E- entirely full, no pax permitted to move to near empty E+
Nov 14, 2011, 10:26 pm
#46
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Programs: UA 1MM Plat, AA Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 208
as much as protecting revenue is important, the bitterness it engenders from non-elites flying UA shouldn't be discounted long-term....
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+). Again, it engenders anti-UA bitterness, and makes the non-status GM want to fly another airline where there would be lower seating density with a similar situation of 1/2 plane full (but 100% E- full).
Sitting in the exit row E+ one row ahead of E-, I'm personally heard of lot of E- seated people in this situation mumble bitterness about the above. And it is sorta true that (with all other plane capacity factors equal) they would have more spacing if they flew another airline without E+. Over time this makes an effect on non-elite fliers.
...thus the alternative in their mind is not them BUYING up to E+ next time, but simply booking another airline altogether period.
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+). Again, it engenders anti-UA bitterness, and makes the non-status GM want to fly another airline where there would be lower seating density with a similar situation of 1/2 plane full (but 100% E- full).
Sitting in the exit row E+ one row ahead of E-, I'm personally heard of lot of E- seated people in this situation mumble bitterness about the above. And it is sorta true that (with all other plane capacity factors equal) they would have more spacing if they flew another airline without E+. Over time this makes an effect on non-elite fliers.
...thus the alternative in their mind is not them BUYING up to E+ next time, but simply booking another airline altogether period.
The question is that offset by the additional revenue United gets selling E+ in its various forms (buy-ups, credit cards, etc.)? Probably at best it is a wash.
Nov 14, 2011, 10:30 pm
#47
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Stockholm, NYC
Programs: UA 1K, AY Gold, Hyatt diamond.
Posts: 157
I always wonder if I should complain when the rule is not enforced. On many flights beeing elite gives you an entire row or at least an empty middle seat. Some FA:s have however allowed passengers to move up for free spoiling this. On one TATL flight this gave some passengers in E- rows for themselves while we who had that privilege in E+ before lost it.
Nov 14, 2011, 10:40 pm
#48
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: LAS - where you can get married and divorced in the same 24 hour period. Perfect for the woman who's saving herself for marriage and the man who wants a one night stand.
Programs: DL DM, Hilton Diamond, IHG Diamond, Marriott Platinum, UA, AA, AS, WN kettle, Hertz PC
Posts: 1,613
That was my trip home from SD on Sunday! We did reward on the way down, but the tickets on the way home were so cheap I did not even want to burn 10,000 miles.
I bought her ticket first. Then mine later on a seperate PNR. We had bulkhead 7 B and C.
Of course, I was upgraded and I had her in the middle seat (B)...
And, to further prove the similarity between your wife and mine: She refused to take my F seat and sat in row 7...
Yes, happy ending, we are still married one full day later!
I always put the lower status in the outside and I'm in the middle, that way if I get upgraded they still have a non-ceenter,
It was a first for me...
When do they do it? Once airborne after the seatbelt sign is off?
If they do it before the plane takes off, coudn't that mess with their on time departures? Do they even have the CC machines booted up before take off? Aren't they electronic, and must be shut down like my kindle?
I bought her ticket first. Then mine later on a seperate PNR. We had bulkhead 7 B and C.
Of course, I was upgraded and I had her in the middle seat (B)...
And, to further prove the similarity between your wife and mine: She refused to take my F seat and sat in row 7...
Yes, happy ending, we are still married one full day later!
I always put the lower status in the outside and I'm in the middle, that way if I get upgraded they still have a non-ceenter,
It was a first for me...
When do they do it? Once airborne after the seatbelt sign is off?
If they do it before the plane takes off, coudn't that mess with their on time departures? Do they even have the CC machines booted up before take off? Aren't they electronic, and must be shut down like my kindle?
Nov 14, 2011, 10:43 pm
#49
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Las Vegas
Programs: DL Platinum, AA Lifetime Gold, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum, Radisson Premium
Posts: 6,638
FA did her job.
I would have given her a compliment certificate and sent in a positive review.
I would have given her a compliment certificate and sent in a positive review.
Nov 14, 2011, 11:04 pm
#50
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: NoCal
Programs: UA 1K 2.7MM
Posts: 232
Agree w most! If you want to sit in E+ pay for E+. If there was a weight and balance issue, the Capt would have addressed it. And I agree w those who don't like when the rules are *not* enforced.
Nov 14, 2011, 11:13 pm
#51
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Washington, D.C.
Posts: 282
Delta will soon have the premium economy cabin as well so there goes that argument of this bitterness tie in with that occupy crap & customers will flow to those airlines.
Note to those elite passengers traveling with your significant others... Put YOURSELF in the middle seat when you first book the reservation. Just maybe subconsciously you wanted to submit your SO to a middle seat when you made those few mouse clicks; it's not like you didn't realize you could be upgraded.
Note to those elite passengers traveling with your significant others... Put YOURSELF in the middle seat when you first book the reservation. Just maybe subconsciously you wanted to submit your SO to a middle seat when you made those few mouse clicks; it's not like you didn't realize you could be upgraded.
Nov 14, 2011, 11:30 pm
#52
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SFO/SJC
Programs: UA Silver, Marriott Gold, Hilton Gold
Posts: 14,891
as much as protecting revenue is important, the bitterness it engenders from non-elites flying UA shouldn't be discounted long-term....
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+).
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+).
Welcome to air travel in the year 2011. The better seats go to either elites or those who are willing to shell out a few extra bucks. It could be worse - Air Canada even charges elites for their "preferred" seats in most cases (Their 1K equivalents get it comp. on all but the lowest fares (Tango), however all other AC elites only get them free on a Lattitude, or the highest of fares).
Nov 15, 2011, 1:03 am
#53
Join Date: May 2003
Programs: UA1k; Bonvoy Titanium; Hilton Gold; IHG Gold; AA Plat Pro
Posts: 1,794
Nov 15, 2011, 1:23 am
#54
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: MEL
Programs: QR platinum
Posts: 606
It can be worse. I booked SFO-PEK-PVG-LAX-SFO, paid ticket. Same itin for my wife, but award. Have I ever not cleared LAX-SFO? Not that I recall. I knew it was going to happen ahead of time, but there's apparently no way to turn down the automatic upgrade request, and of course it comes through 5 or 6 days out, and of course by the time I log on and check seats the exit row seat where I was (next to her) is now taken by somebody else, the plane is full, etc. And of course she refused to switch seats with me. Is this drill familiar to you? 
Nov 15, 2011, 2:37 am
#55
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: London & Sonoma CA
Programs: UA 1K, MM *G for life, BAEC Gold
Posts: 10,227
This is one of the great perks of flying UA outside peak season for me. Not so much the extra legroom - although that's great - but the relatively empty E+ cabin compared to the full E- cabin. More often than not I'll have a seat beside me on the 777.
If handled correctly, I can't see why the issue should be so divisive. Everyone is fully aware that there are different classes of service on board and this is one. I would regard the boarding procedure itself as far more divisive - I benefit from it and it makes me cringe with embarrassment. But paying for (whether in cash or through loyalty) more space is a simple financial transaction that everyone should understand, no different from paying for a larger car.
If handled correctly, I can't see why the issue should be so divisive. Everyone is fully aware that there are different classes of service on board and this is one. I would regard the boarding procedure itself as far more divisive - I benefit from it and it makes me cringe with embarrassment. But paying for (whether in cash or through loyalty) more space is a simple financial transaction that everyone should understand, no different from paying for a larger car.
Nov 15, 2011, 6:39 am
#56
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: SFO
Programs: UA 1K, HH Diamond
Posts: 173
It can be worse. I booked SFO-PEK-PVG-LAX-SFO, paid ticket. Same itin for my wife, but award. Have I ever not cleared LAX-SFO? Not that I recall. I knew it was going to happen ahead of time, but there's apparently no way to turn down the automatic upgrade request, and of course it comes through 5 or 6 days out, and of course by the time I log on and check seats the exit row seat where I was (next to her) is now taken by somebody else, the plane is full, etc. And of course she refused to switch seats with me. Is this drill familiar to you?
Nov 15, 2011, 8:17 am
#57
Join Date: Sep 2005
Programs: UA 1K MM, HH Gold, Marriott Gold Elite
Posts: 1,478
I always wonder if I should complain when the rule is not enforced. On many flights beeing elite gives you an entire row or at least an empty middle seat. Some FA:s have however allowed passengers to move up for free spoiling this. On one TATL flight this gave some passengers in E- rows for themselves while we who had that privilege in E+ before lost it.
Nov 15, 2011, 9:34 am
#58
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 50,262
as much as protecting revenue is important, the bitterness it engenders from non-elites flying UA shouldn't be discounted long-term....
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+). Again, it engenders anti-UA bitterness, and makes the non-status GM want to fly another airline where there would be lower seating density with a similar situation of 1/2 plane full (but 100% E- full).
Sitting in the exit row E+ one row ahead of E-, I'm personally heard of lot of E- seated people in this situation mumble bitterness about the above. And it is sorta true that (with all other plane capacity factors equal) they would have more spacing if they flew another airline without E+. Over time this makes an effect on non-elite fliers.
...thus the alternative in their mind is not them BUYING up to E+ next time, but simply booking another airline altogether period.
For something flying in E- that day.... had they chosen to fly US Air or Delta or Southwest instead that day, and they wouldn't likely be in the cramped sardine situation in the overcrowded E- cabin (but empty E+). Again, it engenders anti-UA bitterness, and makes the non-status GM want to fly another airline where there would be lower seating density with a similar situation of 1/2 plane full (but 100% E- full).
Sitting in the exit row E+ one row ahead of E-, I'm personally heard of lot of E- seated people in this situation mumble bitterness about the above. And it is sorta true that (with all other plane capacity factors equal) they would have more spacing if they flew another airline without E+. Over time this makes an effect on non-elite fliers.
...thus the alternative in their mind is not them BUYING up to E+ next time, but simply booking another airline altogether period.
Much of the problem solved with the universal proliferation of BOB payment devices allowing them what want to UG to E+ to buy it onboard, even in-flight.
Nov 15, 2011, 4:46 pm
#59
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: SFO
Programs: COdbaUA Platinum 2MM
Posts: 5,532
I bought her ticket first. Then mine later on a seperate PNR. We had bulkhead 7 B and C.
Of course, I was upgraded and I had her in the middle seat (B)...
And, to further prove the similarity between your wife and mine: She refused to take my F seat and sat in row 7...
Yes, happy ending, we are still married one full day later!
Of course, I was upgraded and I had her in the middle seat (B)...
And, to further prove the similarity between your wife and mine: She refused to take my F seat and sat in row 7...
Yes, happy ending, we are still married one full day later!
Nov 15, 2011, 7:28 pm
#60
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: LHR (sometimes CLE, SFO, BOS, LAX, SEA)
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 5,893
It's too bad that, according to the OP's account, a United elite member wasn't able to secure a seat in the Economy Plus section.
If someone said to the flight attendant "can I go sit up there, I'm a Premier member, see?" it seems like a reasonable thing to do is to get the gate agent to assign that passenger a new seat. I suppose that only works before takeoff.
Seems like another reasonable thing to do might be to charge the passenger the on-board buy-up, explain that if they don't they face disciplinary action, and give them the phone number they need to call to request a refund for being improperly charged a buy-up fee as a 2P and the e-mail address they can use to suggest any changes to policies they think flight attendants should be required to follow.
If someone said to the flight attendant "can I go sit up there, I'm a Premier member, see?" it seems like a reasonable thing to do is to get the gate agent to assign that passenger a new seat. I suppose that only works before takeoff.
Seems like another reasonable thing to do might be to charge the passenger the on-board buy-up, explain that if they don't they face disciplinary action, and give them the phone number they need to call to request a refund for being improperly charged a buy-up fee as a 2P and the e-mail address they can use to suggest any changes to policies they think flight attendants should be required to follow.