vincentinparis

Since this thread has drifted a little, I'll add a work about flying OK and how they recognized my FB status. I have been upgraded on OK segments in Europe (I'm FB Platinum). The one time I missed a connection in PRG due to a delayed arrival, they had a boarding card waiting for me at the transfer desk on the next - and only remaining - flight on a non-ST airline and arranged lounge access even though I no longer was flying on a ST airline. I asked about getting my original miles credited and they replied I should contact FB. I thought I'd need proof from OK, but I e-mailed FB, and they credited my miles before I got home from that trip. Not shabby at all.

AshleyB

Apparently DL employees are paid a bare minimum wage so I guess one cannot expect too much of them. My experiences of DL in the US have been just appalling. The obtuse attitudes of DL staff is just amazing. I have yet to ever have status recognised and forget about rules relating to baggage or u/g. I have now given up entirely. On the other hand I know that AF employees are much more up to date on matters relating to DL flyers. On the whole Skyteam is a really weak alliance.

vincentinparis

More on subject than my last post: as FB Platinim, I was on the upgrade lists of every Delta segment I took this summer (a total of 11), was upgraded on most of those, and was greeted with a "welcome on board" when my boarding pass was checked (as opposed to the standard issue grunt that other passengers seemed to be getting). And whether I checked in on the website, the Delta app or at the airport, my baggage allowance reflected the extra free bag I was due as Elite Plus. All my Delta flights posted to my account within days. Which ones am I going to have to go back and claim retroactively because they weren't credited to my account? The AZ and AF trans-Atlantic segments, of course.

B747-437B

FB Gold flying Delta today (first time in 5 years) from Accra to Monrovia.

Flat refusal from the check-in staff to even input my Flying Blue number into the PNR (it is in the original KLM PNR but did not cut across to the Delta PNR).

Further advised that SkyTeam benefits do not apply for regional intra-Africa flights (really, try telling Kenya Airways that). A supervisor was called and backed this up.

No lounge access permitted, no SkyPriority boarding and not even use of the otherwise empty BusinessElite security/check-in desks.

I'll stick to Kenya Airways on this route in the future.

GUWonder

Sounds like DL needs to shape up or ship out whomever it has working at Accra.

Is there a Skyteam-operated lounge at Accra? If not, it could be that DL is too cheap to pay for coach-flying SkyTeam ElitePlus customers to access whatever lounge they use for business class customers.

flyBHX

This is the case in ANC. When checking my bag (AF/KL Gold flying on DL in Y with same-day international connection) I asked about lounge access and was told there was no SkyClub but I could use the Alaskan lounge. I get to the lounge and I am refused entry. Further research on the DL website shows that the ANC lounge can only be used by DL First (Business) class passengers and not Elite+s (as Delta won't pay for them)

B747-437B

I know both the Delta Station Manager and the handling agent (Menzies) GM well. I shall send them appropriate nastygrams. Doesn't change the point that I sweltered with the proletariat for 2 hours rather than being revered like the Elite Plus that I deserved to be!

cfischer

still 2orders of magnitide better than enything I have ever seen on AF Recently flown DL?

Either AF wants to pay for the AS lounge or there is no entry. The ST rules are pretty clear and if you don't like them why are you still flying them? Access is only granted to ST lounges and AS is not part of Skyteam. You are mistaken that Delta needs to pay for them, it's AF unwillingness to pay!

GUWonder

The following is about international flying:

When it comes to SkyTeam ElitePlus customers access to non-SkyTeam lounges when departing internationally (same-day) on a SkyTeam carrier, it's the operating carrier being flown that grants or denies lounge use.

This became clear time and time again where DL would provide DL-flying business class customers with access to non-ST lounges used by AF-KL for business class customers and AF-KL coach-flying ST ElitePlus customers, even as DL would instruct the very same non-ST lounges (which DL was using for business class customers) to not allow in any DL coach-flying ST ElitePlus customers (regardless of which carrier issued the ST ElitePlus card). This led to interesting situations where a DL ElitePlus flying AF-KL, AZ or OK in coach would get access to the very non-ST lounges where a DL ElitePlus flying DL in coach at the same time would be denied access. As DL instructed the lounges to do.

In the past five years, at which airports has AF-KL provided non-ST lounge access to AF-KL business class passengers but has denied the same to AF-KL coach flying SkyTeam ElitePlus customers? I don't recall any such situation with AF-KL in the past five years where AF-KL instructed such contracted lounges to deny access to ST ElitePlus customers flying AF-KL in coach.

In the past five years, at which airports has DL provided non-ST lounge access to DL business class passengers but has denied the same to DL coach flying SkyTeam ElitePlus customers? I recall multiple such situations with DL in the past five years where DL instructed such contracted lounges to deny access to ST ElitePlus customers flying DL in coach.

flyBHX

My understanding (which GUWonder shares) is that the departing ST carrier pays for STE+ access to non-ST lounges (i.e. in this case DL and not AF should have paid). In all my flights with AF/KL as STE+ I have had access to non-ST lounges which (I assume) AF/KL have paid for.

But this is not my main gripe. My main problem was that the DL check-in desk agent told me I could use the AS lounge. It is hard to argue that "the ST rules are pretty clear" if a DL agent doesn't know the rules for their own airport

redtailshark

At what point does this remove from the agent's domain and become a systemic, management issue of a. failure to train agents and b. failure to assign responsibility for denial of published benefits?

You see that DL does not care to a. acknowlege the problem, nor b. to fix it.

This is so typical. It means for you the AF FB Plat member, you cannot rely on the published benefits. Also, DL agents have a habit of refusing to honor their own company's published benefits, so you have to point them to DL.COM and the published materials at every interaction. Even then, some of them deny the benefit exists.

This is what is meant by :-: best in class :-:

In other service industries, this conduct would not be tolerated by consumers and would result in a file being submitted to consumer protection and enforcement agencies.

For example, car rental last night at JFK...the Department of Consumer Affairs regulations on honoring reservation prices were prominently displayed over the heads of the agents...no doubt, as a result of previous badness and to ensure no future shenanigans. It helps to remind everyone that this is not going to be tolerated and if it happens, it will escalate beyond the company very quickly.

Imagine if DL agents were required to work under large placards that displayed all similar DoT and State regs.

Yeah, then we would really see best in class service.

It's totally pathetic that this kind of thing is the only way to ensure they honor their own published policies.

Yes, even KL are better.

cfischer

Agreed! But this is NOT a ST benefit! If Delta wants to give you access that's great but they will have to pay for it! If you access a ST lounge with your AF card then AF pays for it.
So basically you are blaming Delta for not handing out free lounge access to AFKL Elites? Seriously? In contrast to *A where 3rd party lounge access is in fact a perk for the SAG status it is clearly not the case for ST E+. Maybe we can at least agree on this one and then it is up to each of us to decide whether we personally believe additional access should be granted.
I am always happy when I receive unexpected access, but one should never take it for granted.

GUWonder

Basically, that is not it. So, no and no are the answers to the above questions.

I am assigning responsibility to DL for having provided lounge access to its international business class customers at airports where DL has chosen to exclude lounge access to its international economy class customers with SkyTeam ElitePlus status. It was done because DL didn't want to pay for it in the manner other SkyTeam airlines continue to pay for it when flying SkyTeam airlines beside DL.

Does any SkyTeam airline have a relatively recent history of doing this to SkyTeam ElitePlus customers beside DL? My experiences when flying as a SkyTeam ElitePlus customer in coach with AF, KL, AZ, SU, KE and OK indicate that DL is the the outlier of the bunch when it comes to lounge access.

I am not taking anything for granted when it comes to DL. I've been around the block with them long enough and in enough ways to not be disillusioned by anything they do, either to DL SkyMiles customers or to OAL SkyTeam ElitePlus customers.

cfischer

So you believe the OP had a right based on the ST E+ status to access the lounge? Sorry, you might have been around the block for a while I do not agree with you. Please point me to the corresponding language on delta.com or on any Skyteam website which indicates such a requirement.
Are you also blaming UA/CO/US for not letting their US members in lounges on domestic itineraries? Sure enough all other *A carries allow it!
The US is different from the rest of the world when it comes to airline benis and lounge access is just not one of them. Since it is well known eveybody has a choice when flying airlines and you may choose not to fly Delta! However, I cannot understand how anyone can complain about something which is simply not a benefit.

However, I do agree that Delta needs to be more explicit about it and noit just say ST E+ (DL DM, PM, GM) but specify which lounges they are opening up to their own Elites only and which ones are available to all ST E+ members. It is something which should be fixed by Delta.

Irelandflyer

Isn't it a little sad that someone saying "welcome on board" is a benefit for elites? It's what would have been termed basic etiquette at one point.