PUCCI GALORE

Firstly please do not presume to assume that I am wearing knickers as per your exquisite turn of phrase. As far as I am concerned this is a question of credibility. We are asked to believe scuttlebuck from Airline Representatives (whatever that may mean) or Baggage Handlers. These good folk are well known as traders in Hearsay and Gossip. Why does any of this matter? Because, in the instance of American Airlines it will mean the difference in time and convenience to people making connections.There have already been a couple of posts about this exact issue. That in the fulness of time AA will return all operations to T3 is almost certain; Iberia I find very diiicult to believe quite frankly.

Bear in mind, I have not seen anything anywhere else to substantiate any of this. It may be out there on which case I am sure that we will have a linl provided. Personally I have as much interest in who got the scoop as I have in the boyhood of Mao Tes Tung , what is important is the accuracy as the plans of many could be affected.

orbitmic

Indeed, as PUCCI rightly (as always of course ) says, you are mistaking scepticism for frustration or bitterness. I don't think anyone here has "their" insiders, but the most basic thing when you hear people volunteering a "scoop" is to try and cross-check the information from sources that you know as reliable as well as try and assess their coherence/logic.

In terms of cross checking sources and information, the people mentioned upthread are unfortunately unverifiable by any of us, so it is not unnatural to look for other possible sources. Heathrow is hardly a tiny provincial airport, and AA is hardly a minor unknown airline, so given the amount of interest consistently devoted to both, you can't blame us for wondering why it is that no other source of information - including a large range of them which are consistently well-connected with the powers to be in this particular neck of the wood - seem to have heard any of this, not even as a rumour/gossip. Indeed, why are AA and HAL not communicating openly about it if, as is suggested above, there is now a "confirmed" date? Would it not be in their interest to publicise the change as early as possible and notably write to affected customers asap to avoid any risk of passengers missing their departure which AA would then have to reaccommodate as it would be their fault for not informing them about the terminal change? And with due respect, baggage handling teams are not necessarily the most central part of an operation when it comes to terminal negotiations (nor are they typically involved with commercial questions as to what airlines prefer or what is their motivation in terms of IRROP'ed passengers and so on).

As for the question of coherence of information and logic, we have now had three different dates volunteered in less than a week, the suggested block move goes against everything that had been said so far in terms of the JFK flights move being more or less permanent (also in the context of BA's future move to T8 at JFK), and the suggestion that IB would suddenly move to T3 to join AA for no obvious reason instead of staying at T5 sounds, to say the least, immensely counter-intuitive if not frankly shocking, and I would imagine BA and IB to welcome such a suggestion with absolute fury (apart from the fact that it would harm IB connections, not least because splitting LHR-MAD flights which are in effect a completely integrated BA-IB operation across two completely separate terminals would be totally crazy for both airlines - indeed that is why BA used to have their HEL flights from T3 when they used to operate them - unless BA also move MAD flights to T3 but that would go against their entire terminal strategy to date which is precisely to keep most routes with heavy connections and business pax in T5).

Now, it does not mean that the rumours are necessarily wrong, maybe they will all be confirmed before long, but there are - for the time being at least - other possibilities, including the possibility that the tips were received in perfectly good faith but resulted from a message being transmitted from one person to another, to another, etc with some subtle changes of meaning occurring in the process that could prove important. This is something which happens frequently with Galley FM and similar information routes. So before one bites such a particularly important and consequential hook (in case you wondered, it would probably affect the travel plans of many of us here very directly) and with absolutely no offence or lack of gratitude intended towards the people, whom we do not know personally, but who passed on useful information that they have been given, many of us will naturally continue to look for ways to either recoup, complement, or if need be reinterpret/qualify everything that we can until some sort of public announcement comes through.

KARFA

I thoroughly agree. Anyone who has been around for more than a few years will know Galley FM is not exactly always correct. Whilst no one is criticising any insiders who kindly share things they have heard on to FT, something like this has to be viewed with caution for all the reasons noted above. Also information like this can easily be misconstrued due to Chinese whispers, perhaps starting with some kernel of truth but ending up in a completely different form by the time it is passed on for the umpteenth time.

It’s a shame there is nothing officially released to confirm any of this of course. I guess we will see what happens soon, but 12 July is getting closer so it won’t be long.

tjcxx

Madama Puccini,

Just to take this on another tack, as it were, scuttlebuck is actually scuttlebutt. The "butt" referring, of course, not to that which is within the afore-mentioned knickers, but to the barrel, of water, at which the crew gathered to gossip (and drink). I believe it is commonly referred to these days, more prosaically, as "water-cooler". !

orbitmic

Have you just transformed Flyertalk's very own James Bond girl into an opera composer?!

PUCCI GALORE

You, KARFA and indeed tjcxx have all made my morning. Here was me debating which were the most sensible shoes to go to a picnic of the Résidence where our house is in Brittany and along come two of my favourite men and a new man to make me laugh. I have informed my husband that I had been referred to as a James Bond Girl and an Opera Diva. He, probably having seen me without make up and aware of my singing which probably resembles Donald Duck with tonsillitis remarked “Drama Queen more like”

So as we will only know for sure when some body be it the airlines in question or Heathrow choose to inform us all with a press release; we are somewhat in Limbo. We must watch this space.

Well you can, I’ve got a picnic to attend and given that it will probably be like Jurassic Park where Terminal Moves are synonymous with the.Death March. Xxxxx

scubadu

That sounds exactly like most people on FT to me...

"Viewed with caution," "Chinese whispers" Good grief this sounds like a Tom Clancy novel.

Folks, it's a possible terminal change that will likely not happen (but I suppose it certainly could). Come in off the ledge. That said, for those traveling "across the pond," if a terminal change is the worst thing that happens to your travels at Heathrow this summer I'd suggest you consider yourself quite lucky and move on with life.

Regards

orbitmic

well, with “will likely not happen”, you are in fact a lot more negative than the rest of us.

as for the “considering themselves lucky”, you are just forgetting the very small detail that if what some here have reported does happen as they suggest, it is hundreds of passengers who will find themselves with itineraries cancelled because they won’t meet MCT and that 1) with only few days notice, 2) at the height of the super peak period for transatlantic flights when very many flights are already full and more will be every day, 3) with effects that will combine with (rather than replace) those of other events I presume you are hinting at such as strikes, staff shortage related cancellations and the likes.

it is not “either/or” and for many people, if this happens, it will be a very big deal.

scubadu

I'm not forgetting anything, what I'm saying is everything has context. Everything you are listing off is happening to passengers all over Europe/UK, everyday it seems. This is the "summer of chaos" I don't like it, but it is what it is. As much as I'd like to return to Europe/UK this summer, I'm not doing so precisely because everything you've listed happens whether or not there is any terminal change in play. I'm not going to let me desire for "revenge travel" swamp my common sense. But for those who willingly choose to jump into the lions den, it's quite likely you are going to get bitten, if not by a terminal change at LHR, then quite likely be something else.

I have no idea if it will or won't happen, but the "usual suspects" from the BA forum seem unequivocally confident that the poster with the "inside information" is incorrect. However, it's the usual suspects (as often occurs in the BA forum) who continue to fan the flames and give oxygen to the "rumor."

Regards

orbitmic

hmm… can you give us examples of other terminal changes occurring elsewhere in Europe with less than two weeks notice? I must have missed them.

That is what this (part of the) thread is about and as I was saying, it is not either/or but something that comes to add to other more general issues you are mentioning (and which, by the way, they are currently a lot worse in the London area than in many other parts of Europe).

You’ve made your calculations and decided that you didn’t have to travel to Europe and that other risks were enough for you not to do so. Totally fine and entirely your prerogative. Plenty of other people don’t have a choice, and others do and have decided the other Tisha were fine by then, which does not in any way mean they’d be happy to get an entirely different issue thrown at then.

The truism is that of course, if you are not planning to fly AA (or for that matter IB) transitions at Lhr I’m coming months, then whether AA or IB change terminals or not makes exactly zero difference to you. It is exactly as obvious that to other people who are, it does, and I’m not too sure what your point is telling them it doesn’t when you are not in their situation?

UKtravelbear

But a short notice terminal change only adds to the chaos when airlines and airports should be doing their utmost to reduce it!

Whoever thinks that a terminal switch during the peak summer travel period is a good idea needs their head examining. The rumour is that it's not just AA is moving but also (for some unfathomable reason) IB!

Did they not think of the impact on passengers not only with connections that would need to be rebooked - much of that is automated but it would still generare a lot of unnecessary calls to already stretched call centres?

I've just seen that the first post in this entire thread has been changed to add this

UPDATE: American Airlines will consolidate all AA LHR operations Terminal 3 effective July 1, 2022

BUT there is no link to any actual source for this. Now JDiver is a respected member of FT but there is still zero official announcement of any terminal change.

And this change basically makes a mockery of this that AA posted in March when they said the split between T5 and T3 would last until the 30th October (when the summer season ends) and trumpetting the benefots to passengers.

https://news.aa.com/news/news-detail...3/default.aspx

PUCCI GALORE

Actually what the Usual Suspects are saying is that we will wait until we actually have difficulty with the timeline and the complete lack of announcement or comment elsewhere. I really do not understand what is meant by "Revenge Travel" and frankly am not greatly concerned. When the travel plans of many could be concerned, it would be most helpful if we all knew for certain. As I say, it is the alleged move of Iberia that I find the most astonishing.

Regards

Ms Keyser Söze

Garimi

...and Iberia kick own close partner by prefer to give out baggade opertaion away from BA,

when BA was handling AA bags MBR was 150-250 bags missing per day. Aa reduced it to 10 MBR now.
so BA can miss 15 times more bags...why? They prioritise own bags...dont care about overs so I thinkIberia had enough...now temporary AA will handle iberia bags at LHR till end of year.

orbitmic

The suggestion that an airline would switch from T5 to T3 to solve baggage issue is rather comical.

First, changing terminals to deal with luggage situation makes about as much sense as changing plane manufacturer when you are unhappy with catering. There are plenty of handling agents to choose from at LHR, and when airlines are unhappy, it is easy to give the next contract to someone else without in any way needing to change terminal.

Second, luggage gets a lot more lost in connections than on o/d, and it is more likely to get lost with a terminal change than in a single terminal, so moving operations in such a way that most of your connections would be inter-terminal would be about as dumb a move as it gets if trying to reduce baggage problems.

Third, by far the worst affected terminals for luggage issues in recent days have been T2 and T3 with infamous "baggage mountains" piling up earlier this week. ‘Baggage mountain’ leads to Heathrow cancellations, as easyJet cuts schedule | Airline industry | The Guardian to the point that airlines were asked to cancel 10% of flights for a few days across those two terminals due to luggage processing issues.

So quite frankly, for IB to decide on a T5 to T3 based on a hope to improve luggage handling would be one of the most bizarre (that's the polite version) rationales one could think of.

Garimi

First for all
Iberia main terminal is T3 and was moved to T5 only because of covid.
I didn't suggest what Iberia is moving back to T3 to have less missing bags.
I only wrote what Iberia is fed up with BA handling their bags and prefer to start own bagging operations what was reported earlier, but because of time issue AA will handling their bags till end of year.

and end of all T5 was build and design to be BA terminal only covid time make only temporary change of it.

I though what AA and BA make some deal to handling together passengers (First class) at JFK and LHR T5, but sadly this is not the case, I prefer liked AA be T5 and it saved me time when I had problem with AA ticket and Flying BA F to JFK. It was resolved in 40min at T5, because of AA ticket presents where.