sjbsf

I am a new poster but have found this forum helpful for a long time. I am MVP and husband is MVP Gold. Alaska called me last week and told me that my Christmas plans had changed. Alaska was moving me from First to Coach on my flight from LAX to PVR. This was due to an aircraft change which resulted in 3 rows in F rather than 4.

This was a paid F fare, not a U class. They told me that I was the last one booked, so I was getting moved--paid F and husband's MVP Gold notwithstanding.

I was so surprised by the phone call that I didn't see any option other than to accept what was offered--difference between first and coach fare and $200 e-cert. Was there any way out of this situation? Should I have asked for something else/more? (There were no tickets the day before or after). Does this happen often?

jackal

As I read Alaska's Contract of Carriage, this qualifies as an Involuntary Denied Boarding situation, since you were not given carriage in your ticketed cabin. As such, I personally believe you should be offered the legally mandated IDB compensation (what is it now, $800 cash?).

Unfortunately, AS doesn't see it that way. I was bumped out of an F seat and into Y once on a "paid" F award--not upgraded--and wrote in about the situation. I was offered something like 6,500 miles back. Despite their argument, I remain unconvinced it was anything other than an IDB.

That said, I would guess you got an OK deal. The difference in fare (assuming it's the lowest Hot Deals fare, not the full Y fare!) plus $200 probably means you made out OK. That said, AS REALLY needs to fix their systems. Right now, the order they bump people out of F in is screwed up. It should be first by booking type (paid F first, then award F, then advance confirmed upgrades [H-Up fares, certificates, and miles], and then finally complimentary upgrades [the 100/72/48-hour ones] in order of status and waitlist time) and only then (in the case of a tie) based on check-in or booking time.

You may wish to write in your thoughts on this matter to Customer Care. Maybe with enough squawking, they'll fix their bump order.

johnp012001

I'm just curious, what in the OP's post makes you believe they did not follow this order?

jackal

1) The OP noted that he/she was on a paid F fare. Do you really expect there to have been 12 paid F fares on that flight, all of whom booked before the OP? I know the leisure routes are heavier with F purchases, but still.
2) Every report I've read on FlyerTalk about being bumped out of F has always had to do with either a FAM taking the person's seat or the person being seated in row 4 and getting an aircraft swap.
3) My personal experience as detailed above.

In every account I've seen or experienced, AS seems to take only seat location into consideration.

I could be wrong, but if I am, then at the very least the policy is applied inconsistently.

golfingboy

Or you could ask for a full refund and use that money to book an F ticket on UA or DL...

Also, I hope they gave you $200 e-cert EACH, not just $200 for both.

IMO, I think they should have bumped a non-status F fare passenger first before elites on paid-F fare...

lalala

I was downgraded a few months ago on a SFO-SEA flight and was confused about the priority of downgrading passengers.

FWIW, I was on the last leg of BA F award ticket booked in March 2010.
I am a MVP gold and I started my journey 17 hours earlier in Zurich.

I was offered board room access as compensation for my downgrade. I am already a member, so that seemed sort of lame.

I would love to know AS' priority for selecting passengers for downgrading. I was originally in seat 1C, not 4C, so my physical seat still existed.

I have not taken this up with customer care, but I may just to see if I can get an explanation for what happened.

johnp012001

Well, if any of these really are upgrades, then someone in revenue management should probably going to get fired. The First Class cabin is full 12/20, 12/21, 12/22, 12/23, and 12/25. I stopped looking after that. On the return the plane is SOLD OUT 1/1, 1/2, 1/3.

It looks like LAX took the hit for the new PDX-SAN-PVR flight, as there is only one flight this year, when in years past there were two during the winter months.

If the OP really wants to be in First they could fly out 3 hours earlier and hop an AA flights down to SAN.

Now the real question, they have already cut capacity in the market, why did they pull the -800 and replace with a -400?

Eastbay1K

All these new (longer) routes need aircraft that will make it all the way. The shorter hauls are suffering, both in aircraft size and capacity.

golfingboy

IMO, they should swap the short 73G routes with the 734s first before swapping out the 73Hs... Or have the 73Gs replace the 73Hs on some transcon/midcon routes during the last two weeks of December and the first week of January... I am confident that USA-PVR/SJD/etc are far more juicer from a revenue standpoint than SEA-BOS, PDX-BOS, LAX-DCA, SEA-AUS/DFW/IAH, etc. Or they could put some 739s for Mexico flying

Remember, Mexico flying has far more capacity constraints than intra-USA flying, because any frequency increase must be approved by both governments, while in the US it is not as complicated and it is far easier to swap a particular route from a 737 to a 767... Therefore, during the holidays the average % price increase for intra-USA flying during the holidays will not be as high as USA-Mexico flying...

In other words, AS is losing a lot of potential juicy Revenue on the Mexico routes...

Eastbay1K

Not if the planes are full - the transcons in the higher fare buckets are a fair % higher than to Mexico. And if the planes are full, those incremental last seats are selling in the higher fare buckets.

HDK

Intersting topic...

I had a similar but slightly different event earlier this year...

I had booked RT FC tickets for my GF and myself from ANC to PSC, I used miles for her FC seat and I purchased a "confirmed" (the gold diamond thingy) for myself. When we were boarding @ SEA for our return to ANC I was stopped by the boarding agent and informed that due to an equipment change (800 to 700) I was being moved back to coach. The boarding agent kept refering to my fare as being a complimentary upgrade. I tried to explain that I had in fact purchased a confirmed FC seat and asked him how they determined which four had to move back. He hemmed and hawed and never did give me a clear understanding of the rules. In any event, I was moved back to coach and my GF (on a mileage ticket) kept her FC seat.

I did contact AS Gold customer service and was initally put off by the CSA's somewhat aloof attitude regarding my bump. The fact that I had paid for a confirmed FC seat didn't seem to register.

Again, the explanation of who stays and who moves was still a bit fuzzy. I didn't press too hard and no, I didn't start a blog titled "ALASKAAIRLINESHATESEVERYONE". In any event the CSA did make things right by placing a $150 customer care e-cert in each of our mileage accounts.

I also brought this up at the MVPG breakfast last month here in Anchorage. RR confirmed the fact that even "confirmed" FC seats are considered complimentary. That being said, he really didn't clarify how bumps to coach due to equipment changes are determined. He did suggest that at a minimum, AS would refund the difference in fare basis.

I never did press for a refund of the differential but the $150 each seemed to be fair compensation...

beckoa

Wirelessly posted (beckoa\'s PWP wonderous poster: BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.304 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

Curious... With the frequency between SEA-ANC was there any F open on a later flight?

HDK

SEA-ANC wait list upgrades are pretty much non-existent (as are ANC-SEA)...there was little probability that any F class seats would be available on later flights.

Besides, who wants to hang around the N gates just to catch a later flight?

beckoa

Wirelessly posted (beckoa\'s PWP wonderous poster: BlackBerry9000/4.6.0.304 Profile/MIDP-2.0 Configuration/CLDC-1.1 VendorID/102)

Well I had luck with this in Aug... Went on a later flight (1 hour) and went back to the BR...

But that's me...

Eastbay1K

F is getting scarce in advance on some routes. SFO/SEA up to a few weeks out on certain (non-holiday) days and times, and SEA/Hawaii - I had issue finding F on certain days, where I figured there would be at least a single seat available up front.