TrojanHorse

I left CO for a number of reasons but I will also say that one of the reasons high on the list was the co-pay for BF seats and to HNL; EVIPs were a huge draw to AA.

I would agree, when I left CO I never went back except to burn OP miles. When I went to AA, you want to run up your balance in AA so you give them (the new carrier) all of your business. Hence making it even less likely to go back to the carrier you just jumped. AA needs to make sure that its got the right balance and once it crosses that invisible line, people will leave without saying a word and it will be too late when they finally realize it.

Fly AA J all the way

Seriously, I wish there was a $50 copay on mileage upgrades on transcon widebodies.

Also, my take on the HI policy: make EXPs burn their VIPs on that route (where AA isn't losing a lot of money by giving away the big seats) so that they run out when flying to Europe/Asia/South America.

brp

How do you make EXPs do that? Some sort of contractual obligation when they get the eVIPs? between this stuff and the simply incorrect stuff, I must say that you never cease to amaze me Keep up the good work ^

Cheers.

Fly AA J all the way

I simply meant that by making VIP use more attractive on routes like ORD-HNL, they will be able to get people to burn them on such. Of course you can't force them to do that, but by making it more attractive, you might just convince them to. And while it still wouldn't make good sense, I would be counting on the "impulse buy" mentality of those who aren't really thinking long-term.

Robert5988

Exactly my sentiments; and exactly why I am considering if myself and family have crossed that 'invisible line'.

I am UK based and have been PLT for 4 years qualifying(just) each year on flights to USA. My wife is also PLT, one daughter GLD and 2 other children and partners also fly AA to USA once or twice a year.

The initial reason I chose AA was MRTC(I am 6ft 5”) I also upgraded a few times before co-pay was introduced. Those advantages outweighed the fact that flights to my normal destination(MCO) are indirect.

The abolition of MRTC, introduction of co-pay and now an increase in co-pay have me thinking that we might be wiser to use the half a million miles we have in our accounts on some flights in FC and then switch to another airline that flies direct. I also have absolutely no confidence that this trend to dilute the advantages of being an elite member will not continue.

I appreciate that AA must make decisions on a commercial basis and the loss of 7 customers, who only buy coach fares, will be of little consequence, but every change AA make will bring a few more customers closer to that invisible line and deter others from flying AA.

The ‘Law of Diminishing Returns’ will even apply to AA.

lalala

We pay on average 700-1000 dollars for each flight we book on AA to London and beyond, so I'm not buying these stories that I'm on a deep discounted fare.

I'm not amused.

lala

myfrogger

AA's response to my letter via email:

Dear myfrogger,

I have been asked to respond to your e-mail to Mr. Kurt Stache, the
President of AAdvantage Marketing, since my responsibilities include
resolving AAdvantage program issues on behalf of our members.

I understand your dismay at the new co-payment policies recently
released and scheduled to go into effect on March 1, 2007. These changes were not made lightly, and I can assure you that we considered every
possible scenario before we made the decision to update our upgrade
awards to fit our changing market.

The reality today is that the disparity between Discount and Premium
Class fares is too great to be offset by miles alone. Our $250 co-pay,
first initiated in December 2004, has proven to be too low to cover the
"gap" between Discount and Premium Class fares. The addition and
adjustments of the co-pay allows members to continue to use their miles
to upgrade to the next class of service even if they purchase discounted tickets.

We analyzed the idea of increasing the mileage award amount for specific upgrade tickets as an alternative to adding and raising the co-payment
for select upgrade awards. Raising the mileage level would give many
members less opportunity since it would require them to have more miles
available. Members already have the opportunity to use MileSAAverSM or
AAnytime® awards for travel in our premium cabins. The Upgrade Award
provides the same opportunity, but at a lower mileage level since it is
combined with a revenue ticket. Supplementing that low fare with a
co-pay enables members to continue to upgrade for the same amount of
mileage they are accustomed to.

We don't want to reduce members' opportunities to upgrade by reducing
the types of fares that are eligible. Unlike many of our competitors, we understand that customers want low fares and still want the opportunity
to upgrade them. Furthermore, we think it's inherently unfair to expect
customers to purchase a higher fare ticket with the hope of upgrading
when there's no guarantee that the upgrade will be confirmed. At
American Airlines, we won't collect the co-pay until the upgrade is
confirmed.

Additionally, it is possible to purchase a coach fare that does not
require the co-pay for these upgrades. Full-Fare Economy Class tickets
(booking codes Y and B) continue to be upgradeable with no co-pay and
with lower mileage levels for the applicable Upgrade Award. Full-Fare
Business class tickets (booking code J) are also upgradeable with no
co-pay.

Also, please remember that if you request your upgrade prior to March 1, 2007 but don't get it confirmed until after March 1st, you will not be
required to pay the co-pay to Hawaii or the increased co-pay on
international upgrades. These new co-pays will only apply to upgrade
bookings made on or after March 1, 2007. We understand that these new
policies will affect some current bookings. By giving our customers over two months notice, we hope to minimize the impact of the increase. But,
frankly, no matter when such a change is announced, there will
unfortunately be customers whose plans are impacted.

We sincerely regret your dissatisfaction with the changes to our current mileage upgrade policy. While the AAdvantage program has been a success
story, and other airlines have since established similar programs, it is to be expected that certain aspects of the program will be more
worthwhile for some members than for others, and that some parts of the
program will be considered less favorably than others.

myfrogger, we want you to know that we truly appreciate your feedback
and hope that these new adjustments to our upgrade awards will not mar
the otherwise successful and enjoyable business relationship we have
enjoyed thus far with you. Thank you for participating in the AAdvantage program.

Regards,

Ms. Elisa G.
Manager on Duty
AAdvantage Customer Service
American Airlines

brp

Sounds like the response one would expect to get. Very detailed, though, with specifics. Since they clearly weren't going to say "oh, jeez, we'll repeal this right now", I think that was a pretty reasonable and balanced letter.

Cheers.

USAFAN

What?

Why do you care how much somebody paid for a trip? Who is eligible to sit next, near to you...?

USAFAN

[QUOTE=myfrogger;6891250]AA's response to my letter via email:

Dear myfrogger,

You should delete your name (change to myfrogger) from this canned letter...

myfrogger

HUH?? I already removed my name and inserted my sn instead... I don't understand what you're trying to tell me.

oklAAhoma

I wonder that, too.
And I'd also like to know how so many FTers know so much about what their cabin mates spent on travel. It seems like everyone, except me, can tell the difference amongst the more deserving full fare pax, the cheapo-fare upgrade moochers, and the award riffraff. Apparently it's obvious at a glance... so why can't I see it?

Robert5988

Last paragraph - Mr Y*****

justageek

On the whole, I think the AA response was pretty reasonable. In particular, I found very persuasive the argument that the UA scheme requires you to buy a high-fare coach ticket before you know whether your upgrade will clear--if your upgrade does not clear, there is then no way to refund down to the cheap coach ticket you would have bought if you had known you would not be able to upgrade, and the airline has basically "tricked" you into buying a high-fare coach ticket from which you get zero benefit.

That is a huge rip-off built into the scheme used by UA (and I think some other airlines), and AA should be applauded for using a much more customer-friendly scheme. ^ ^

As a minor quibble, I would like to have seen an explanation of the statement that "Our $250 co-pay, first initiated in December 2004, has proven to be too low to cover the "gap" between Discount and Premium Class fares." Surely Ms. Gonzalez doesn't mean she thinks $500 or $600 is the actual difference in the price AA charges between a J fare and an S or T fare. So, how do they determine the size of the "gap" that they are trying to fill? Perhaps they are trying to find the price at which the number of upgrade requests on each flight exactly equals (but does not exceed) the number of upgrade seats eventually allocated on that flight. Supply and demand theory says that would be the optimal price for them to set for upgrades. If that's what they're trying to do, they should be a bit more direct rather than to talk about this abstract "gap" but then not explain what it means.

Fly AA J all the way

I think that if every time we received a response like that one to our complaints, we'd be more satisfied with AA, complain less, and accept things like the copays more readily. I thought the argument about being able to upgrade almost any fare is actually quite good. If UA or CO or any other airline said that if you bought an upgradable fare, but were unable to upgrade, they'd refund the difference between that fare and the lowest fare available when you booked, the FFs of those airlines would be overjoyed. Well, that's pretty much what AA is doing. And, just as fares rise every now and again, so must copays.

Also, anyone catch the mistake (hopefully) in the letter, regarding upgradability of business class fares? The letter mentions J fares alone are upgradable w/o copay, whereas last time I checked, D fares were also upgradable with no additional charge. Has this changed?