I like the new system as I retired and am no longer an exp after being one forever. Now it is easier and cheaper to pay for F than ever before and I do when I want to. The point in all this to me is that AA doesn't have it in them to be transparent ( my new favorite word for telling the truth) and are just going to alienate their good customers.

I echo abk. At this point, and with the direction AA is headed, it will be more beneficial to buy the class you want and chase EQMs, as that's where the value is. Might as well get to EXP and hit up the 4 system wide upgrades, and then just suggest a status match elsewhere on another airline.

(If you're NYC-based, it almost makes more sense to splurge $5k and get Jetsmarter where you'll be treated better, and fly private to places like Miami and Chicago and LAX daily for free (and LHR on an occasion), than have to crawl to the airport and deal with the shenanigans there.

I think that less than seven day airfare does make the small premium for First versus Coach an easy decision as noted. Considering the recent analyst notes, AA feels they have no choice but to sacrifice elites to get that higher ticket price average expectation.

I am going to share some good news. The upgrade changes (which I have decided is my main benefit after RDM use on partners) has made the decision to fly other carriers after 50k much easier (especially because AA also won't commit to 75k status for 2016 EQM). Thanks AA!

Rasheed

I was scheduled to fly DEN/DFW/MIA this morning but the 5:02AM flight to DFW was cancelled. Since both DFW and ORD are still a mess I had the EXP desk reroute me DEN/LAX/MIA flying on the 777 to MIA (extra miles will ensure I requalify for EXP by month end). The DEN/LAX flight is oversold by 10 in Y but six open seats in F. Two paxs on the upgrade list (at T-2) with me being number one. You would think AA would go ahead and upgrade me and number 2 to at least open a couple more seats in Y.

I was on the reverse of your DEN/DFW yesterday morning and also started early. I failed to appreciate this weekend could be a surge of vacation travel before dropping off for a while after Labor Day. Inbound from DCA to DFW on AA2707 leaving at 0538 I was #1 & upgraded 5m before boarding. It was the last seat. Huge standby list. I asked the GA if she was going to clear upgrades, maybe a standby would like my 14F exit. She said 'whoa I should do that.'

This flight is never packed. I was surprised to see Y go from 40 open to -15 with standbys from T-15 to board time. I don't think there were cancellations in the system.

Leaving DFW for DEN on AA2298 at 1055 yesterday. Was #3, not upgraded, exit was fine. >20 standbys and this was way before the WX rolled in. I think the narrowing spread between purchased F and Y is a factor and I have taken advantage of that sometimes, but unless it was under $100 no way for a 1.5hr leg.

Agree -- don't understand why they won't process upgrades until the gate in these oversell situations. They zero out F inventory anyway, so it's not like they're trying to sell the seats, but at least you'll still get the upgrade in the end, even if you have to wait a bit longer.

Yes, agree. I think we all understand this is just the tip of the iceberg of the legacies testing the indifference curve of transient traveler (ie non-corporate) loyalty. But there is a point where they will stop.

The downsides for the legacies of crossing the yet-to-be-defined and always-moving line where changes to the FF program dilute loyalty too much are significant. It's more than just our revenue on the plane-- it's also the other ways they monetize our loyalty; one example is the exclusive Citi/Chase/AXP partnerships that have become very lucrative over the past 5-10 years. The success of that model is tied directly to loyalty. And that example just scratches the surface.

Unfortunately, vs other geographies, we dont have that much LCC choice and the higher end choices such as Surf/et al are still tiny. To your point, that will change slowly and our indifference curves will shift as they do.

Ultimately I think we understand that all of this is cyclical and though AA is in the very early stages of thinking about testing our loyalty, others such as DL are further along. We're probably in the early innings of an extended down-trend for FF benefits, but it will cycle back. Yes, they're going to continue to come up w/ways to test our loyalty, but the $$$ value of loyalty is just too high for the legacies to become indifferent to how we react.

Just a few years ago, AA was doing routine double EQM promotions and literally giving away EXP to other airlines' elites (remember the 8+8 SWU deals -- 8 SWUs when matching and 8 again when locking in status?). Now, the pendulum has swung the other way, presumably at least in part due to less competition and lower fuel prices. We'll see what happens next.

I was on AA4474 this morning. Upgraded 4 hrs 30 mins before departure time.

I'd suggest AA should not mentioned T-100, T-72 etc., just say complimentary upgrade maybe offered based on availability and upgrade is based elite status packing order etc., so that people don't get their hopes up ...

Given the amount of confusion the windows seem to cause, I'm inclined to agree. Just give out all upgrades at the gate; elites still are prioritized according to status, paid F travelers can more easily SDFC or be accommodated in case of IRROPS, and AA might sell a few more last-minute tickets. Everyone wins.

I disagree--that's not fair when you have to pay to check a bag only to find out later you're upgraded. I especially disagree when it comes to international flights. I'd like to share an experience I just had on my RT to Paris. I can confirm that even on long haul international flights, upgrades are being doled out at the gate!

On the flight from BOS to CDG I was in Business (on the old Boeing where it is a 2/2 configuration) I kept checking in the club to see if the seat next to me was taken...it was not. As I was boarding the plane, I asked the gate agent if the seat next to me was still open...it was. Right before the door closed, a breathless passenger came to sit next to me saying he was just upgraded. This is T-15 minutes or so!!! The SAME thing happened on my return CDG-CLT. My client had been on the upgrade wait list for weeks. She had given her CC information and if a spot came open it was hers. It came open again about 15 minutes before departure. The problem is, she had checked a 2nd bag and already paid for it. She was entitled to a 2nd checked bag for free in Business and is now trying to get her money back.
On international flights, I really don't see the point of waiting until boarding to upgrade. It would be hard for another passenger to buy a last minute business class ticket and clear passport and security, and get to the gate all within an hour. (and the gates close 15-20 minutes or so before departure)

Those who do get upgraded at the last possible moment are not getting all the benefits, yet being charged the same (miles & money or SWU) . You miss: The extra bag allowance, Expedited screening line, Expedited passport line, Admission to the club and Ability to pre-order your meal so you're guaranteed your first choice. That's a lot of value added for Business Class passengers that you miss out on, yet have "paid for."

Safe travels to everyone.

How many elites do you suppose are paying to check a bag before getting their upgrades?

And the majority of your complaint pertains to international flights, where upgrade windows never have applied (as pointed out many times in this thread already).

That's not really the point though is it? IMHO just another of the NEW AA's attempt to grab revenue without being transparent about it.

I don't even bother with our corporate travel agent anymore--it's a PITA and they can never get the same prices I can through the aa.bomb website. At least their website is a lot more user-friendly than united.bomb.

How do you mean?