Jan 7, 2019, 9:47 pm
Last edit by: JDiver
Awards: All Cathay Pacific / CX (Including First and Business Class)
Questions, Availability, Discussion
Questions, Availability, Discussion
For the current thread, please see here.
NOTE: As of 15 Jan 2017, JFK CX flights have relocated to Terminal 8.
Please feel free to use this thread for questions regarding CX Economy, Premium Economy, First and Business Class award redemption using AAdvantage miles, as well as questions regarding award availability, routings and related issues. Please go to the Cathay Pacific Asia Miles Forum to discuss or ask about meals, equipment, service, etc. on CX, as there is an existing wealth of information there - and this is the American Airlines AAdvantage Forum
.AA Flight award chart for oneworld® and partner airlines
Other related threads that may be of interest:
FT Discrepancy between CX Award Search and AA availability: Discrepancy between QF and CX award search and AA availability
FT How , When to Select CX Seats on CX Award: How / when to select seat on a Cathay (CX) award / flight (consolidated)
FT Cathay Pacific Experience - Seats / Interline/ Baggage FAQs: Cathay Pacific Experience / Seats / Interline / Baggage FAQs
Also, for Rules about awards, see AA oneworld and Other Airline Partner Award information, rules (2015 on).
NOTE:
1) Only "MileSAAver" awards apply to oneworld and AA partners.
1a) Premium Economy seats are not available with AAdvantage awards, may be soon as AA sells Premium Economy Feb 2017.
2) Awards on Cathay Pacific and subsidiary KA / DragonAir may be booked through AA.
3) aa.com does not reveal CX awards; you must call AA (1-800-882-8880) to book a CX award (though you may find BA, JL or QF websites may reflect CX award availability). As CX/KA awards can not be booked online on aa.com, you must call (no fee).
3a) Be aware that what you see on the BA, JL, or QF sites may not be visible to the AA reservations folks. You may want to note the flight on which the F award seat is shown as "available" on those sites and if the AA agent doesn't see any availability suggest that the AA agent check that specific one again. If the AA agent still cannot see it, thank them, hang up, and call back a little later.
3b) Sometimes CX will make flights available for award booking to CX frequent flyers, but not release the seats immediately for other oneworld frequent flyers. Usually though, the seats, if not taken by CX frequent flyers, are released after a while to other OW programs.
4) Although CX may release seats for award earlier, AA can book them no more than 331 days prior to departure. The awards that CX does release are available as early as 355 days prior to departure for CX and BA frequent fliers, and sometimes that means the awards you want w AA miles will be snatched up prior to the 331 day mark.
*** AA does not have a set schedule to load flights. They can load it anytime after midnight 331 days out. Most of the time it is within a couple to 12 hours of that. Other times, it can be a full day or a day and a half afterwards, especially on the weekends where there's most variability. Unlike JL award space, it is not a specific time of day.
4a) Keep in mind that when booking eastbound space to North America that it's one day later in HKG so that space usually becomes available 330 days in advance to North America; this is not always true, since CX has already loaded the availability a month prior to AA - it is just up to AA to load and release the seats on SABRE, so it typically ends up being 330 days out, but not necessarily.
4b) Similarly... if you are trying to book westbound, US->HKG->Somewhere then AA may not be able to book the HKG->Somewhere segment 331 days in advance of the US->HKG flight, if it is still 332 days out in HKG. As it is the flights from US->HKG that are hardest to get, if you find a seat US->HKG at the 331 day mark when it is first available for booking through AA but cannot book the continuation, you can just put that US->HKG segment on hold with AA, then call back the next day when connecting flights will be loaded into the system to try to book the onward flight from HKG.
5) CX tends to initially release award seats farther out, and then again closer to the day of departure if there is remaining F or J seat inventory available, so keep checking back with AA up to the last practicable minute. AA will ticket partner awards/changes up to 4 hours prior to departure.
5a) So is there a pattern to how many seats CX releases? They seem to consistently release 5 J award seats and 1-2 F award seats on long hauls to/from North America at 355 days out. For intra-Asia flights, they often release just 4 J seats.
5b) Patterns for west coast routes: Because LAX has 4 daily flights to HKG, it tends to be the easiest option for blocks of 3 or more J award seats. SFO and YVR only have 2 daily flights and even if 5 award seats were initially released at 355 days prior to departure, some of those may be gone by the time the 331 day mark rolls around. If you need 4 or 5 J award seats on these west coast routes, either use Avios to book at 355 days or consider routing through LAX where there may still be availability at 331 days out.
5c) Pattern for release of close-in (within about 14 days of flight) award seats? Driving Rain reports that using BA.com it appeared that on three consecutive Sunday evenings at exactly 1030pm Eastern Daylight Time inventory would open up for "close-in" CX flights (i.e. flights roughly within 14 days of that Sunday) to and from the US. While there were changes here and there periodically during the week, sweeping changes occurred on Sunday nights at 1030. Driving Rain reports that it seems that on Monday mornings in Hong Kong (i.e. 1030pm EDT on Sunday) someone at CX HQ consistently did a run through the inventory and freed it up. No guarantees, but a person looking for close-in flights might want to plan to check with AA shortly after 1030 PM Eastern Time on Sundays to see if anything has become available.
6) AA does not charge "YQ" surcharges [what they sometimes call "fuel surcharge"] on CX/KA award segments (BA Avios does), thus the taxes and fees on your "free" ticket on CX or KA are almost always significantly less than for the same routing on BA.
6a)
6b) There is a Hong Kong Departure Tax (HK) of $120 HKD (approx $15.50 USD) on every segment departing Hong Kong. Exemptions apply. If your ticket includes this tax and you qualify for an exemption, a refund can be applied for either in person at HKIA landside or via post to Civil Aviation Department. AA charges this tax for children under 12 years of age despite the exemption. In order to obtain a cash refund at HKIA, you will need passenger passport, passenger boarding pass, passenger ticket receipt showing the fare calculation line which will show the HK tax being charged. This receipt can be obtained at any AA counter worldwide including HKIA as well as Airport Express in-town check-in (AA check-in). As the AA counter at HKIA operates only during limited hours, Airport Express in-town check-in would be the the convenient option.
7) Not all CX flights offer First class; CX Business is markedly different on long haul and regionally configured aircraft.
8) If you're looking for multiple seats in First on a particular flight but can find only some but not all that you're looking for, take what's available in F, then take the rest of the seats you want on J (if available) on the same flight, and check back periodically to see if an F seat has opened up for award. There is no additional charge (in money, although there will be in miles) to change to an award to a higher cabin of service (e.g., J to F, Y to F, Y to J) as long as the award keeps the same origin/destination airports.
9) In general, rerouting to different flights after you have redeemed an award will not attract a monetary penalty so long as the originating and destination airports are the same (connection airport can differ without triggering change fee) and you are using oneworld carriers. For this reason, be aware of potential alternate routings and check them, too. For example, CX uses LAX, SFO, ORD, JFK, and BOS as ports of entry to the US from HKG (and also YVR and YYZ in Canada), so if you have one F and one J award seat on a non-stop from HKG to ORD, you might check flights from HKG to LAX for available seats in F, and if they are available, reroute from your HKG-ORD to HKG-LAX on CX, then continue LAX-ORD on AA First.
9a) Note the above rule also applies if you change the dates of flight but retain the same originating city and destination city. If you are flexible in your travel dates be sure to periodically check availability on other dates as well.
10) Be aware your award must conform to some rules on a) MPM (Maximum Permitted Mileage - your award routing can not exceed 125% of the most direct routing available); a useful tool is Great Circle Mapper.
11) The Most Significant Carrier (transpacific usually, CX in most of these posts,) must offer a non-"constructed" fare between your origin and destination (you might find an unconstructed fare between DFW and SIN, but might not from Killeen to SIN).
12) If you can't pick your CX seats online, either due to them being blocked or you just want to call, you need to first get the CX PNR from AAdvantage at 1-800-882-8880. Then call CX at 1-800-233-2742. Some seats that are blocked on CX website are assignable via AA reservations. Close to departure AA can even assign 2A, 2K.
Note: if the Cathay Manage booking tool doesn't appear to recognize your CX PNR, you need to enter your first name AND middle name, separated by a space, in the "First Name" field.
13) Up-cabin visits (i.e. J pax joining F companion in F cabin) are not permitted per CX policy, though have been granted under special circumstances. But putting crew in the awkward position of being asked to violate policy is generally frowned upon. Down-cabin visits are permitted ex-USA. However, on flights to the USA, down-cabin visits are not permitted and this rule is vigorously enforced.
Posts made in 2017 may be read in ARCHIVE: 2017 AA Awards in Cathay Pacific / CX, KA...
Posts made in 2016 may be read in ARCHIVE: AA Awards on Cathay Pacific (2016).
Posts made in 2015 may be read in ARCHIVE: AA Awards on Cathay Pacific (2015).
Posts made in 2014 may be read in ARCHIVE: Awards: CX / Cathay Pacific / (inc. F and J) - 2014.
N.B. Older posts have been moved and archived to: Cathay Pacific / CX (inc. First and Business Class) award - ARCHIVED.
ARCHIVE: 2017 AA Award: Cathay Pacific / CX, KA availability, etc. (master thd)
Nov 18, 2017, 1:07 am
#766
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Programs: AAdvantage Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 132
Looking at LAX-HKG on CX and found availability on Qantas Website. BA website does not show availability even though the flight is more than 20 days out. Alaska Airlines rep saw availability also.
AA agent cannot see it. HUCA or call Australia center?
AA agent cannot see it. HUCA or call Australia center?
Nov 18, 2017, 5:48 am
#767
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: NYC/PSP
Programs: AA EXP, A3 Gold
Posts: 4,106
Middle name issue strikes again. Yesterday booked an award ticket on CX. Today it is was still showing as ON REQUEST. Since travel is tomorrow called AA. Agent said CX rejected the ticked because of no middle name. At this point I thought it would just be a matter of AA adding the middle name, but the AA agent said that the seats had been cancelled outright. Only way to travel would be if there was still award inventory available. Thankfully there was and had to book a completely new ticket. The AA agent yesterday messed up by not including my middle name.
Nov 18, 2017, 5:51 am
#768
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: NYC/PSP
Programs: AA EXP, A3 Gold
Posts: 4,106
Nov 18, 2017, 8:22 am
#769
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: DCA/IAD/WAS
Programs: MAR AMB, WOH Explorist, AA EXP, UA 2P
Posts: 2,138
Nov 18, 2017, 11:36 am
#770
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: West Coast
Programs: Continental OnePass; United Mileage Plus; Marriott Rewards; Priority Club Rewards
Posts: 4
I'm in the middle of *trying* to book two coach award tickets with my AAdvantage miles on Cathay Pacific. On Monday AA rep found the flights we wanted, I booked them, gave AA my credit card information and middle names since they said, "Cathay requires your middle name." I was told to expect an email later that day. No email came, couple days later, still no email. I check my AA account and the flights show "in review" and the miles have not been taken out of my account, I check Cathay Pacific website and the flights show confirmed. I call AA again yesterday, had to give our middle name again, credit card information again and still no confirmation email from AA.
Called again today and at least this time, the rep made an effort to call someone else to see what was going on. He said that the middle name requirement is something new and that some reps don't know how to deal with it. He said call again on Monday if I do not get a confirmation email. I sure hope I don't have to call again on Monday.
This is why I'm trying to spend all of my miles - you would think they could manage to book an award flight for me, it should not be that difficult. My concern is that while the days tick by and I don't have the tickets, the seats will not be available.
I'll come back with an update.
Called again today and at least this time, the rep made an effort to call someone else to see what was going on. He said that the middle name requirement is something new and that some reps don't know how to deal with it. He said call again on Monday if I do not get a confirmation email. I sure hope I don't have to call again on Monday.
This is why I'm trying to spend all of my miles - you would think they could manage to book an award flight for me, it should not be that difficult. My concern is that while the days tick by and I don't have the tickets, the seats will not be available.
I'll come back with an update.
Nov 18, 2017, 4:05 pm
#771
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,453
There is no middle name requirement from CX per se. Their requirement is for an exact name match with travel document.
As per ICAO standards, the name field on a passport consist of 2 fields; PRIMARY IDENTIFIER (aka SURNAME) and SECONDARY IDENTIFIER (aka GIVEN NAME).
CX system only has two name fields (SURNAME and GIVEN NAME); matching ICAO standard.
Edgar Allen Poe's US passport would be:
SURNAME POE
GIVEN NAME EDGAR ALLEN
The first line of MRZ on the passport would be encoded as P<USAPOE<<EDGAR<ALLEN<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
CX want's PNR to reflect POE/EDGARALLEN
If your name is just JOHN DOE, then CX want's PNR to be DOE/JOHN. Problem is AA thinks you have a middle name and have not provided it to them and will hold off ticketing unless you make it clear to them you do not have a middle name.
AA's job is to ensure they ask you for name matching travel document.
Please note that even if you have an AAdvantage profile has your middle name, you will still need to put the middle name in the first name field because AA doesn't look AAdvantage middle name when building PNR.
For example: Edgar Allen Poe's AAdvantage account
SURNAME POE
FIRST NAME EDGAR
MIDDLE NAME ALLEN
When you make a booking online or over the phone with AA, the PNR created would just be POE/EDGAR. AA is not using the middle name at all when creating the PNR.
As per ICAO standards, the name field on a passport consist of 2 fields; PRIMARY IDENTIFIER (aka SURNAME) and SECONDARY IDENTIFIER (aka GIVEN NAME).
CX system only has two name fields (SURNAME and GIVEN NAME); matching ICAO standard.
Edgar Allen Poe's US passport would be:
SURNAME POE
GIVEN NAME EDGAR ALLEN
The first line of MRZ on the passport would be encoded as P<USAPOE<<EDGAR<ALLEN<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
CX want's PNR to reflect POE/EDGARALLEN
If your name is just JOHN DOE, then CX want's PNR to be DOE/JOHN. Problem is AA thinks you have a middle name and have not provided it to them and will hold off ticketing unless you make it clear to them you do not have a middle name.
AA's job is to ensure they ask you for name matching travel document.
Please note that even if you have an AAdvantage profile has your middle name, you will still need to put the middle name in the first name field because AA doesn't look AAdvantage middle name when building PNR.
For example: Edgar Allen Poe's AAdvantage account
SURNAME POE
FIRST NAME EDGAR
MIDDLE NAME ALLEN
When you make a booking online or over the phone with AA, the PNR created would just be POE/EDGAR. AA is not using the middle name at all when creating the PNR.
Nov 18, 2017, 4:45 pm
#772
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Bye Delta
Programs: AA EXP, HH Diamond, IHG Plat, Hyatt Plat, Marriott Plat, Nat'l Exec Elite, Avis Presidents Club
Posts: 16,273
I had no idea about this requirement until an AA reservations noticed it on an existing reservation involving CX travel. She insisted she had to add the middle names and queue it off to a liaison to get it sorted out.
I, like many Americans, use my Drivers License while traveling. The name on my account, as well as my Secure Flight information, matches that of my drivers license, which is just my middle initial. So if CX requires a full middle name on the face of the ticket so that it matches the passport, that would be a problem.
This is all well and good, however, in your AA profile isn't all that information already in there???? Having flown 100's of flights on AA which was booked online and all info used from my online profile, why is it a problem on CX flights? Just came back from Beijing had no issues with the info in my profile which match's my passport.
Nov 18, 2017, 6:04 pm
#773
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,453
I had no idea about this requirement until an AA reservations noticed it on an existing reservation involving CX travel. She insisted she had to add the middle names and queue it off to a liaison to get it sorted out.
I, like many Americans, use my Drivers License while traveling. The name on my account, as well as my Secure Flight information, matches that of my drivers license, which is just my middle initial. So if CX requires a full middle name on the face of the ticket so that it matches the passport, that would be a problem.
I, like many Americans, use my Drivers License while traveling. The name on my account, as well as my Secure Flight information, matches that of my drivers license, which is just my middle initial. So if CX requires a full middle name on the face of the ticket so that it matches the passport, that would be a problem.
from what seawolf wrote doesn't matter if you have a middle name or not, it's what AA provides to CX. So I'll stand on what I wrote, if you call into AA to purchase your ticket and using AA miles, then AA has all your info they need.
Nov 18, 2017, 7:02 pm
#774
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,762
Our AA profiles have no middle name but our passports have. We have traveled on CX and other partners (QR being the most frequently used) with and without middle names in the past. Some AAgents would ask about middle name information some did not. Often it is just middle initial.
We once had 2 AA awards on QR - one ticketed with middle initial one did not. I asked QR whether this would cause problem. QR assured me multiple times that they did not care as long as the First and Last name match with what were on the passport. CX used to be that too. Our last trip on CX in Sept was with AS miles. It only had middle initial, not middle name, on our AS issued CX partner award tickets.
The CX requirement of having middle name included in the passenger's name is relatively recent. Many AAgents are still not realize this is now mandated to issue ticket with CX segment hence the often hang up on issuing the tickets.
Last edited by Happy; Nov 18, 2017 at 7:10 pm
Nov 18, 2017, 8:42 pm
#775
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: NYC
Programs: AA 2MM, Bonvoy LTT, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 14,638
This is all well and good, however, in your AA profile isn't all that information already in there???? Having flown 100's of flights on AA which was booked online and all info used from my online profile, why is it a problem on CX flights? Just came back from Beijing had no issues with the info in my profile which match's my passport.
If your AA profile has middle name, it does NOT get included in CX PNR.
AA uses SABRE. CX/BA/QF (to name a few) uses Amadeus.
As to your question on AA flight, it could just be AA has no issues including AAdvantage middle name on SABRE PNRs but drops it when building an Amadeus PNR. This combined with CX requring full name match could be the issue.
Nov 18, 2017, 10:28 pm
#776
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,801
I had no idea about this requirement until an AA reservations noticed it on an existing reservation involving CX travel. She insisted she had to add the middle names and queue it off to a liaison to get it sorted out.
I, like many Americans, use my Drivers License while traveling. The name on my account, as well as my Secure Flight information, matches that of my drivers license, which is just my middle initial. So if CX requires a full middle name on the face of the ticket so that it matches the passport, that would be a problem.
I, like many Americans, use my Drivers License while traveling. The name on my account, as well as my Secure Flight information, matches that of my drivers license, which is just my middle initial. So if CX requires a full middle name on the face of the ticket so that it matches the passport, that would be a problem.
Flyers,
Whether you agree with it or not, whether you have past success or not, whether you think it should be this or that or not, is at the end, irrelevant.
The fact is this was a minor issue that seems to be universally ignored, until recently, when the threat of Terror has changed the entire way of air-travel. You can lament, you can be angry, you can be disgusted, but the reality is rules and policies will be enforce, even *over-enforce*.
Just like in the old days agents can care less if your luggage is overweight by a little, now they are adamant to pay a fee or take things out. Names have to be exact match has been around for more than a few decades, now it seems like it's going to be universally enforced as time go on.
Be safe, use exact names, save the grief later.
Whether you agree with it or not, whether you have past success or not, whether you think it should be this or that or not, is at the end, irrelevant.
The fact is this was a minor issue that seems to be universally ignored, until recently, when the threat of Terror has changed the entire way of air-travel. You can lament, you can be angry, you can be disgusted, but the reality is rules and policies will be enforce, even *over-enforce*.
Just like in the old days agents can care less if your luggage is overweight by a little, now they are adamant to pay a fee or take things out. Names have to be exact match has been around for more than a few decades, now it seems like it's going to be universally enforced as time go on.
Be safe, use exact names, save the grief later.
I would add CX has been fined by the TSA for security lapses recently https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/28906298-post45.html . So perhaps what used to fly (literally) might not anymore.
Nov 19, 2017, 6:29 am
#777
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: NYC
Programs: AA 2MM, Bonvoy LTT, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 14,638
From the CX thread on this:
I would add CX has been fined by the TSA for security lapses recently https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/28906298-post45.html . So perhaps what used to fly (literally) might not anymore.
I would add CX has been fined by the TSA for security lapses recently https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/28906298-post45.html . So perhaps what used to fly (literally) might not anymore.
How is this a security lapse on CX part? TSA showed TSA ID to access jet bridge. Once aboard jetbridge TSA showed some random BP. All US airlines would have failed that.
Nov 19, 2017, 8:45 am
#778
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,453
You miss the point about AAgent has to put in a note on your reservation that you dont have a middle name. Many AAgents dont realize it but the current process is, the system assume you have a middle name and if that part is missing, the ticket issuance would be held up, unless there is a note in the reservation.
Our AA profiles have no middle name but our passports have. We have traveled on CX and other partners (QR being the most frequently used) with and without middle names in the past. Some AAgents would ask about middle name information some did not. Often it is just middle initial.
We once had 2 AA awards on QR - one ticketed with middle initial one did not. I asked QR whether this would causeproblem. QR assured me multiple times that they did not care as long as the First and Last name match with what were on the passport. CX used to be that too. Our last trip on CX in Sept was with AS miles. It only had middle initial, not middle name, on our AS issued CX partner award tickets.
The CX requirement of having middle name included in the passenger's name is relatively recent. Many AAgents are still not realize this is now mandated to issue ticket with CX segment hence the often hang up on issuing the tickets.
Our AA profiles have no middle name but our passports have. We have traveled on CX and other partners (QR being the most frequently used) with and without middle names in the past. Some AAgents would ask about middle name information some did not. Often it is just middle initial.
We once had 2 AA awards on QR - one ticketed with middle initial one did not. I asked QR whether this would causeproblem. QR assured me multiple times that they did not care as long as the First and Last name match with what were on the passport. CX used to be that too. Our last trip on CX in Sept was with AS miles. It only had middle initial, not middle name, on our AS issued CX partner award tickets.
The CX requirement of having middle name included in the passenger's name is relatively recent. Many AAgents are still not realize this is now mandated to issue ticket with CX segment hence the often hang up on issuing the tickets.
Nov 19, 2017, 8:47 am
#779
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: PHX & AGP
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hilton Gold
Posts: 11,453
CX wants PNR name match with passport.
If your AA profile has middle name, it does NOT get included in CX PNR.
AA uses SABRE. CX/BA/QF (to name a few) uses Amadeus.
As to your question on AA flight, it could just be AA has no issues including AAdvantage middle name on SABRE PNRs but drops it when building an Amadeus PNR. This combined with CX requring full name match could be the issue.
If your AA profile has middle name, it does NOT get included in CX PNR.
AA uses SABRE. CX/BA/QF (to name a few) uses Amadeus.
As to your question on AA flight, it could just be AA has no issues including AAdvantage middle name on SABRE PNRs but drops it when building an Amadeus PNR. This combined with CX requring full name match could be the issue.
Nov 19, 2017, 9:47 am
#780
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: NYC
Programs: AA 2MM, Bonvoy LTT, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 14,638
I did a dummy booking on aa.com for BA flight. Whatever I put in Middle Name field on AA did NOT make it to BA.