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More 737-9 MAX Planes Ordered (12/22/2020)

More 737-9 MAX Planes Ordered (12/22/2020)

Old Dec 22, 20, 7:06 am
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More 737-9 MAX Planes Ordered (12/22/2020)

https://www.seattletimes.com/busines...s-airbus-jets/

Alaska Airlines said Tuesday it has ordered another 23 Boeing 737 MAXs, bringing its total order to 68 MAXs that over the next three years will replace most of the Airbus aircraft in its fleet.

The financial terms Boeing offered would have been difficult to pass up. In an interview, Alaska Air Group chief executive Brad Tilden said the airline will have to pay no additional money for the 13 MAXs it will take next year.

ďThis does not actually require any capital spending during 2021,Ē he said.
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Old Dec 22, 20, 7:11 am
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Press release

"We are extremely proud to be announcing this transformative agreement with Boeing," said Brad Tilden, CEO of Alaska Air Group. "We believe in this airplane, we believe in our strong partnership with Boeing, and we believe in the future of Alaska Airlines and the incredible opportunities ahead as we climb our way out of this pandemic. We could not ask for a better partner than Boeing and we are delighted to be standing side by side with them as we work together to get our economy back on its feet."
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Old Dec 22, 20, 7:36 am
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Do we know if they ordered the same interior design as AA?
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Old Dec 22, 20, 8:48 am
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Originally Posted by 49penguins View Post
Do we know if they ordered the same interior design as AA?
no, the interior will most similar to the a321neo interior. Same first class and economy seat pitch as todayís 737-900ERs
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Old Dec 22, 20, 12:47 pm
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I am Jack’s total lack of surprise. Buh-bye Airbus (I suspect AS will sell their A321s at some point).

https://www.travelcodex.com/alaska-airlines-orders-23-more-boeing-737-9-aircraft-for-all-737-fleet/
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Old Dec 22, 20, 1:09 pm
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Others might say...

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Old Dec 22, 20, 3:03 pm
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I think eventually Alaska will convert some of the orders to the MAX 8. The MAX 9 (like the -900ER) canít operate into all of Alaskaís destinations like SNA due to takeoff performance limitations.

Will be interesting to see if they also eventually pick up some MAX 10s, or if the fleet of 10 321neo totally addresses that need.
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Old Dec 22, 20, 5:39 pm
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Originally Posted by ASA_1 View Post
I think eventually Alaska will convert some of the orders to the MAX 8. The MAX 9 (like the -900ER) canít operate into all of Alaskaís destinations like SNA due to takeoff performance limitations.

Will be interesting to see if they also eventually pick up some MAX 10s, or if the fleet of 10 321neo totally addresses that need.
What are the performance stats for the MAX8/9 that would be affected by SNA?

I am aware that itís a shorter runway and has noise abatement protocols due to Newport Beach.
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Old Dec 22, 20, 7:37 pm
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it'd be interesting to see if they chose to finally open a SFO base for 737 now that A320 is leaving the fleet.
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Old Dec 23, 20, 12:04 am
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Originally Posted by damnyourefine View Post
What are the performance stats for the MAX8/9 that would be affected by SNA?

I am aware that itís a shorter runway and has noise abatement protocols due to Newport Beach.
From what I've gathered that's precisely it. The 739s have a high thrust to weight ratio which requires a much longer runway than longer planes/planes with more capacity such as a 757 or a 321. This is why you rarely, if ever, see a 739 used on SNA, or DCA for that matter. I am sure they are weighing the value of keeping a mixed fleet of the 321s in addition to the MAX order just for this reason, especially since the DCA flights are some of their most popular during normal travel times, so they would have to reduce capacity since slots are so hard to come by if they were to get rid of the 321s by flying a 738/MAX. They could alternatively sink down to the AA Oasis level by cramming in more seats, which I'm sure would go over well with everyone, but seeing their MAX website, they don't seem to be changing the seating configurations from the 900 to the 9.

What is currently still up in the air AFAIK is the outstanding VX order for 30 320neos they inherited which if they were to keep, should convert to 321s/XLRs which will also create a more substantial subfleet that should satisfy them on their efficiency and costs and provide them with an opportunity to grow long-term, but again that's just my armchair quarterbacking.
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Old Dec 23, 20, 8:32 am
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Originally Posted by HeyItsMK View Post
From what I've gathered that's precisely it. The 739s have a high thrust to weight ratio which requires a much longer runway than longer planes/planes with more capacity such as a 757 or a 321. This is why you rarely, if ever, see a 739 used on SNA, or DCA for that matter.
AA among others used to fly 757-200 at SNA, and the SNA airport planning team is considering of extending the runaway to be able to handle increased take-off weights as demand for cargo and heavier flights increases over time. Air Force One (USAF C-32) used SNA in October 2020 and I believe that military variant of the 757-200ER is heavier than the average 757-200.

I would love to see higher capacity or newer planes utilize SNA in the future!

Bring on the 9s!

Last edited by anteater; Dec 23, 20 at 8:59 am
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Old Dec 23, 20, 9:49 am
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Originally Posted by ASA_1 View Post
I think eventually Alaska will convert some of the orders to the MAX 8. The MAX 9 (like the -900ER) canít operate into all of Alaskaís destinations like SNA due to takeoff performance limitations.

Will be interesting to see if they also eventually pick up some MAX 10s, or if the fleet of 10 321neo totally addresses that need.
Todayís Cranky Flier post cites Minicucci as saying one reason they like the A321 is it gives them better performance on shorter runways like OGG and DCA, where they have to get a plane across the country or an ocean.

Alaska has some short runways (WRG, PSG, GST, OTZ to name a few) but those are mitigated by the relatively short stage length of flights out of those cities.
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Old Dec 23, 20, 9:53 am
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Originally Posted by damnyourefine View Post
AA among others used to fly 757-200 at SNA, and the SNA airport planning team is considering of extending the runaway to be able to handle increased take-off weights as demand for cargo and heavier flights increases over time.
It looks like they've got about 1000' to work with at each end without getting additional land, but they'll probably get a lot of pushback from the neighbors anyway,
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Old Dec 23, 20, 9:14 pm
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Originally Posted by ASA_1 View Post
I think eventually Alaska will convert some of the orders to the MAX 8. The MAX 9 (like the -900ER) canít operate into all of Alaskaís destinations like SNA due to takeoff performance limitations.

Will be interesting to see if they also eventually pick up some MAX 10s, or if the fleet of 10 321neo totally addresses that need.
MAX9 has runway performance very close to the 737-700NG. But from the internal Information released from AS, this deal gives them a ton of flexibility with the options, so it appears the plan is to get the MAX9 into the fleet and then decide what their MAX mix will be, or if the 9 is indeed the jet Du Jour. They also said this order gets them back on the road to a one jet fleet. The 321N is in the fleet plan until 2026 only. AS stated internally that while the 321N has great payload benefits, itís op costs are more than the MAX for the type of flying they do now and for their future expansion plans. (They pointed to purchase price, fuel and maintenance costs specifically). Based on that info, Iíd guess the NEOís phase out will start close to 2026 if not be totally gone from the fleet by then. Iím retired AS BTW, but what theyíve said internally to employees pretty much jives with whatís been in their press releases. Cheers.

Last edited by Tack; Dec 23, 20 at 9:37 pm
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Old Dec 24, 20, 12:07 am
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Originally Posted by HeyItsMK View Post
From what I've gathered that's precisely it. The 739s have a high thrust to weight ratio which requires a much longer runway than longer planes/planes with more capacity such as a 757 or a 321. This is why you rarely, if ever, see a 739 used on SNA, or DCA for that matter. I am sure they are weighing the value of keeping a mixed fleet of the 321s in addition to the MAX order just for this reason, especially since the DCA flights are some of their most popular during normal travel times, so they would have to reduce capacity since slots are so hard to come by if they were to get rid of the 321s by flying a 738/MAX. They could alternatively sink down to the AA Oasis level by cramming in more seats, which I'm sure would go over well with everyone, but seeing their MAX website, they don't seem to be changing the seating configurations from the 900 to the 9.

What is currently still up in the air AFAIK is the outstanding VX order for 30 320neos they inherited which if they were to keep, should convert to 321s/XLRs which will also create a more substantial subfleet that should satisfy them on their efficiency and costs and provide them with an opportunity to grow long-term, but again that's just my armchair quarterbacking.
That is correct. VX did ordered A320neo, but they deferred all A320neo delivered to 2020. They never receives A320neo, but they did actual order 10 A321neo with 4 exit doors on each side.
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