Nov 4, 2015, 9:05 am
Last edit by: OH-LGG
Finnair (AY) company website dedicated for A350 fleet can be found HERE
!!
bold= new cabin
!!
A350 Deliveries
OH-LWA (msn 18) delivered 7th Oct 2015 is the first Finnair A350 and started long-haul operations as AY57 to PVG on 21st Nov 2015.
OH-LWB (msn 19) was delivered 14th Dec 2015, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 19th Dec 2015.
OH-LWC (msn 20) was delivered 31st Dec 2015, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 3rd Jan 2016.
OH-LWD (msn 22) was delivered 25th Mar 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 28th Mar 2016.
OH-LWE (msn 23) was delivered 29th Apr 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 1st May 2016
OH-LWF (msn 28) was delivered 25th Jun 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 27th Jun 2016
OH-LWG (msn 51) was delivered 29th Sep 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 30th Sep 2016
OH-LWH (msn 97) was delivered 04th Apr 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 5th Apr 2017
OH-LWI (msn 104) was delivered 02nd Jun 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 5th Jun 2017
OH-LWK (msn 113) was delivered 30th Jun 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 3rd Jul 2017
OH-LWL (msn 134) was delivered on 22th Sep 2017, started as AY 831 to LHR on 27th Sep 2017 and started longhauls on 29th Sep 2017 as AY89 to BKK.
OH-LWM (msn 264) was delivered on 13th Dec 2018, started long-haul operations as AY73 to NRT on 19th Dec 2018
OH-LWN (msn 273) was delivered on 13th Feb 2019, started long-haul operations as AY73 to NRT on 16th Feb 2019
OH-LWO (msn 300) was delivered on 26th Apr 2019, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 29th Apr 2019
OH-LWP (msn 392) was delivered on 10th Feb 2020, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 13th Feb 2020
OH-LWR (msn 410) was delivered on 1st Sep 2020, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 8th Sep 2020
OH-LWS (msn 516) was delivered on 29th Dec 2021, started long haul operations as AY87 to PVG (cargo only) on 24th Jan 2022, first pax service on 28th Feb 2022 as AY9
Seating
2 different configurations exists.
J/46 Y/251: Features 2 J cabins. First 8 birds and 12th(LWA-LWH, LWM) has this config
J/32 Y/304: The minicabin is removed and replaced with Y seating. Babycots in 1L and 41L. Birds 9-11, 13, 15 (LWI-LWL, LWN, LWP) has this config, a.k.a. marsuhäkki config.
Complete seatmap and layout of config 1 can be found HERE and config 2 is here.
Business Class features Zodiac Cirrus III full-flat bed seats in a 1-2-1 abreast config, all seats with direct access to the aisle. Config1 has two business class cabins, row1-8 and 9-12, while config2 only has one (row 1-8). Early reviews has preferred front cabin over minicabin, and for best window seat, row 2 or 1 may be preferable, row 1 for aisle seats.
As operations of A350 has matured, it has become practice to set the snack-bar on top of the cupboard in front of row 1, making row 1 experience a lot of foot traffic and noise.
Config2 also suffers from low toilet/pax quota (2 toilets / 32 pax) as the aft toilets has been assigned to the high density Y cabin, further contributing to high foot traffic in the front of the cabin. For these reasons, a seat further to the back may be preferable. However, all service start in the front and it will usually take a long time to get your meal in row 8.
For couples travelling together there is no clear choice. DH-seats are tilted towards each-other, but you still will not see the other person without leaning forwards. Seat across aisles (AD and HL respectively) has no barriers between them, but are tilted the wrong way and rows are also slightly misaligned.
Economy Comfort on A350 has the exact same seats as in economy, but with ≈4" inches more legroom. They also come with noise cancelling headphones, 1h internet, priority boarding and a small amenity kit.
Finnair platinums and OWE members can select these seats for free. (OWE must call to do so). Other passengers can select comfort seats for a fee, and seats are also sold after boarding.
On config1 comfort is row 21-25, while on config 2 comfort is row 21-24 + 25ABC and 25JKL. Row 21 is bulkhead and has slightly more space, as no seat reclines into the space. None of the configs has that super-space found on some retrofitted A330 though.
On config1 21AC and 21JL are the only paired seats making them preferable, but if you want to have IFE screen in the seat in front of you, pick row 22. On config2 all seats are in groups of 3, and it is also recommended to stay away from row 21 entirely, as it is entangled with the toilets.
In terms of space there are no seats in comfort cabin on either config that beats exit row 41A/C/J/L or 42A/L.
Economy Class features 3-3-3 abreast slimline seating with 32" pitch. The best seats are row 41 with most legroom on A/C/J/L (but they lack window), and row 42 A/L.
These are either labled "extra legroom" or "exit row" and are selectable with status or for a fee.
Economy cabin offers USB for charge - no AC outlets.
In-Flight Entertainment
IFE system is upgraded. Bigger screens, wider selection of movies and music, route mapper and control options. You can watch a movie from start to landing. You will have Bose noise-cancelling earphones in business class and in Economy comfort, and earplugs in economy class.
Wifi: you will see a code (in business class) in the screen when you open the IFE and select language. In economy class, you need to ask cabin crew for a voucher code if you are OWS/OWE, otherwise it costs you 7,95€ per hour, 11,95€ per three hours or 19,95€ for the whole flight. It may take some time until up in the air to get it started. Log in is required, once you have created an account and password, the system will recognize you next time.
Quality issues and early refurbishment
The seats in business class have had many quality issues from day one. Apart from some inherent problems with the seat design, there are also malfunctions and abnormal wear.
As every row has slightly different pitch, fittings and trimmings have had to de adopted manually. Apart from causing delays in delivery, this also has led to many things in the cabin tend to come loose, to squeak and to break.
In june 2017 it was announced that Airbus has accepted responsibility for the quality issues and will replace every seat on every plane delivered until that point in time (9 birds).
The refurbish will take place during the first round of major maintenance round, scheduled to start later this year.
There is no information if there will be any changes made at the same time (addressing complaints about cramped seats and missing stowage space for example), but most likely this is treated as a warranty action and so cabin will be equipped with the exact same seats and layout, albeit with a newer batch of seats.
More details and discussion:
FAM (Familiarization) flights were ongoing within European destinations until the first A350 aircraft was put on regular long-haul service on 21st November 2015. Here is a list of FAM flights quoted by a FT'er.
The "famous" introduction list with initial experiences can be found in THIS thread
Discussion about the first long-haul services and experiences can be found in another THREAD
Links to many trip reports can be found in https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/finn...ion-links.html.
!!
bold= new cabin
!!
A350 Deliveries
OH-LWA (msn 18) delivered 7th Oct 2015 is the first Finnair A350 and started long-haul operations as AY57 to PVG on 21st Nov 2015.
OH-LWB (msn 19) was delivered 14th Dec 2015, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 19th Dec 2015.
OH-LWC (msn 20) was delivered 31st Dec 2015, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 3rd Jan 2016.
OH-LWD (msn 22) was delivered 25th Mar 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 28th Mar 2016.
OH-LWE (msn 23) was delivered 29th Apr 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 1st May 2016
OH-LWF (msn 28) was delivered 25th Jun 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 27th Jun 2016
OH-LWG (msn 51) was delivered 29th Sep 2016, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 30th Sep 2016
OH-LWH (msn 97) was delivered 04th Apr 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 5th Apr 2017
OH-LWI (msn 104) was delivered 02nd Jun 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 5th Jun 2017
OH-LWK (msn 113) was delivered 30th Jun 2017, started long-haul operations as AY89 to BKK on 3rd Jul 2017
OH-LWL (msn 134) was delivered on 22th Sep 2017, started as AY 831 to LHR on 27th Sep 2017 and started longhauls on 29th Sep 2017 as AY89 to BKK.
OH-LWM (msn 264) was delivered on 13th Dec 2018, started long-haul operations as AY73 to NRT on 19th Dec 2018
OH-LWN (msn 273) was delivered on 13th Feb 2019, started long-haul operations as AY73 to NRT on 16th Feb 2019
OH-LWO (msn 300) was delivered on 26th Apr 2019, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 29th Apr 2019
OH-LWP (msn 392) was delivered on 10th Feb 2020, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 13th Feb 2020
OH-LWR (msn 410) was delivered on 1st Sep 2020, started long haul operations as AY141 to BKK on 8th Sep 2020
OH-LWS (msn 516) was delivered on 29th Dec 2021, started long haul operations as AY87 to PVG (cargo only) on 24th Jan 2022, first pax service on 28th Feb 2022 as AY9
Seating
2 different configurations exists.
J/46 Y/251: Features 2 J cabins. First 8 birds and 12th(LWA-LWH, LWM) has this config
J/32 Y/304: The minicabin is removed and replaced with Y seating. Babycots in 1L and 41L. Birds 9-11, 13, 15 (LWI-LWL, LWN, LWP) has this config, a.k.a. marsuhäkki config.
Complete seatmap and layout of config 1 can be found HERE and config 2 is here.
Business Class features Zodiac Cirrus III full-flat bed seats in a 1-2-1 abreast config, all seats with direct access to the aisle. Config1 has two business class cabins, row1-8 and 9-12, while config2 only has one (row 1-8). Early reviews has preferred front cabin over minicabin, and for best window seat, row 2 or 1 may be preferable, row 1 for aisle seats.
As operations of A350 has matured, it has become practice to set the snack-bar on top of the cupboard in front of row 1, making row 1 experience a lot of foot traffic and noise.
Config2 also suffers from low toilet/pax quota (2 toilets / 32 pax) as the aft toilets has been assigned to the high density Y cabin, further contributing to high foot traffic in the front of the cabin. For these reasons, a seat further to the back may be preferable. However, all service start in the front and it will usually take a long time to get your meal in row 8.
For couples travelling together there is no clear choice. DH-seats are tilted towards each-other, but you still will not see the other person without leaning forwards. Seat across aisles (AD and HL respectively) has no barriers between them, but are tilted the wrong way and rows are also slightly misaligned.
Economy Comfort on A350 has the exact same seats as in economy, but with ≈4" inches more legroom. They also come with noise cancelling headphones, 1h internet, priority boarding and a small amenity kit.
Finnair platinums and OWE members can select these seats for free. (OWE must call to do so). Other passengers can select comfort seats for a fee, and seats are also sold after boarding.
On config1 comfort is row 21-25, while on config 2 comfort is row 21-24 + 25ABC and 25JKL. Row 21 is bulkhead and has slightly more space, as no seat reclines into the space. None of the configs has that super-space found on some retrofitted A330 though.
On config1 21AC and 21JL are the only paired seats making them preferable, but if you want to have IFE screen in the seat in front of you, pick row 22. On config2 all seats are in groups of 3, and it is also recommended to stay away from row 21 entirely, as it is entangled with the toilets.
In terms of space there are no seats in comfort cabin on either config that beats exit row 41A/C/J/L or 42A/L.
Economy Class features 3-3-3 abreast slimline seating with 32" pitch. The best seats are row 41 with most legroom on A/C/J/L (but they lack window), and row 42 A/L.
These are either labled "extra legroom" or "exit row" and are selectable with status or for a fee.
Economy cabin offers USB for charge - no AC outlets.
In-Flight Entertainment
IFE system is upgraded. Bigger screens, wider selection of movies and music, route mapper and control options. You can watch a movie from start to landing. You will have Bose noise-cancelling earphones in business class and in Economy comfort, and earplugs in economy class.
Wifi: you will see a code (in business class) in the screen when you open the IFE and select language. In economy class, you need to ask cabin crew for a voucher code if you are OWS/OWE, otherwise it costs you 7,95€ per hour, 11,95€ per three hours or 19,95€ for the whole flight. It may take some time until up in the air to get it started. Log in is required, once you have created an account and password, the system will recognize you next time.
Quality issues and early refurbishment
The seats in business class have had many quality issues from day one. Apart from some inherent problems with the seat design, there are also malfunctions and abnormal wear.
As every row has slightly different pitch, fittings and trimmings have had to de adopted manually. Apart from causing delays in delivery, this also has led to many things in the cabin tend to come loose, to squeak and to break.
In june 2017 it was announced that Airbus has accepted responsibility for the quality issues and will replace every seat on every plane delivered until that point in time (9 birds).
The refurbish will take place during the first round of major maintenance round, scheduled to start later this year.
There is no information if there will be any changes made at the same time (addressing complaints about cramped seats and missing stowage space for example), but most likely this is treated as a warranty action and so cabin will be equipped with the exact same seats and layout, albeit with a newer batch of seats.
More details and discussion:
FAM (Familiarization) flights were ongoing within European destinations until the first A350 aircraft was put on regular long-haul service on 21st November 2015. Here is a list of FAM flights quoted by a FT'er.
The "famous" introduction list with initial experiences can be found in THIS thread
Discussion about the first long-haul services and experiences can be found in another THREAD
Links to many trip reports can be found in https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/finn...ion-links.html.
Finnair A350 XWB master thread
Apr 27, 2016, 7:29 am
#376
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 4,783
According to https://sites.google.com/site/a350xw...roduction-list OH-LWE (5th A350 for AY) has been moved to Delivery Center yesterday.
The sixth A350 (OH-LWF) most probably won't come online this May. I hope AY (our friend Pekka) has not anticipated operating that plane in May.
The sixth A350 (OH-LWF) most probably won't come online this May. I hope AY (our friend Pekka) has not anticipated operating that plane in May.
Apr 27, 2016, 9:04 am
#377
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+ Plat (OWE)
Posts: 493
Why it is delayed for 4 months, well... there has been speculation on different forums and I think we can not single out one or two distinctive reasons on Airbus production line.
Apr 27, 2016, 10:10 am
#378
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 4,783
Yes, the months long delays are fine.
Just wondering if it is normal for an aircraft to be sitting at the delivery center for 10 days or more.
With Fukuoka and Guangzhou starting, AY needs the lift asap.
Just wondering if it is normal for an aircraft to be sitting at the delivery center for 10 days or more.
With Fukuoka and Guangzhou starting, AY needs the lift asap.
Apr 29, 2016, 2:39 pm
#379
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: HEL
Programs: AY+ Plat (OWE)
Posts: 493
OH-LWE is scheduled for delivery the day after tomorrow, 29.04.2016 and should start serving BKK as of 01MAY.
Why it is delayed for 4 months, well... there has been speculation on different forums and I think we can not single out one or two distinctive reasons on Airbus production line.
Why it is delayed for 4 months, well... there has been speculation on different forums and I think we can not single out one or two distinctive reasons on Airbus production line.
I am not particularly fond of AY 350 J, but welcome anyway!
May 7, 2016, 10:59 am
#380
Join Date: Dec 2013
Programs: AY+ Plat, A3*G
Posts: 672
Finnair still operates A350 on some European routes time to time, for example BRU and LHR. Does anyone know if they still seat Y people in some portion of flat beds like with training routes late last year or are they selling all 46 seats as J?
May 9, 2016, 2:20 am
#381
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: LHR
Programs: CX GO, BA Gold, OZ*G, IHG Spire RA
Posts: 316
Finally got to try the new J seat last week. For me it was more comfortable for sleep than the last generation of J. I'm 190cm tall. However overall the materials and build are very cheap especially when compared to the CX version of this seat. Biggest problem I had was lounging and the lack of a move-able footrest. Quite a fail here.
I'm always on the HKG<>HEL route which are both depart late evening so I never eat/care about the first meal. I didn't notice that the breakfast service was any slower/faster.
I'm always on the HKG<>HEL route which are both depart late evening so I never eat/care about the first meal. I didn't notice that the breakfast service was any slower/faster.
May 9, 2016, 9:00 am
#382
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 14,105
On the LWD now as AY51 - oh, the smell of a brand new plane! (No, no maiden flight, but still very few miles on the meter)
Big problem - under only 7 hrs (!) flighttime in the afternoon/evening, arriving to PEK at 6:30 am or so - to sleep or not to sleep?
Big problem - under only 7 hrs (!) flighttime in the afternoon/evening, arriving to PEK at 6:30 am or so - to sleep or not to sleep?
May 9, 2016, 9:44 am
#383
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Global
Posts: 5,998
May 10, 2016, 8:11 am
#384
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Jakarta
Programs: IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 6
I just want to know if there is Singapore passengers who already bought ticket for June flight with A350 and realize Finnair change the aircraft back to A340. I filed complaint for this change to Finnair and they said due to livery delay from Airbus. However, I just found out eventually no delay from Airbus but they change the destination to Seoul. This is not being mentioned back in October 2015 when they first launch A350 campaign.
I bought ticket in October and based on the order of destinations, Singapore will be the fifth destination but now they scaled back to October and inserting Seoul for 4 months until October.
Any Finnair officer here, please voice out your reason. If your reason is delay then I will not accept that looking at the fact above.
I bought ticket in October and based on the order of destinations, Singapore will be the fifth destination but now they scaled back to October and inserting Seoul for 4 months until October.
Any Finnair officer here, please voice out your reason. If your reason is delay then I will not accept that looking at the fact above.
May 10, 2016, 9:35 am
#387
Moderator, Finnair
Join Date: May 2011
Location: MMX (CPH)
Programs: Eurobonus Diamond, QR Gold, AY+ Platinum, A3*G, Nordic Choice Lifetime Platinum, SJ Prio Black
Posts: 14,174
Welcome to Flyertalk and the Finnair forum, ucartech!
We do have a Finnair company rep here, but they do not actively scan every thread for issues. You might have a better chance of getting an answer by either PM the rep or by using the normal customer service channels, twitter or facebook.
What I can say is that Finnair had a very generous rebooking policy for the first flights that got changed to another aircraft. Basically, anyone could rebook or or cancel for full refund. This was applied for the 'crew familiarisation program' ie the short haul training fllights, not for any of the long haul operations.
On oct 13, 2015 they announced that the launch schedule was not going to hold and that for future flights there was no guarantee that they would be served by A350 by the dates originally communicated. You can find the text here:
https://www.finnair.com/int/gb/flightinfo
under the heading "Changes in Finnair's European A350 flights and in the launch schedule for A350 long haul service"
In general, this passage is of interest
Ie they were not announcing any date for A350 on SIN route in october 2015 and they also said that if anyone wanted to change their ticket due to any subsequent equipment change, that would be according to normal fare rules.
We do have a Finnair company rep here, but they do not actively scan every thread for issues. You might have a better chance of getting an answer by either PM the rep or by using the normal customer service channels, twitter or facebook.
What I can say is that Finnair had a very generous rebooking policy for the first flights that got changed to another aircraft. Basically, anyone could rebook or or cancel for full refund. This was applied for the 'crew familiarisation program' ie the short haul training fllights, not for any of the long haul operations.
On oct 13, 2015 they announced that the launch schedule was not going to hold and that for future flights there was no guarantee that they would be served by A350 by the dates originally communicated. You can find the text here:
https://www.finnair.com/int/gb/flightinfo
under the heading "Changes in Finnair's European A350 flights and in the launch schedule for A350 long haul service"
In general, this passage is of interest
Finnair starts long-haul service to Shanghai with A350 on November 21, instead of the previously announced October 25. Customers with bookings on flights where the aircraft type changes from A350 to A330 can make changes to their booking according to normal ticket rules. Long-haul service start dates to other destinations will be announced at a later stage.
May 10, 2016, 9:53 pm
#389
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Jakarta
Programs: IHG Spire Elite
Posts: 6
Intuition, the news just came up on May 9, 2016. While back in October last year, Singapore should be served by A350 starting June 1, 2016. I knew exactly because the main reason I booked Finnair because of A350. If not A350, I would have fly with Qatar.
Even if you check Finnair website for A350 campaign, it doesn't show Seoul as the long haul destination of A350.
What makes me upset is Finnair has mislead passenger like me even they eventually will have the aircraft that is ready to serve Singapore-Helsinki. I would assume that Finnair is more on profit oriented than keeping their promise to Singapore passengers. It seemed Bangkok and Seoul is in high demand than Singapore.
I do have file complaint and they offer cancellations with a fee for each passenger. However, what makes me difficult to cancel is because I have prepared for everything for the Scandianavia trip and cancellations would disrupt all the itinerary that I have made and many of the hotels and transportation I have already paid in advance.
Even if you check Finnair website for A350 campaign, it doesn't show Seoul as the long haul destination of A350.
What makes me upset is Finnair has mislead passenger like me even they eventually will have the aircraft that is ready to serve Singapore-Helsinki. I would assume that Finnair is more on profit oriented than keeping their promise to Singapore passengers. It seemed Bangkok and Seoul is in high demand than Singapore.
I do have file complaint and they offer cancellations with a fee for each passenger. However, what makes me difficult to cancel is because I have prepared for everything for the Scandianavia trip and cancellations would disrupt all the itinerary that I have made and many of the hotels and transportation I have already paid in advance.
May 11, 2016, 12:24 am
#390
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: HKG
Programs: AA EXP
Posts: 541
Bulkheads versus exit rows
I've been through a few pages but not all so apologies if this has been covered before.
What's the thought on selecting Y bulkhead (row 21) versus exit row (row 41)? I'm oneworld emerald so both are available to me.
I usually prefer aisle seats unless there is a window seat in an exit row that offers ample space to get out without disturbing others.
Bulkhead is part of economy comfort - besides noise cancelling headphones, amenity kit what else is different?
How much legroom does the bulkhead have? Some bulkheads have a lot of legroom (person next to you in window can easily get out without disturbing you). One experience I had in the bulkhead on an AY A340 (forget which one exactly) was that I could not fully extend my legs out. I would have been better in a regular seat as I could have put my legs under the seat in front of me.
Cheers
What's the thought on selecting Y bulkhead (row 21) versus exit row (row 41)? I'm oneworld emerald so both are available to me.
I usually prefer aisle seats unless there is a window seat in an exit row that offers ample space to get out without disturbing others.
Bulkhead is part of economy comfort - besides noise cancelling headphones, amenity kit what else is different?
How much legroom does the bulkhead have? Some bulkheads have a lot of legroom (person next to you in window can easily get out without disturbing you). One experience I had in the bulkhead on an AY A340 (forget which one exactly) was that I could not fully extend my legs out. I would have been better in a regular seat as I could have put my legs under the seat in front of me.
Cheers