The_Bouncer

I did a trip in November that was in many ways similar to yours, and I can echo what everyone else has said. The original itinerary was simply way too packed. I very nearly made this mistake myself, and was talked out of it by several people here on FT. I'm very glad I was, because otherwise I would just have been racing around ticking boxes.

My trip consisted of San Francisco, Yosemite, Mammoth Lakes, Death Valley, Las Vegas, Zion, Bryce Canyon, Page, Grand Canyon, Flagstaff, Winslow, Phoenix and Tucson.

That itinerary took me 27 days, without wife and kids, and I felt I had nowhere near enough time in the absolutely stunning Zion and Bryce Canyon (my fault for trying to rush and ending up with a few dead days at the end).

If you want to actually see anything (other than through a window at 75mph), you need some multi-night stops.

San Francisco is an enjoyable city - I spent 4 nights there, including trips to Alcatraz, Marin County and Muir Woods - all worthwhile.

Yosemite is definitely worth two nights, minimum- I happily strolled around for about 7 hours there one day.

Mammoth Lakes is nice, but I was content with a lunch stop and a one-hour walk. Probably a good place to stop on a long drive and let the kids burn off some energy.

I enjoyed Death Valley, but I was there in November. Having toured Australia in Summer, I just can't imagine Death Valley in July. You will spend the whole time stuck in the car with air-con blasting. Either that, or you will just in some nondescript cafeteria somewhere drinking iced coffee.

Zion National Park and Bryce Canyon were both simply stunning. These two days were among the highlights of my trip. I could very easily have spent a week in this area.

Vegas was worthwhile for the experience - but then I was doing the trip solo - I'm not sure whether you would want to spend any length of time there with the wife and kids.

The Grand Canyon is a must-see. How long you spend there depends on how much you like walking. I filled two days just walking the trails at the top.

The best advice I can give you is:

1. Don't try to pack too much in. You need some chill-out time, and you need to take time to appreciate the things you see.

2. Don't be afraid to switch your planned itineraries around. Throw different ideas around and see what works for you. The trip I eventually took was quite different from the one I planned.

Here is a link to the planning phase of my trip - maybe there will be some useful ideas in there for you too:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/west/1744380-western-usa-road-trip-advice-please-3.html

Also, beware of the problems on Ca-Hwy 1 this year. There is severe disruption due to landslides and a damaged bridge, which has to be demolished. I was planning to drive this route this fall, and have more or less shelved my plans:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/california/1585849-pacific-coast-highway-ca-route-1-between-sf-la-closed-indefinitely-near-big-sur-19.html#post27956984

Loren Pechtel

Last year I was looking for a minivan to take some of her relatives around. *Most* companies had policies that would have resulted in some big charges.

Alex71

Thanks, The_Bouncer for sharing your experience as well as the advice you got from Gardyloo and others on this forum.

It is a shame we had to cut out Grand and Bryce Canyon as well as Zion, but I'm convinced it was the right decision that will make our trip much more relaxed and enjoyable. Especially Grand Canyon seems to require some hiking for the best views, which would not have been feasible because of the heat.

We did keep Death Valley in the itinerary with the understanding that it will get extremely hot there. Average low at the time of our trip is 88° F, so we will be able to enjoy the sunrise in bearable conditions but will need to be out mid-morning.

darthbimmer

I agree, it is a shame, and it also is the right decision. Look at it this way: Put together Grand Canyon, Zion, Bryce, and all the lesser known parks in Red Rocks country that are beautiful and totally worth seeing, and you've got at least two weeks of activity for a future visit. @:-)

The_Bouncer

I agree. You simply cannot see all this region has to offer in three weeks. I could quite happily spend a year touring the west. Your original itinerary was too packed, and something had to give.

WRCSolberg

I haven't seen a rental car company charge for mileage in years, and sure enough, when I throw in some random dates from July for rental cars into Expedia, every single option has unlimited mileage.

CarolJeanE

But, your plans sound dreadful, especially Arizona and Nevada in the summer. You'll be too miserably hot to enjoy anything. Stick with California for your trip.

Loren Pechtel

Enterprise:

https://enterprise.custhelp.com/app/...%2F-enterprise

My memory was wrong--it's free for the state and surrounding states. Our trip went two states.

Budget: Some discussion of miles but I can't find the rules.

Alamo:

https://www.alamo.com/en_US/car-rent...onditions.html

Again, a mention of miles but it doesn't say how many.

I think that's enough to make my point.

darthbimmer

Is it possible we're comparing apples and oranges here? I've noticed that renting specifically a minivan sometimes incurs per-mile charges when a reservation for any smaller vehicle class at the same agency, location, and time includes unlimited free miles. A relative who's familiar with the industry says that minivans are sometimes classed as specialty vehicles, which puts them into the not-unlimited mileage rules.

Loren Pechtel

The mileage policies I was looking at were all general to the fleet, not specific to minivans.

Perhaps it's something local to Las Vegas, though.

Reindeerflame

Death Valley is quite heavily visited in the summer months now, which is in contrast to the 1950s and 1960s -- when few cars had air conditioning. European tourists find it interesting and compelling, especially considering the extremes in temperature and elevation in a desert environment. There's nothing wrong with this, as long as due caution and care is taken.

The original itinerary included too much. The revised itinerary looks much more reasonable. There's a difference between driving to all of these places and enjoying what the places have to offer. It is likely possible to phyiscally make the original itinerary, but it would hardly be an enjoyable trip.

hawkxp

Having lived in the West all my life, I agree with most of the posters---you are planning much to much.

I was lured into doing too much last year by google earth in Ireland. Planning looked so good-less then 120 miles planned per day, 9 days to see a small island--right! After the fact realized I needed twice the time allotted to all stops.

My own suggestions of must sees are: Grand Canyon, Zion, Bryce, California wine country, SF. There's very little in Socal to interest me any more (born there), terrible (can not over say that) traffic.

I agree with the comments about the heat. Nevada, Palm Springs etc. is likely to be really miserable. Been through Death Valley, nothing there, HOT!

Good Luck!