NickB

I guess that this thread would be its natural home.

bodory

It's time to rename the thread "What will be JOON's last routes?"

See: Is Joon over?

nldogbert

I guess Joon is definitely over:

Link

I had nearly once had the opportunity to step onboard, but never materialized. Glad to see this Transavia-wannabe gone. Seem that Ben is concentrating now on making AF more premium based. I hope he will look into the improving the Premium Voyaguer cabin both hard and soft product to at least be on par with DL's Premium Select.

Cheers!

Carel1

Link is dead. The requested topic does not exist.

I am curious, flying Joon tomorrow CDG-LIS.

nldogbert

Here's the direct link to the article in La Tribune https://www.latribune.fr/entreprises...on-803270.html

Noobflyer59

Do you think a Joon flight TXL-CDG-CPT November 30 or December 1 is late enough in this year to have changed into "normal" Air France when the trip is taking place?

I get the impression that you only get one meal included on economy longhaul in Joon, as opposed to two meals included (plus drinks and snacks in between) with Air France?

Goldorak

Hard to say with certitude, but I think that AF will have full operations control on Joon flights at that date. But the planes may still be Joon (equipment, colors, livery)

San Gottardo

Goldorak

Good question. I am guessing that CPT will stay (it was operated by AF mainline before Joon) and I think the route works OK. Same for CAI and BOM, historical AF routes : no doubt it will go back to AF mainline.
SEZ : I think this one will be axed. They have already announced suspension for a couple of months before end of Joon announcement.
FOR ?? no idea about current performance. It may have a chance to stay as Brazil is a big market.
UIO : not launched yet, so I think they are going at least to give it a chance.
THR is gone for long IMO (and for reasons not specific to AF/Joon).

hfly

You are talking about a route, maybe 2, it means nothing in the grand scheme of things as to whether they continue them or not.

Goldorak

Sorry, but I don't get your point.

hfly

What I meant in essence was that in the history of FT, I cannot recall anyone ever saying, "gee, I really wish AF flew to Fortaleza" or any other airline bar perhaps TAP. So if they keep it or not, who cares? People maybe looking forward to a bucket and spade trip one day? SEZ, maybe a bit more aspirational, but also unimportant.

NickB

It seems to me that it is less an issue of whether reverting back to AF fundamentally changes the cost equation (I agree with you that it probably does not to a point that would warrant canceling the route after having invested in starting it up) but rather one, as you point out in the strategic change of direction thread, of strategic choice: does a route like FOR fit into Ben Smith's strategic vision for the airline? The fact that a route is operated by Joon is one element but not necessarily conclusive. I have more doubts than Goldorak, for instance, that CPT will survive in the medium term. It may be a route that goes back to being served by KL only instead of both AF and KL. DItto UIO. On intra-European, it is difficult to imagine places like MAD or BCN not being served but the case for NAP or BGO would be less compelling, I would have thought.

If he wants to increase AF's resilience with more spare aircraft and solid frequencies on core routes, something else will have to give somewhere, won't it, as I doubt that AF has the cash to increase the size of the fleet.

CoMooter

brunos

Indeed KA, renamed Cathay Dragon in 2016, was a buyout. But it is a full service airline that only operates regional routes (no longhaull like Joon). Its service is similar to that of CX regional product.

SQ might be an interesting comparison. Besides the mainline, it has SIlk, a full-service regional airline and Scoot a budget airline. In may 2018, it announced that SIlk will be merged into SQ after retrofitting lie-flat business seats on its aircraft, while a few routes will be transferred to Scoot.