Jan 3, 2018, 5:05 pm
Last edit by: Prospero
AA has increased award availability at the SAAver / MileSAAver level, apparently at the cost of reducing the availability of nonstop and direct routing and increasing availability requiring connections using married segment logic.
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: “Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space they’ve opened up is on connecting flights. They’re offering married segment availability — award space that’s highly restrictive...”
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game American’s New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when you’re searching for award space... you’ll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Link to Boarding Area: Sunday Reader Question: What are married segments?
Link to Worldspan page with extensive information on MSL and coding.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
This means those originating travel at one hub may well find themselves forced to connect through another hub - whose residents will also be required to connect through another hub. This is suspected to be a way of accommodating SAAver awards without competing with those purchasing more convenient nonstop routing. See post #17 by ashill.
Gary Leff: “Cranky Flier got American to confirm last week that much of the space they’ve opened up is on connecting flights. They’re offering married segment availability — award space that’s highly restrictive...”
See American Significantly Increases Coach Award Space On Connecting Flights, By Cranky Flier on Dec 21, 2017
How to Game American’s New Connecting Flight Award Availability to Get the Ticket You Want, by Gary Leff on December 26, 2017 but see post #75 by Psyclone*Jack; this loophole may now be closed.
Married Segment Logic and Effects on Awards
"When selling seats for through flights and the desired inventory is not available, you cannot opt to sell the flight point-to-point. If sold point-to-point, the error response MULTIPLE SEGMENTS FOR SAME FLIGHT - SELL AS ONE SEGMENT will be received, indicating this booking is not allowed. Overriding the error check by ending the PNR twice is not acceptable." Link to FT thread; see wikipost info by JonNYC and hillrider.
"Sometimes when you’re searching for award space... you’ll find that some seats will show as available when you search for them from origin to destination, but when you call to book the flights segment-by-segment, those flights show as unavailable."
"Married segment logic is a tool used by airlines that restricts availability based on origin and destination, rather than by segments."(DCTA, on Boarding Area)
Married segment logic controls routings based on origin and destination, rather than segment-by-segment availability. Boarding Area
From Amadeus: Married Segment Control Link
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
Amadeus Married Segment Control is a revenue maximisation tool that ensures that airline revenue management decisions, made at availability time, are applied throughout the booking process. It prevents agents bypassing availability controls, based on origin and destination (O&D) information. It also improves both load factors and revenue forecasting accuracy.
Key benefits
- Ensures more effective forecasting by preventing O&D misuse and matching revenue forecasts with final revenues.
- Improves consistency of sales processes by controlling travel agent selling behaviour.
- Fully customisable and flexible solution that meets airline unique system requirements.
Older posts have been archived off to https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/amer...nnections.html
More award availability restricted by married segments / connections
Dec 26, 2018, 11:37 am
#301
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP, HH Diamond
Posts: 2,561
Award flight: DFW-HNL NS available as part of a two segment award but not from DFW
We want to fly to HNL in the spring. I can find good F award availability for aaa-DFW-HNL where the long segment is on a 772 and has lie flat seats. But when I try to get an award for a DFW based passenger DfW-HNL they won't offer the non-stop options. Any help navigating this or are we just SOL?
Dec 26, 2018, 12:11 pm
#302
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: MSY
Programs: AA Plat Pro, UA Plat, VS Silver, Marriott Titanium, Hyatt Explorist
Posts: 2,531
SOL. You've fallen into the married segment trap. See if you can tag on a DFW-aaa flight, or rent a car and drive. Try GGG, TYR, ACT, SHV, SPS, TXK, CLL, IAH, etc...
Dec 26, 2018, 2:17 pm
#303
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: PDX
Programs: AS MVP, HH Diamond
Posts: 2,561
Aaa-DFW are 1600 miles apart. We’d be flying from the west coast to DFW to make this work, which would be worth it to accompany mom from DFW to HNL.
I don’t understand the married segment concept - why does AA care? We’re talking about award miles here and they are happy to make the 1 stops available but not the nonstop? I will check from AUS as that may be doable. Thanks!
I don’t understand the married segment concept - why does AA care? We’re talking about award miles here and they are happy to make the 1 stops available but not the nonstop? I will check from AUS as that may be doable. Thanks!
Dec 26, 2018, 3:27 pm
#304
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,625
Aaa-DFW are 1600 miles apart. We’d be flying from the west coast to DFW to make this work, which would be worth it to accompany mom from DFW to HNL.
I don’t understand the married segment concept - why does AA care? We’re talking about award miles here and they are happy to make the 1 stops available but not the nonstop? I will check from AUS as that may be doable. Thanks!
I don’t understand the married segment concept - why does AA care? We’re talking about award miles here and they are happy to make the 1 stops available but not the nonstop? I will check from AUS as that may be doable. Thanks!
There is a whole thread about married sector availability and suspect that this will get merged in
That there is availability for AAA-HNL via DFW does not mean that there is availability for DFW-HNL
If you are happy to fly to HNL via DFW from whatever secret airport it is, then you can easily go ahead and book it
Jan 3, 2019, 1:38 am
#306
Join Date: Jul 2015
Programs: SPG Gold
Posts: 38
AA Award Call Center Getting Worse?
Hi Guys,
So I've been trying to book a fairly simple international itinerary that follows all routing rules and max number of stops etc but the agents on AA are refusing to book it even though each segment of my itinerary had saver level award availability. In the past I would be able to find the flights I wanted with saver level space and call them and feed them the flight info to book, never took more than 20 minutes or so from start to finish. Am I missing something here or is there a new policy? Multiple agents are saying that they can only book me on flights that their computer allows them to. Very confused here.
Edit: I realized this was married segment logic non sense. Any ideas or tips to get around this or at least mitigate? Any advice much appreciated!
So I've been trying to book a fairly simple international itinerary that follows all routing rules and max number of stops etc but the agents on AA are refusing to book it even though each segment of my itinerary had saver level award availability. In the past I would be able to find the flights I wanted with saver level space and call them and feed them the flight info to book, never took more than 20 minutes or so from start to finish. Am I missing something here or is there a new policy? Multiple agents are saying that they can only book me on flights that their computer allows them to. Very confused here.
Edit: I realized this was married segment logic non sense. Any ideas or tips to get around this or at least mitigate? Any advice much appreciated!
Last edited by FlyerGuy10; Jan 3, 2019 at 2:12 am
Jan 3, 2019, 4:44 am
#307
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Austin
Posts: 4,629
Nope. This is exactly how they want the system to work now. Individual segment availability no longer means route availability and they are serious about enforcement. As with all of AA's downgrades your primary option is to accept the new reality and change your consumer behavior.
Last edited by millionmiler; Jan 3, 2019 at 7:05 pm
Jan 3, 2019, 7:32 am
#308
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2004
Location: DFW/DAL
Programs: AA Lifetime PLT, AS MVPG, HH Diamond, NCL Platinum Plus, MSC Diamond
Posts: 21,422
If you realized this was due to the current issues with married segment availability, why blame it on the call center?
("AA Award Call Center Getting Worse")
("AA Award Call Center Getting Worse")
Jan 3, 2019, 8:27 am
#309
Suspended
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: FIND ME ON TWITTER FOR THE LATEST
Posts: 27,730
Hi Guys,
So I've been trying to book a fairly simple international itinerary that follows all routing rules and max number of stops etc but the agents on AA are refusing to book it even though each segment of my itinerary had saver level award availability. In the past I would be able to find the flights I wanted with saver level space and call them and feed them the flight info to book, never took more than 20 minutes or so from start to finish. Am I missing something here or is there a new policy? Multiple agents are saying that they can only book me on flights that their computer allows them to. Very confused here.
Edit: I realized this was married segment logic non sense. Any ideas or tips to get around this or at least mitigate? Any advice much appreciated!
So I've been trying to book a fairly simple international itinerary that follows all routing rules and max number of stops etc but the agents on AA are refusing to book it even though each segment of my itinerary had saver level award availability. In the past I would be able to find the flights I wanted with saver level space and call them and feed them the flight info to book, never took more than 20 minutes or so from start to finish. Am I missing something here or is there a new policy? Multiple agents are saying that they can only book me on flights that their computer allows them to. Very confused here.
Edit: I realized this was married segment logic non sense. Any ideas or tips to get around this or at least mitigate? Any advice much appreciated!
Jan 3, 2019, 8:37 am
#310
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: KHOU/KIAH
Programs: AA EXP | Marriott Bonvoy Titanium| Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 11,268
In general, the EXP desk is progressively getting more and more ghastly. I tried to book a simple CX award ticket and it resulted in me having to HUACA after wasting time.
however, this is not one of those cases.
however, this is not one of those cases.
Jan 3, 2019, 9:14 am
#311
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: DCA
Posts: 7,769
Stupid question but since I haven't booked any awards with partners not bookable on AA.com since they introduced the married segment logic, I don't know the answer - how does it work with those partners? You just check availability as in the old days (via combination of AA, BA, QF, etc.) and call them up and they give you a yay or nay? Just keep feeding them itineraries and they say "Nope, nope, nope"?
Jan 3, 2019, 9:24 am
#312
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: SF Bay Area
Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, Hyatt Globalist, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum, Mlife NOIR
Posts: 320
AA call center is AWFUL.
Over the last couple weeks, I have only once been directly connected to EXP. The other times, I have had 2h30m, 10m, 25m, 4h, and 1h wait times / callback. (On UA, I have never waited.) Are they not prioritizing calls?
Moreover, the agents will always agree to a minor change (“Sure, no problem, in putting you on an earlier SFO-LAX so that you can be sure you catch your (unchanged) LAX-LHR flight! I noticed too that SFO-LAX has been consistently delayed this past week”) only to have you find out 20 minutes into the call that there will be a $7000 change fee and difference in fare, and asking for your credit card number.
Really unbelievable.
Over the last couple weeks, I have only once been directly connected to EXP. The other times, I have had 2h30m, 10m, 25m, 4h, and 1h wait times / callback. (On UA, I have never waited.) Are they not prioritizing calls?
Moreover, the agents will always agree to a minor change (“Sure, no problem, in putting you on an earlier SFO-LAX so that you can be sure you catch your (unchanged) LAX-LHR flight! I noticed too that SFO-LAX has been consistently delayed this past week”) only to have you find out 20 minutes into the call that there will be a $7000 change fee and difference in fare, and asking for your credit card number.
Really unbelievable.
Jan 3, 2019, 9:24 am
#313
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Denver, CO
Programs: AA EXP, IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 72
Can't speak for the award center at AA as I just book mine on their website, but I can say that I've seen a downfall in politeness and overall "care" from the EXP and Platinum desks. Where they used to answer with a personal, enthusiastic greeting, they now seem to be agitated at any call and don't care about your status.
Jan 3, 2019, 11:07 am
#314
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: New York
Posts: 799