cabin crew are people: they have brains, and obviously will have considered the repercussions of their actions. Such an overwhelming vote in favour of strike action, in my mind, shows YET AGAIN the discontent within the company at BA Management. Ever since privatisation, BA Management has been wholly inept in dealing with situations like this one.
Now, however, is NOT the time to change management. BA needs stability: it needs its entire staff to be on board and singing from the same hymn sheet. It needs its corporate customers to remain loyal. It needs the government and regulatory bodies to accept expansion plans and be sensitive with taxation.
My biggest fear is that many cabin crew have voted without fully understanding exactly what BA's proposals actually are. This strikes me as being rather cavalier.
I just hope that those who voted in favour of a strike are satisfied that, should it go ahead, their airline will be safe -a number of people have used words such as "allegedly" to describe BA's losses. Whilst a cynic could say that BA can use the current economic background as a cover to make sharp cuts, I think one only has to look at the position of bmi or easyjet (look at what they have done at East Midlands) to see that BA is in trouble.
Whilst unilateral changes to contracts may seem unfair, I seriously think cabin crew need to be reminded that they can always leave and find a better job. If they hang on at BA with an attitude that clearly shows a lack of support for the airline's survival, I think those who voted in favour will fully deserve what is coming to them if BA goes bust and they lose their jobs.
As for those who voted no, for the flight crew, engineers, ground staff, operational staff, management, and all of those who supply BA (Gate Gourmet, BAA staff....) I hope that BA manages to survive.
I also hope that BA manages to find a way to get rid of people from the airline who don't deserve to wear the British Airways uniform.
If this strike doesn't go ahead, then this is clearly a circus, and it shows that the union is clearly as out of date and rusty as BA Management.
I think both sides need to grow up and to reach a consensus. I think a strike should be a no no. BA should listen, and the union should actually make offers that the airline can accept, remembering that its members have a choice of airline -they can always leave and seek employment elsewhere if they would prefer.
Sorry for the rant, but I am yet again losing faith. I shall have to try very very very hard not to give the next CC member I see a good shake to try and bring them from the late 70s early 80s into the 21st century.
The whole thing strikes me (no pun intended) as being wholly immature. The union are suggesting a 12 day strike over Christmas, whilst BA has a message on all of its telephone channels saying how disappointed they are and slating unite. Neither party seems willing to back down.
I think we should all remember that cabin crew are people: they have brains, and obviously will have considered the repercussions of their actions. Such an overwhelming vote in favour of strike action, in my mind, shows YET AGAIN the discontent within the company at BA Management. Ever since privatisation, BA Management has been wholly inept in dealing with situations like this one.
Now, however, is NOT the time to change management. BA needs stability: it needs its entire staff to be on board and singing from the same hymn sheet. It needs its corporate customers to remain loyal. It needs the government and regulatory bodies to accept expansion plans and be sensitive with taxation.
My biggest fear is that many cabin crew have voted without fully understanding exactly what BA's proposals actually are. This strikes me as being rather cavalier.
I just hope that those who voted in favour of a strike are satisfied that, should it go ahead, their airline will be safe -a number of people have used words such as "allegedly" to describe BA's losses. Whilst a cynic could say that BA can use the current economic background as a cover to make sharp cuts, I think one only has to look at the position of bmi or easyjet (look at what they have done at East Midlands) to see that BA is in trouble.
Whilst unilateral changes to contracts may seem unfair, I seriously think cabin crew need to be reminded that they can always leave and find a better job. If they hang on at BA with an attitude that clearly shows a lack of support for the airline's survival, I think those who voted in favour will fully deserve what is coming to them if BA goes bust and they lose their jobs.
As for those who voted no, for the flight crew, engineers, ground staff, operational staff, management, and all of those who supply BA (Gate Gourmet, BAA staff....) I hope that BA manages to survive.
I also hope that BA manages to find a way to get rid of people from the airline who don't deserve to wear the British Airways uniform.
If this strike doesn't go ahead, then this is clearly a circus, and it shows that the union is clearly as out of date and rusty as BA Management.
I think both sides need to grow up and to reach a consensus. I think a strike should be a no no. BA should listen, and the union should actually make offers that the airline can accept, remembering that its members have a choice of airline -they can always leave and seek employment elsewhere if they would prefer.
Sorry for the rant, but I am yet again losing faith. I shall have to try very very very hard not to give the next CC member I see a good shake to try and bring them from the late 70s early 80s into the 21st century.
Dec 14, 2009, 9:57 am
#92
Join Date: Jun 2005
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I guess I'd better call AA and find out if there's anything they can do about my award flight on BA on Dec. 23... I have a feeling that I'm gonna be disappointed, but I won't be complaining about the union's sacrilegious atttiude to Santa Claus.
Dec 14, 2009, 9:59 am
#93
Moderator: GLBT travelers, India-based Airlines and India; FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Location: Asia
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Originally Posted by Willie's statement
Our Heathrow crew will remain the best paid in the industry. Average earnings for cabin services directors are £56,000 on long-haul and £52,000 on short-haul. For junior crew, they are £35,000 and £26,000 respectively. According to the Civil Aviation Authority, average costs of BA crew are twice those of their Virgin Atlantic counterparts.
Rather than doing their utmost to work with the company to ensure its (and thus their) long term future, what a time to choose to go down this path. A part of me really thinks BA should let this run to the end, and clean up the company once and for all. Even it means insolvency, and a liability-free reincarnation with an industry standard cost structure.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:00 am
#94
Join Date: Aug 2006
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Technical question
(posted elsewhere but I think it got lost in the longer thread)
Travelling from LHR to HAN return, on one booking via CDG. Flight LHR-CDG is BA and CDG-HAN is another airline.
1. If LHR-CDG is cancelled because of the strike, and I get to CDG by train, will AF honour the CDG-HAN sector?
2. If LHR-CDG isn't cancelled but not being certain it would operate, I decide to go to CDG by train anyway, will AF honour the CDG-HAN sector?
thanks!
Travelling from LHR to HAN return, on one booking via CDG. Flight LHR-CDG is BA and CDG-HAN is another airline.
1. If LHR-CDG is cancelled because of the strike, and I get to CDG by train, will AF honour the CDG-HAN sector?
2. If LHR-CDG isn't cancelled but not being certain it would operate, I decide to go to CDG by train anyway, will AF honour the CDG-HAN sector?
thanks!
Dec 14, 2009, 10:00 am
#95
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: UK
Programs: BA Blue, IC Spire Ambassador
Posts: 5,228
I think the point about the Christmas break is a fair one. Whether you secularise it and say that it is a period of peak travel demand, mainly for families (as opposed to business travellers), and mainly for holidays. Given that people have had to cut back, the point is valid that people will be ultra pissed off at BA right now for potentially ruining their Christmas holiday.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:01 am
#96
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Ground staff will be the ones in the front line facing angry passengers if the strike happens. Why should we end up jobless and be called stupid for coming in to help passengers.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:03 am
#97
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I think it has been pointed out already, but to make it more clear:]
Inbound flights on the 22nd will be flown to allow crew to return to LHR. Therefore there maybe an effect on day 13 with crew and aircraft being out of position.
BA will not pay wages and/or hotels for crew during the strike.
Inbound flights on the 22nd will be flown to allow crew to return to LHR. Therefore there maybe an effect on day 13 with crew and aircraft being out of position.
BA will not pay wages and/or hotels for crew during the strike.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:04 am
#98
Join Date: May 2004
Location: London
Programs: BA EC: silver
Posts: 219
The twelve days of striking
On the twelfth day of Christmas my true love sent to me
No on-line check-ins
No club world lounges
No safety briefings
No in-flight movies
No raid the larder
No baggage reclaim
No meeting loved ones
No go-old cards
No cabin crews
No flat beds
No LHR
And a death wish from British Airways
No on-line check-ins
No club world lounges
No safety briefings
No in-flight movies
No raid the larder
No baggage reclaim
No meeting loved ones
No go-old cards
No cabin crews
No flat beds
No LHR
And a death wish from British Airways
Dec 14, 2009, 10:05 am
#99
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I understand your anger and frustration, but remember crew are not the only people who work at BA.
Ground staff will be the ones in the front line facing angry passengers if the strike happens. Why should we end up jobless and be called stupid for coming in to help passengers.
Ground staff will be the ones in the front line facing angry passengers if the strike happens. Why should we end up jobless and be called stupid for coming in to help passengers.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:09 am
#100
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: DFW
Programs: AA EXPLT, UA 1K, HY GLOBALIST
Posts: 155
I understand your anger and frustration, but remember crew are not the only people who work at BA.
Ground staff will be the ones in the front line facing angry passengers if the strike happens. Why should we end up jobless and be called stupid for coming in to help passengers.
Ground staff will be the ones in the front line facing angry passengers if the strike happens. Why should we end up jobless and be called stupid for coming in to help passengers.
Can we all remember to keep a little bit of decorum when dealing with the ground crew during this period ... it is not their fault.
Myself and my family (4 kids) will be disrupted over this and I will try my best to not take it out on the ground or res staff.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:10 am
#101
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With an almost 93% strike vote, the number of crew not wanting to strike is so minimal, I unfortunately don't see how BA will even be able to try to run any kind of mainline operation.
On a different note - I hope that the moderators will watch this thread closely so it doesn't become a slanging match against either BA Management, or the BA Cabin Crew alike.
FWIW, I used to fly as British Airways Cabin Crew on the Longhaul fleet.
I'm sorry to see that my former colleagues feel there is no choice but a strike decision. However, their is a lot more going on behind the scenes other than the soundbites you see in the media.
In the 'PR Race' to get out the facts about the reasons behind the strike, Willy Walsh is at best disingenuous when he lists pay rates of GBP 35,000/year for Junior Cabin Crew on Longhaul (source: interview today in the UK's Daily Mail).
I checked my self assesement tax return for the last full year I worked at BA: total earnings including the flight allowances designed to help pay for costs for hotel meals etc. while staying away from home was a total of GBP 17,750. Not minimum wage - but almost HALF the figures that Willy Walsh touts.
Point is - please don't believe all the hysteria that you might hear in the media during this dispute.
I sincerely hope for all BA passengers that a mutual resolve between BA and the cabin crew comes soon and that the operation does not shut down over Christmas after all. Fingers crossed.
On a different note - I hope that the moderators will watch this thread closely so it doesn't become a slanging match against either BA Management, or the BA Cabin Crew alike.
FWIW, I used to fly as British Airways Cabin Crew on the Longhaul fleet.
I'm sorry to see that my former colleagues feel there is no choice but a strike decision. However, their is a lot more going on behind the scenes other than the soundbites you see in the media.
In the 'PR Race' to get out the facts about the reasons behind the strike, Willy Walsh is at best disingenuous when he lists pay rates of GBP 35,000/year for Junior Cabin Crew on Longhaul (source: interview today in the UK's Daily Mail).
I checked my self assesement tax return for the last full year I worked at BA: total earnings including the flight allowances designed to help pay for costs for hotel meals etc. while staying away from home was a total of GBP 17,750. Not minimum wage - but almost HALF the figures that Willy Walsh touts.
Point is - please don't believe all the hysteria that you might hear in the media during this dispute.
I sincerely hope for all BA passengers that a mutual resolve between BA and the cabin crew comes soon and that the operation does not shut down over Christmas after all. Fingers crossed.
There's a lot of mistruths being reported in the media, by both the union and WW's office.
The salaries quoted by WW do not ring true for any of the crew I know. Try looking at half of what was put and you're much closer to the mark.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:11 am
#102
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: London-Nice
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Posts: 1,425
If these are the salaries that are earned by BA cabin crew, then I'm sorry but I have very little sympathy with this strike whatsoever. Especially given what the industry standard is. Do these strikers know the average wage in the UK is? Or perhaps more accurately, the median wage? Or how fragile the airline sector currently is?
Dec 14, 2009, 10:11 am
#103
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Texas
Programs: American Airlines British Airways
Posts: 1,752
Being a well armed Texan I will be glad to loan any BA staff one of my weapons so that they may place even more holes in their feet.
I am trying to decide if this is more stupid than AA pilots placing billboard ads around DFW airport saying how bad and danergerous AA is. Let me think.
Hum, yes I believe this strike vote is dumber.
I am trying to decide if this is more stupid than AA pilots placing billboard ads around DFW airport saying how bad and danergerous AA is. Let me think.
Hum, yes I believe this strike vote is dumber.
Dec 14, 2009, 10:11 am
#104
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: London
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 570
Have just purchased an additional ticket on FR (PIK-STN) after BA CS refused to rebook my GLA-LGW flight on the 26th to the apparently uninvolved LCY Cityflyer service. How helpful!
Doubt I will be using this company again if i can avoid it.
Doubt I will be using this company again if i can avoid it.