End of July-August strike updates
Jul 20, 2011, 10:03 am
#16
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777-300ER / Config 42J 24W 317Y = 383 seats
13 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 11 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 30 passengers approximately.
777-300ER / Config 8P 67J 28W 200Y = 300 seats
15 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 12 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 20 passengers.
777-200ER / Config 35J 24W 250Y = 309 seats
11 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 8 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 28 passengers approximately.
777-200ER / Config 4P 49J 24W 170Y = 247 seats
12 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 9 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 20 passengers approximately.
13 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 11 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 30 passengers approximately.
777-300ER / Config 8P 67J 28W 200Y = 300 seats
15 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 12 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 20 passengers.
777-200ER / Config 35J 24W 250Y = 309 seats
11 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 8 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 28 passengers approximately.
777-200ER / Config 4P 49J 24W 170Y = 247 seats
12 cabin crew members (1 CCP, 2 CC, 9 HOT/STW)
1 cabin crew member for 20 passengers approximately.
Is the issue raised by the unions that retrofitting a 772 with 4P and 49J to a leisure 772 (35J) implies a reduction from 12 to 11 crew members? or is there some further reduction imposed by AF management?
I am just trying to understand the issue being raised by the unions besides the "bases de province" case. It is really amazing that the strikers do not detail their case. It is also bad journalism not to try to explain. In the absence of a rational argument, it is hard to regard this strike in a positive light.
Jul 20, 2011, 2:24 pm
#17
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Ia Orana All !
AF is slowly removing the number of crew on its aircraft... We went from 15 on the 777-200ER to 13 then to 12 and now 11 with the work load increasing all the time. On the 777-300ER it is going from 15 to 13. On the A319 it will go down to 3 cabin crew as well.
The unions see it as a dangerous slip towards minimum crew. I remember on the 747-300 to the COI destinations we were 12 cabin crew when a 747-400 to NRT had 15 and to YUL 16 !
Just for the 319 reduction it is a loss of 220 cabin attendant jobs. And as a customer those reductions are not good either because you will end up with a rushed crew who will not have enough time to finish their service. And do remember that for AF to get to 3 cabin crew they will cut on some of the service provided by the crew...
It is tough from all positions really... we will see what will come out of it, but if the airline does not want to repeat the debacle of 2007 they should start talking now.
The other major problem is our MD getting a raise of 40+% and his employees getting at most 2 to 5%...
Bad timing really... I do not deny that he deserves that raise but it is extremely bad timing...
AF is slowly removing the number of crew on its aircraft... We went from 15 on the 777-200ER to 13 then to 12 and now 11 with the work load increasing all the time. On the 777-300ER it is going from 15 to 13. On the A319 it will go down to 3 cabin crew as well.
The unions see it as a dangerous slip towards minimum crew. I remember on the 747-300 to the COI destinations we were 12 cabin crew when a 747-400 to NRT had 15 and to YUL 16 !
Just for the 319 reduction it is a loss of 220 cabin attendant jobs. And as a customer those reductions are not good either because you will end up with a rushed crew who will not have enough time to finish their service. And do remember that for AF to get to 3 cabin crew they will cut on some of the service provided by the crew...
It is tough from all positions really... we will see what will come out of it, but if the airline does not want to repeat the debacle of 2007 they should start talking now.
The other major problem is our MD getting a raise of 40+% and his employees getting at most 2 to 5%...
Bad timing really... I do not deny that he deserves that raise but it is extremely bad timing...
Jul 20, 2011, 2:36 pm
#18
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Regarding your comment on the A319, it's not a real loss as with provinces bases, a new need of 250 cabin crew members for 318/320 is required which will be filled with volontary people + new hirings.
Jul 20, 2011, 4:07 pm
#19
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 189
Bumping a post from yesterday in hopes of getting some advice:
What happens if my family misses our 1.5 hour connection at CDG (2F to 2E) to ATL on Aug 4 that was booked on Delta assuming all later flights to the US are sold out on the eve of a strike? Will AF or Delta put us up somewhere decent until we get on a plane back to the states? Will we get our luggage at CDG? If we take a Eurostar to London will Delta get us home from there?
Jul 20, 2011, 5:03 pm
#20
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What happens if my family misses our 1.5 hour connection at CDG (2F to 2E) to ATL on Aug 4 that was booked on Delta assuming all later flights to the US are sold out on the eve of a strike? Will AF or Delta put us up somewhere decent until we get on a plane back to the states? Will we get our luggage at CDG? If we take a Eurostar to London will Delta get us home from there?
Rerouting on alternate airlines with an additional hop in FRA, LHR, ZRH... should be fairly doable. I don't know how AF and DL qualify strikes (I'm not sure whether DL understands such a concept to begin with
), closer to MX or WX?
Jul 20, 2011, 5:05 pm
#21
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I'm flying AF7 on Friday and ROC just mailed me that it had been pushed back 35 minutes. Is it related to the strikes? Should I start bracing myself for a rolling delay?
Jul 21, 2011, 12:26 am
#22
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Jul 21, 2011, 6:20 am
#23
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Is there any experience about how longhaul flights from CDG that leave on the morning after the last strike day are impacted? It usually takes a bit of time to get things back in order with all the displaced crews and planes, and the mechanics situation doesn't help. But what has been the experience in the past? I am asking because one of my family members has a flight CDG-YUL on the morning of August 2.
Thanks
Thanks
Last edited by JOUY31; Jul 23, 2011 at 10:08 pm Reason: post split between the two threads
Jul 21, 2011, 6:51 am
#24
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To come back on topic (apologies for stepping away and thanks to the moderators for tolerating it):
Is there any experience about how longhaul flights from CDG that leave on the morning after the last strike day are impacted? It usually takes a bit of time to get things back in order with all the displaced crews and planes, and the mechanics situation doesn't help. But what has been the experience in the past? I am asking because one of my family members has a flight CDG-YUL on the morning of August 2.
Is there any experience about how longhaul flights from CDG that leave on the morning after the last strike day are impacted? It usually takes a bit of time to get things back in order with all the displaced crews and planes, and the mechanics situation doesn't help. But what has been the experience in the past? I am asking because one of my family members has a flight CDG-YUL on the morning of August 2.
And no fellow FTers have replied to these few posts, I guess because no-one knows what will happen and which flights will be impacted????
Jul 21, 2011, 6:59 am
#25
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Unfortunately, I am afraid it is still to early to have any idea about the impact. More information should be coming in a few days, but the current lack of information is not unusual in comparison with previous strikes. If I understand correctly, under French law, AF can learn about which staff actually goes on strike no more than a few hours before they are scheduled to fly.
Jul 21, 2011, 7:17 am
#26
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Unfortunately, I am afraid it is still to early to have any idea about the impact. More information should be coming in a few days, but the current lack of information is not unusual in comparison with previous strikes. If I understand correctly, under French law, AF can learn about which staff actually goes on strike no more than a few hours before they are scheduled to fly.
Regarding the movement, there are no certitude as of now.
Worst scenario : 70% off on medium haul / 20% off on long haul.
Jul 21, 2011, 7:36 am
#27
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I am trying to change my flight from Joburg to one day earlier on the 28th; brings me at CDG on the 29th where there are more options (KLM, AlItalia) to get to FCO.
Jul 21, 2011, 11:33 am
#28
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AF PNC unions optimistic about an agreement with AF management
According to Le Monde, current negotiations have brought progress on 3 out of 5 issues of contention. The two remaining issues are:
- on the medium-haul network, bringing down the number of flight attendants from 4 to 3 for 142 passengers (legal minimum is 1 crew member for 50 passengers, as implemented by LCCs)
- on the long-haul network, but only on about 10 aircraft, the removal of one flight attendant
Union leaders seem confident that an agreement can be reached and that the call for a strike can be cancelled.
No visible progress on the call for a strike by SNPL and the one by minority pilot unions, though.
- on the medium-haul network, bringing down the number of flight attendants from 4 to 3 for 142 passengers (legal minimum is 1 crew member for 50 passengers, as implemented by LCCs)
- on the long-haul network, but only on about 10 aircraft, the removal of one flight attendant
Union leaders seem confident that an agreement can be reached and that the call for a strike can be cancelled.
No visible progress on the call for a strike by SNPL and the one by minority pilot unions, though.
Last edited by JOUY31; Jul 21, 2011 at 12:08 pm
Jul 21, 2011, 1:04 pm
#29
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I believe that Manureva and most FAs want to do a good job and I think generally AF has a good inflight service, not to say very good, but this inflight experience should go hand in hand with a seemingless ground experience before and after the flight. I also have to acknowledge many improvements in CDG over the past years to enhance the travelling experience with AF. But a strike can destroy all these excellent impressions in one moment. I can understand being stranded if wx is not permitting flying (even if AF could improve irops handling) or for the occasional mx reasons (safety first!), but I have a hard time accepting that I should be affected because (some) staff just decide that the day of my flight the don't want to work, even if their demands are legitimate. Let's hope they find an agreement and my flight on the 30th takes place.
Jul 21, 2011, 2:52 pm
#30
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Ia Orana all !
Unfortunately I won't be flying on the 30th on LAX-CDG as I will be in PPT but if you fly out of LAX to CDG on AF 073 on the 31st you'll be sure to have a plane as it is inbound from PPT and crewed by PPT cabin crew.
Also, checked our employee pages and the unions are reporting that the talks are heading towards a rather good way and 3 out of the 5 issues raised by the unions are now resolved. Cross fingers all will agree to lift the strike.
Unfortunately I won't be flying on the 30th on LAX-CDG as I will be in PPT but if you fly out of LAX to CDG on AF 073 on the 31st you'll be sure to have a plane as it is inbound from PPT and crewed by PPT cabin crew.
Also, checked our employee pages and the unions are reporting that the talks are heading towards a rather good way and 3 out of the 5 issues raised by the unions are now resolved. Cross fingers all will agree to lift the strike.