Unable to book Australia flights to GUM on United either paid or award
May 13, 2024, 10:12 am
#16
Join Date: Jan 2005
Programs: SQ, QF, UA, CO, DL
Posts: 3,033
CNS-GUM is ancient news, unfortunately, but you're likely correct that they would have published a SYD-GUM fare (and certainly correct that there was a CNS-GUM fare) at that time. However, it would have been either routing- or distance-limited such that when CNS-GUM was dropped, the fare wouldn't have been bookable anyway. They would have put in a restriction that required flying the UA CNS-GUM flight. (Also, if pmCO ever offered 737 service from HNL to California, I don't remember it 
Not true. The fact that there are no UA fares filed for SYD-GUM has no impact at all on whether or not UA can sell you a single cash ticket from SYD to GUM. All it means is that you'd need to construct a "broken fare," meaning that you'd "break" the fare at a transfer point. For example, suppose that OP was going to travel SYD-MNL-GUM. With no SYD-GUM fare, OP would look for a SYD-MNL* fare that (a) could be plated on UA ticket stock and (b) that allowed and end-on-end combination with the MNL-GUM UA fare. This SYD-MNL fare could be with any airline -- UA wouldn't file one for the same reason that they don't file SYD-GUM; there's no money to be made in flying somebody SYD-SFO-MNL. But they could use a Philippine Airlines or Qantas fare if those fares met the two criteria listed: if those airlines chose to allow UA to ticket those fares, and if the fares were written to allow end-on-end combination with a UA fare from MNL-GUM.
* Faring is actually quite a bit more complicated than that, and in theory there may be other valid combinations depending upon where the traveler is going next, but It think the point is made.
Not true. The fact that there are no UA fares filed for SYD-GUM has no impact at all on whether or not UA can sell you a single cash ticket from SYD to GUM. All it means is that you'd need to construct a "broken fare," meaning that you'd "break" the fare at a transfer point. For example, suppose that OP was going to travel SYD-MNL-GUM. With no SYD-GUM fare, OP would look for a SYD-MNL* fare that (a) could be plated on UA ticket stock and (b) that allowed and end-on-end combination with the MNL-GUM UA fare. This SYD-MNL fare could be with any airline -- UA wouldn't file one for the same reason that they don't file SYD-GUM; there's no money to be made in flying somebody SYD-SFO-MNL. But they could use a Philippine Airlines or Qantas fare if those fares met the two criteria listed: if those airlines chose to allow UA to ticket those fares, and if the fares were written to allow end-on-end combination with a UA fare from MNL-GUM.
* Faring is actually quite a bit more complicated than that, and in theory there may be other valid combinations depending upon where the traveler is going next, but It think the point is made.
As for ancient service, ouch, making me feel old!
CNS-GUM was cut in the second half of 2015. On the other point I was trying to give practical advice to the OP if he cannot get united.com to issue his ticket he can always put two tickets together. Maybe not the best technical explanation, though, which we can always rely on you for.
May 13, 2024, 10:28 am
#17
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 21,785
For fun, while CNS was still in service, I put together an itinerary something like CNS-GUM-island hopper-HNL-SFO-somewhere-BOS which was all on B737s. It was 10 segments, of course I never flew such a routing.
As for ancient service, ouch, making me feel old! CNS-GUM was cut in the second half of 2015.
As for ancient service, ouch, making me feel old!
CNS-GUM was cut in the second half of 2015. Yes, by 2015, post-merger, it would definitely have been possible to fly 737 from HNL to California. (It's possible that pmCO flew HNL-LAX on a 737 sometime between 2005 and 2012; I wasn't flying CO much at the time and could have missed it). So, yeah, CNS-GUM-(5 stops)-HNL-(LAX-SFO)-(tour of hubs)-BOS. You could still do the same thing today with MNL. Sorry about that. The thing about "no fare being filed" had been posted a couple of times by different people as if it were definitive, whereas it isn't. But more to the point -- yes, OP can certainly buy two tickets to connect, but then they lose protection in the case of delays, and I wouldn't personally want to risk that on these particular routes unless I had an overnight at my connection city. There just aren't enough flights in this region to make me feel comfortable that I could get to my destination on my own at a reasonable cost if necessary.My alternative would be, if you can't book it on United.com, try a travel agent -- or, frankly, try a different airline. I will rarely, if ever, recommend Philippine Airlines, but they're probably the best choice for this particular itinerary, as they do offer MNL-GUM service and you won't have to change terminals at MNL. You could also book multi-carrier flights through Tokyo to Seoul if you would prefer to avoid MNL, which isn't an unreasonable desire.
If OP prefers to use United MileagePlus miles, multi-city search should allow it, at the cost of paying a lot of miles. But with the way that UA has been adjusting their redemption rates recently, there's no guarantee that it would be fewer miles if the flights showed up on a simple SYD-GUM search.
May 13, 2024, 10:32 am
#18
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: ORD
Programs: UA 1K, QR Silver, DL Silver
Posts: 4,258
LOL, my bad -- I thought it was cut much earlier than that. Yes, by 2015, post-merger, it would definitely have been possible to fly 737 from HNL to California. (It's possible that pmCO flew HNL-LAX on a 737 sometime between 2005 and 2012; I wasn't flying CO much at the time and could have missed it). So, yeah, CNS-GUM-(5 stops)-HNL-(LAX-SFO)-(tour of hubs)-BOS. You could still do the same thing today with MNL.
Sorry about that. The thing about "no fare being filed" had been posted a couple of times by different people as if it were definitive, whereas it isn't. But more to the point -- yes, OP can certainly buy two tickets to connect, but then they lose protection in the case of delays, and I wouldn't personally want to risk that on these particular routes unless I had an overnight at my connection city. There just aren't enough flights in this region to make me feel comfortable that I could get to my destination on my own at a reasonable cost if necessary.
My alternative would be, if you can't book it on United.com, try a travel agent -- or, frankly, try a different airline. I will rarely, if ever, recommend Philippine Airlines, but they're probably the best choice for this particular itinerary, as they do offer MNL-GUM service and you won't have to change terminals at MNL. You could also book multi-carrier flights through Tokyo to Seoul if you would prefer to avoid MNL, which isn't an unreasonable desire.
If OP prefers to use United MileagePlus miles, multi-city search should allow it, at the cost of paying a lot of miles. But with the way that UA has been adjusting their redemption rates recently, there's no guarantee that it would be fewer miles if the flights showed up on a simple SYD-GUM search.
Yes, by 2015, post-merger, it would definitely have been possible to fly 737 from HNL to California. (It's possible that pmCO flew HNL-LAX on a 737 sometime between 2005 and 2012; I wasn't flying CO much at the time and could have missed it). So, yeah, CNS-GUM-(5 stops)-HNL-(LAX-SFO)-(tour of hubs)-BOS. You could still do the same thing today with MNL. Sorry about that. The thing about "no fare being filed" had been posted a couple of times by different people as if it were definitive, whereas it isn't. But more to the point -- yes, OP can certainly buy two tickets to connect, but then they lose protection in the case of delays, and I wouldn't personally want to risk that on these particular routes unless I had an overnight at my connection city. There just aren't enough flights in this region to make me feel comfortable that I could get to my destination on my own at a reasonable cost if necessary.My alternative would be, if you can't book it on United.com, try a travel agent -- or, frankly, try a different airline. I will rarely, if ever, recommend Philippine Airlines, but they're probably the best choice for this particular itinerary, as they do offer MNL-GUM service and you won't have to change terminals at MNL. You could also book multi-carrier flights through Tokyo to Seoul if you would prefer to avoid MNL, which isn't an unreasonable desire.
If OP prefers to use United MileagePlus miles, multi-city search should allow it, at the cost of paying a lot of miles. But with the way that UA has been adjusting their redemption rates recently, there's no guarantee that it would be fewer miles if the flights showed up on a simple SYD-GUM search.
Still no help for the OP, but interesting nonetheless.
May 13, 2024, 12:56 pm
#19
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: MFR
Programs: UA 1K 1.9MM, Hilton Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 2,907
This need to go in that Craziest thing I ever heard from an agent thread!
May 13, 2024, 3:32 pm
#21
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Federal Way, WA
Programs: Mileage Plus 2P, Marriott Silver, many others
Posts: 1,314
May 13, 2024, 7:49 pm
#22
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 152
I was able to to generate SYD-HND-GUM on a United ticket by searching Google flights. I inputted SYD-GUM as my origin/destination, chose a random Saturday in August, and a one-way ticket in economy. I select the "United" option to 'purchase' after selecting my flight option via Google search:
Learn more about booking options
Book with United
Airline
Local price subject to United States regulations
$3,986
Continue
Book with United
Airline
Local price subject to Australia regulations
$3,993
A$6,043
If you're not familiar with Google flights, when you click on the United option (I used the USD link), it opens a new tab (target) with the United ticket in your cart already. I was NOT logged into my United account, and it had this flight already in my cart.
Flight selection list
Flight 1 of 1
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:10 am to 4:45 am1 stop
Duration: 17h 35m17 hours35 minutes
Travelers: 1
Includes Travel Operated by QANTAS Airways
Flight connection list
Connection 1 of 2
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:10 am to 8:10 pm
Duration: 10h10 hours
Flight Number: QF 59
Aircraft type: Airbus A330-300
Operated by QANTAS Airways
Duration
3H 45M3 HOURS45 MINUTES
Connection 2 of 2
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:55 pm to 4:45 am
Please note this flight involves a date change
Duration: 3h 50m3 hours50 minutes
Flight Number: UA 848
Aircraft type: Boeing 737-800
Hide details
$3,894.50
Taxes and fees
$91.09
$3,985.59
or starting from
$356/month
I was NOT able to get United.com to generate this ticket when I searched United.com - though I could get the ticket in my cart if I used Google flights to "add it" to my cart (attempt to buy it). I could also not generate this ticket on United.com as an award ticket.
This is going to sound ... crazy ... but I am wondering if there is a rules issue with Qantas flights being sold by United? When you flew this routing before, was any leg of it on Qantas? Maybe something changed there with selling/redeeming United miles for Qantas tickets?
Of course, maybe United.com is not generating these tickets because they don't exist anymore as a routing...but why would they generate for Google flights?
(IP address in the US)
^^ At the risk of sounding even .. crazier .. I am able to get SYD-GUM now on United.com (paid - no award is possible).
Booking options
How options are rankedLearn more about booking options
Book with United
Airline
Local price subject to United States regulations
$3,986
Continue
Book with United
Airline
Local price subject to Australia regulations
$3,993
A$6,043
If you're not familiar with Google flights, when you click on the United option (I used the USD link), it opens a new tab (target) with the United ticket in your cart already. I was NOT logged into my United account, and it had this flight already in my cart.
ONEWAY (1 TRAVELER)
Revise this tripFlight selection list
Flight 1 of 1
Sydney SYD to Guam GUM
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:10 am to 4:45 am1 stop
Duration: 17h 35m17 hours35 minutes
Travelers: 1
Includes Travel Operated by QANTAS Airways
Flight connection list
Connection 1 of 2
Sydney SYD to Tokyo HND
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:10 am to 8:10 pm
Duration: 10h10 hours
Flight Number: QF 59
Aircraft type: Airbus A330-300
Operated by QANTAS Airways
Duration
3H 45M3 HOURS45 MINUTES
Connection 2 of 2
Tokyo HND to Guam GUM
Aug 17Saturday, August 1711:55 pm to 4:45 am
Please note this flight involves a date changeDuration: 3h 50m3 hours50 minutes
Flight Number: UA 848
Aircraft type: Boeing 737-800
Hide details
Price breakdown
Fare$3,894.50
Taxes and fees
$91.09
Total due
$3,985.59
or starting from
$356/month
I was NOT able to get United.com to generate this ticket when I searched United.com - though I could get the ticket in my cart if I used Google flights to "add it" to my cart (attempt to buy it). I could also not generate this ticket on United.com as an award ticket.
This is going to sound ... crazy ... but I am wondering if there is a rules issue with Qantas flights being sold by United? When you flew this routing before, was any leg of it on Qantas? Maybe something changed there with selling/redeeming United miles for Qantas tickets?
Of course, maybe United.com is not generating these tickets because they don't exist anymore as a routing...but why would they generate for Google flights?
(IP address in the US)
^^ At the risk of sounding even .. crazier .. I am able to get SYD-GUM now on United.com (paid - no award is possible).
Last edited by WineCountryUA; May 13, 2024 at 8:04 pm Reason: merged consecutive posts by same member
May 13, 2024, 9:21 pm
#23
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6
Hi, an update. Yes can book as a multi-city award booking - but a lot more points required(see below). Another person at United said this should definitely price as a one way award booking (as in the past) and has passed on to another Department (again) and United is looking into it.
Now on 16 July on Air Canada one way award PERGUM is 37500 miles. So other Star Alliance Airlines can price this award. However I only have United miles!
16 JulyTuesday, 16 July9:20 am to 8:00 am1 stop (Thai)
Show details
Flight 2 of 2
17 JulyWednesday, 17 July11:05 am to 4:00 pmNonstop (United)
Show details
805 kg CO2Carbon emissions estimate: 805 kilograms.
Learn more about carbon emissions
50,000 miles
Taxes and fees
AUD 99.59
50,000 miles
+ AUD 99.59
Now on 16 July on Air Canada one way award PERGUM is 37500 miles. So other Star Alliance Airlines can price this award. However I only have United miles!
United MULTI-CITY (1 TRAVELER)
Flight selection list Flight 1 of 2Perth PER to Fukuoka FUK
16 JulyTuesday, 16 July9:20 am to 8:00 am1 stop (Thai)
Show details
Flight 2 of 2
Fukuoka FUK to Guam GUM
17 JulyWednesday, 17 July11:05 am to 4:00 pmNonstop (United)
Show details
805 kg CO2Carbon emissions estimate: 805 kilograms.
Learn more about carbon emissions
Price breakdown
Fare50,000 miles
Taxes and fees
AUD 99.59
Total due
50,000 miles
+ AUD 99.59
May 13, 2024, 10:33 pm
#24
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 21,785
Hi, an update. Yes can book as a multi-city award booking - but a lot more points required(see below). Another person at United said this should definitely price as a one way award booking (as in the past) and has passed on to another Department (again) and United is looking into it.
It remains possible that UA accidentally removed the Australia/NZ - South Asia - Oceania routing for award travel. It's also possible that they did it intentionally. Or, their search engine isn't coming up with awards that go thousands of miles out of the way.
As a data point, I also don't seem to be able to find awards from the Central and Southern Africa region to GUM, but I do see awards from the Northern Africa region. I don't see any for Central Asia. I don't see any in Oceania except for the UA-operated flights within the region. This isn't an isolated incident and it may not be a mistake.