View Poll Results: My opinion of the announced AA - US merger is:
This is the best of all possible worlds; great idea!
33
3.93%
This portends a stronger airline, with some changes for all
192
22.88%
I am neutral - pros and cons for all
199
23.72%
I think this is a somewhat bad idea with some real challenges
226
26.94%
I am completely opposed to this merger; terrible idea!
189
22.53%
Voters: 839. You may not vote on this poll
AA - US Merger Agreement / Announcement / DOJ Action Discussion (consolidated)
Aug 15, 2013, 6:34 pm
#1981
Join Date: Jul 2013
Programs: AA EXP; UA 1k; MR Platinum; SPG Gold
Posts: 167
Aug 15, 2013, 6:48 pm
#1982
Suspended
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Programs: AAdvantage PP
Posts: 13,913
Still the legacy airlines not to mention a whole host of International carriers are courting a very small part of the traveling public, long haul paid permium. Even B6 is now jumped into the transcon portion of the market. To operate in the International arena you need a very robust worldwide route structure.
One of the problems with the US merger it still left the combined airline weak in Asia. I agree the merger did not solve AA's competitive issue completely and Parker was questionable as a CEO of an airline this size.
Remember if you are the travel manager at a multinational corporate you want your people to be able to go from point A to point B as quickly as possible. Its about keeping employees productive not well entertained by the modern IFE system. Sitting in LHR for a connecting BA flight means your employee is not on site, where you want him/her.
One of the problems with the US merger it still left the combined airline weak in Asia. I agree the merger did not solve AA's competitive issue completely and Parker was questionable as a CEO of an airline this size.
Remember if you are the travel manager at a multinational corporate you want your people to be able to go from point A to point B as quickly as possible. Its about keeping employees productive not well entertained by the modern IFE system. Sitting in LHR for a connecting BA flight means your employee is not on site, where you want him/her.
Aug 15, 2013, 7:12 pm
#1983
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,437
Nope. Fly them occasionally. I'm mostly a Kayaker, with the advantage of living in SEA, which means Kayaking on AS/AA/DL gives you AS status, but in the past 24 months I've flown AS, DL, WN, VX, AA, UA and US. ZOMG, you can survive airlines without the big F seat! 
Aug 15, 2013, 7:20 pm
#1984
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 1999
Posts: 12,097
Worry about having a profitable operation first, and getting some labor peace (you're dreaming if you think that employees aren't going to want what they were going to get under Parker, and you kind of need happy employees as opposed to a "be thankful we don't fire you" environment of fear and loathing, so that will need to be resolved).
Don't forget that AA unions were violently anti-AA in the early days of the BK, and it's the unions who undermined AA by agreeing to a payoff from Parker. It's because of these agreements (plus a $20m payoff to Horton) that AA was cornered into accepting his "offer"; without them AA could have reemerged independent from the beginning.
I am sure that the folks who run AA have not forgotten this.
Aug 15, 2013, 7:20 pm
#1985
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 866
What can the public do to stop the merger?
Does the whole merger question depend on a Federal judge now? Can members of the public write the judge to add their point of view?
Aug 15, 2013, 7:28 pm
#1986
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: San Diego, Ca
Programs: AA 2MM LT PLT; AS MVP Gold75k; HHonors Diamond; IHG PLT
Posts: 3,519
This will be a huge issue.
Don't forget that AA unions were violently anti-AA in the early days of the BK, and it's the unions who undermined AA by agreeing to a payoff from Parker. It's because of these agreements (plus a $20m payoff to Horton) that AA was cornered into accepting his "offer"; without them AA could have reemerged independent from the beginning.
Don't forget that AA unions were violently anti-AA in the early days of the BK, and it's the unions who undermined AA by agreeing to a payoff from Parker. It's because of these agreements (plus a $20m payoff to Horton) that AA was cornered into accepting his "offer"; without them AA could have reemerged independent from the beginning.
Aug 15, 2013, 7:30 pm
#1987
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DL: Silver; AA: EX PLAT; UA: Silver; HY: DIA; HH: DIA; MR: TIT
Posts: 1,708
Aug 15, 2013, 7:38 pm
#1988
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Cary, NC
Programs: AA 1MM; DL DM; Global Entry; MR Gold; HH Gold; Nat'l EC
Posts: 562
You are right, my apologies!
Aug 15, 2013, 8:06 pm
#1989
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: DCA | DEN
Programs: AA EXP/2.9mm | Marriott LT Titanium 1.6k nights | NEXUS
Posts: 981
The average EXP or PLT or GLD offers nothing as to credible and relevant or geographic market testimony so it's best to sit back and let it play.
Aug 15, 2013, 8:31 pm
#1990
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: DL: Silver; AA: EX PLAT; UA: Silver; HY: DIA; HH: DIA; MR: TIT
Posts: 1,708
Aug 15, 2013, 8:31 pm
#1991
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,473
Wonderful analysis post. You are consistently one of the sharpest minds around FT.
Just wanted to add that analyst never object to events that make lots of money for their employer (M&A) and actually don't shy away looking for targets. In any case, they mostly parrot management.
Fear not that if AA doesn't merge, all analysts will soon be singing praises for its standalone plan, its "progress", blah blah blah.
Hopefully Horton & Co. aren't drained and have already (re)started executing on the standalone AA plan, doing nothing more than the minimum contractually necessary to support Parker's nonsense. And hopefully he'll be able to retain stars like Virasb Vahidi that were fired by Parker.
Just wanted to add that analyst never object to events that make lots of money for their employer (M&A) and actually don't shy away looking for targets. In any case, they mostly parrot management.
Fear not that if AA doesn't merge, all analysts will soon be singing praises for its standalone plan, its "progress", blah blah blah.
Hopefully Horton & Co. aren't drained and have already (re)started executing on the standalone AA plan, doing nothing more than the minimum contractually necessary to support Parker's nonsense. And hopefully he'll be able to retain stars like Virasb Vahidi that were fired by Parker.
Two very good posts.
This herd mentality of "we must grow bigger to match DL and COdbaUA" is becoming tiresome. Simple merger seems to substitute for the hard work of actually running a good airline that provides good attributes that attracts customers as "choice" flyers.
The US takeover of AA still won't yield a global network matching DL and COdbaUA-- rendering US/AA uncompetitive for corporate accounts that need to send staff worldwide.
I wonder just how many corporate accounts really need global airline coverage?
Last edited by Globehopper; Aug 15, 2013 at 10:06 pm Reason: Correct typo
Aug 15, 2013, 9:22 pm
#1992
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: SEA, but up and down the coast a lot
Programs: Oceanic Airlines Gold Elite
Posts: 20,437
AA needs to do what it can well. I think the idea that they'll be the only airline with a true premium experience in the US (given that I think the writing is on the wall for UA to dump Global First) is interesting. Everyone harps on Asia, but they have valuable markets. They just need to get good at fundamentals (operations, employee relations), and I think good things will come of that.
Aug 15, 2013, 9:29 pm
#1993
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: AS, US, Hilton, BA, DL, SPG, AA, VS
Posts: 1,628
Labor peace could be a huge issue.
Don't forget that AA unions were violently anti-AA in the early days of the BK, and it's the unions who undermined AA by agreeing to a payoff from Parker. It's because of these agreements (plus a $20m payoff to Horton) that AA was cornered into accepting his "offer"; without them AA could have reemerged independent from the beginning.
I am sure that the folks who run AA have not forgotten this.
Don't forget that AA unions were violently anti-AA in the early days of the BK, and it's the unions who undermined AA by agreeing to a payoff from Parker. It's because of these agreements (plus a $20m payoff to Horton) that AA was cornered into accepting his "offer"; without them AA could have reemerged independent from the beginning.
I am sure that the folks who run AA have not forgotten this.
Aug 15, 2013, 9:40 pm
#1994
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Anywhere I need to be.
Programs: OW Emerald, *A Gold, NEXUS, GE, ABTC/APEC, South Korea SES, eIACS, PP, Hyatt Diamond
Posts: 16,046
Right.
AA serves 5 markets nonstop out of SAN. WN serves 19.
AA serves 7 markets out of BNA (cornerstones + LGA/DCA). WN serves 31.
AA serves zero markets out of OAK. (No, AS codeshares don't count.)
You should be getting the idea now. Yes, I know, in a forum where it's all about getting the upgrade and flying CX F on miles, everyone flying WN must be a country bumpkin, too ignorant to know better. Sorry for the intrusion.
Worry about having a profitable operation first, and getting some labor peace (you're dreaming if you think that employees aren't going to want what they were going to get under Parker, and you kind of need happy employees as opposed to a "be thankful we don't fire you" environment of fear and loathing, so that will need to be resolved). Then worry about growing. Growing market share without a profitable operation to work with is a recipe for disaster- it's what got airlines into bankruptcy over and over again the last 30 years.
AA serves 5 markets nonstop out of SAN. WN serves 19.
AA serves 7 markets out of BNA (cornerstones + LGA/DCA). WN serves 31.
AA serves zero markets out of OAK. (No, AS codeshares don't count.)
You should be getting the idea now. Yes, I know, in a forum where it's all about getting the upgrade and flying CX F on miles, everyone flying WN must be a country bumpkin, too ignorant to know better. Sorry for the intrusion.
Worry about having a profitable operation first, and getting some labor peace (you're dreaming if you think that employees aren't going to want what they were going to get under Parker, and you kind of need happy employees as opposed to a "be thankful we don't fire you" environment of fear and loathing, so that will need to be resolved). Then worry about growing. Growing market share without a profitable operation to work with is a recipe for disaster- it's what got airlines into bankruptcy over and over again the last 30 years.
Aug 15, 2013, 9:47 pm
#1995
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: SJC/SFO & ORD
Programs: LT Gold/BA Executive Club/AS MP/Marriott
Posts: 1,646