FlyerTalker683455

I have virtually zero turnover and a recent informal staff meeting indicated that each and every one of my employees is happy to work for my company. Most my employees are highly mobile and highly independent engineers and experts

You can't make a judgment based on a single bit of info here.

I let employees fly J or F if the price makes sense. But not if they end up putting someone else in their seat.

canadiancow

I think that's completely reasonable, and was thinking about the laptop example before getting to this post.

The company is paying to make you more productive. Not to make your SO happy.

sweeper20

I would also never accuse one of my employees of stealing because they switched seats.

FlyerTalker683455

Well, it is. Just as much as someone trying to self upgrade during flight would be stealing from the airline. Unless your employment contract specified J travel for family (some have such clauses. If your employer wants you in a J seat, that's where you need to stay. For both directions.

Unless you clear it with the employer first. Why does anyone need to ask this board for advice? It's up to them to ask the people or company paying for his or her seat.

If you are valuable enough to fly J the last thing I would want is to have you off sick with DVT.

sweeper20

I guess I just don't have the band with that maybe you have to field questions like this...'hey boss, I'm calling to let you know I'm switching seats' You do have adults working for you, no? You do empower and trust them to work on your companies behalf? But you would want them to call and clear a seat switch?

FlyerTalker683455

Because he paid thousands of bucks flying YOU in J. Not your wife or Gf or kids or grandma or golden retriever.

If you want your wife to be in J then you can use upgrades, points or cash to put her there. Or negotiate an employment agreement entitling your travel companion to fly J on the company dime.

canadiancow

Exactly.

"Why do you look so tired?"
"I gave my J seat to my wife and sat in Y."

is the equivalent of

"Can I borrow your laptop for this presentation?"
"Where's yours?"
"I erased all company information on it and I gave it to my wife because hers was old and crappy."

Neither are acceptable.

FlyerTalker683455

Next iteration will be to sell their J seat ... To a colleague or stranger. Even by giving it to the wise or GF no doubt there is "consideration" involved

sweeper20

Please tell me you really don't think that giving your J seat to your wife for part of a trip and intentionally deleting company data and giving away your company owned laptop to your wife are the same. I'm really having trouble believing either of you are actually in management of any kind.

FlyerTalker683455

It might be worse. A laptop is likely a lot cheaper than a J seat and can be replaced. Company data is backed up. Alertness during crucial business activity is irreplaceable.

You clearly have no need to fly business. Therefore why not suggest to your employer that instead of J they pay for 2 Y so you can sit with your wife.

If you actually engaged with me in this argument as my employee you might end up being the first in 12 years i have fired.

sweeper20

No fear of being fired, I could/would never work for you, so we are both safe.

canadiancow

It's very rare I agree with All best (has this EVER happened before?), but in this, I feel like I can't even add anything to his argument, because I agree 100%.

If you're flying back Friday afternoon in J, and then have the weekend off, I can kind of accept the argument. But if you have a meeting the morning after, it's not acceptable.

eos75

I don't think that many people would disagree that if your employer has paid for business class to fly overnight and attend meetings the next day, that you are obliged to use that seat and it would be completely unacceptable (gross misconduct) to give it away. However the OP's intention is to use the J seat for the flight to LHR, and switch out on the return:

Whilst it's clear what's appropriate or not for the outbound flight, the return flight is less clear-cut. There are a few scenarios where it may be reasonable to do what he's suggesting and be a complete non-issue from the employer's point of view. We don't know enough to judge on that, and it's completely between the OP and his employer; and wasn't really what he asking for advice about in this thread in any case.

I used to work for a company that regularly flew staff in J from YVR to LHR for week-long client meetings / workshops - typically flying out on Sunday evening, start work Monday afternoon, fly back on Friday morning. So although there was a definite expectation about hitting the ground running upon arrival in London, I can't imagine that particular company would worry about switching seats on the return flight at the end of the week.

eigenvector

Your point is well taken and I can't disagree. A benefit provided to an employee for a business purpose shouldn't be appropriated for the benefit of the employee's family instead. I think where we diverge is your characterization of it as stealing. It's unacceptable and depending on the exact situation could be grounds for dismissal, but it's not a criminal matter. Mostly semantics I know, but this is probably where most people felt your language was a little strong.

yvr76

Have to agree that if you're flying in J on company dime, putting your spouse in that seat is not acceptable. The company is flying you in J so you can arrive well rested and be more productive. Putting someone else in that seat defeats the purpose.