Q regarding child turned 2 mid trip, airline says too bad, AC segment, UA ticket
Sep 23, 2022, 2:50 am
#1
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Q regarding child turned 2 mid trip, airline says too bad, AC segment, UA ticket
a family member booked a RT for the entire family on UA stock YUL-EWR-TLV and return direct TLV-YUL flying AC metal.
a child in the family was under two before booking; he turned two mid-trip while in TLV.
no date changes were made to the ticket; they returned on the originally scheduled date.
A few days before his return, he happened to mention to me that his little one seems to drop off the reservation for the return. He called UA and they told his someone would get back to him and that he shouldn't worry; no one called back and make a long story short, he was told after multiple phone calls that with only one seat left on the flight, he'd better buy the last ticket (in premium) for the child-- or he would find his child, and by extension, himself, stuck without a way back.
I say be gentle because frequent flyers- myself included- would probably not have purchase such a ticket online, knowing things are complictaed in such situations-- but still, it seems to me, that if he purchased a ticket for a certain person with a known-to-airline birthday, and leaves as scheduled on all legs (as opposed to a ticket change which would trigger a different fare for an older age), it seems a bit desingenoius legally, for an airline to collect a fare, create a contract with a traveller, and then simply not allow them to board because of an age change? Surely, they could put on the website when you try to book a notice that says "PASSENGER AGE CHANGE DURING TRAVEL MAKES FARE UNSELLABLE" or such?
Had he known, and purchased (half or full) ticket for that child when he did all the others, he would have paid much less-- and in any case, I think that from a legal standpoint, airline acceptance of payment and no notice (and UA agents on the phone saying he would be fine not to worry) is unfair.
What is his best approach? the airline said "too bad." a DOT letter? small claims court?
Knowing I am the frequent flyer in the family, they have asked for advice- and saying "tough noogies" is not my preffered response.
Thank you for any help and suggestions.
a child in the family was under two before booking; he turned two mid-trip while in TLV.
no date changes were made to the ticket; they returned on the originally scheduled date.
A few days before his return, he happened to mention to me that his little one seems to drop off the reservation for the return. He called UA and they told his someone would get back to him and that he shouldn't worry; no one called back and make a long story short, he was told after multiple phone calls that with only one seat left on the flight, he'd better buy the last ticket (in premium) for the child-- or he would find his child, and by extension, himself, stuck without a way back.
I say be gentle because frequent flyers- myself included- would probably not have purchase such a ticket online, knowing things are complictaed in such situations-- but still, it seems to me, that if he purchased a ticket for a certain person with a known-to-airline birthday, and leaves as scheduled on all legs (as opposed to a ticket change which would trigger a different fare for an older age), it seems a bit desingenoius legally, for an airline to collect a fare, create a contract with a traveller, and then simply not allow them to board because of an age change? Surely, they could put on the website when you try to book a notice that says "PASSENGER AGE CHANGE DURING TRAVEL MAKES FARE UNSELLABLE" or such?
Had he known, and purchased (half or full) ticket for that child when he did all the others, he would have paid much less-- and in any case, I think that from a legal standpoint, airline acceptance of payment and no notice (and UA agents on the phone saying he would be fine not to worry) is unfair.
What is his best approach? the airline said "too bad." a DOT letter? small claims court?
Knowing I am the frequent flyer in the family, they have asked for advice- and saying "tough noogies" is not my preffered response.
Thank you for any help and suggestions.
Sep 23, 2022, 4:28 am
#2
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The separate tickets for age 2+ are mandated by law, so they certainly shouldn't have told him that it would work out. Once the airline realized that the child wasn't eligible to sit on a lap as an infant, there was no chance that they were going to allow him to board without a separate seat.
Sep 23, 2022, 4:39 am
#3
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It's considered unsafe for a kid 2 or older to occupy a lap rather than its own seat during takeoff, landing, and turbulence. Hence the regulations forbidding this. AFAIK no airline performs a check/warning but rather they assume that someone buying (since this is international, so the 10% fare + 100% taxes and government fees would apply unlike free domestic travel for lap kids under age 2) an infant ticket is aware of the age limit.
It's not unusual to hear stories of people buying infant tickets at the last minute and being shocked at the expensive fares that must be used for this, including cases when the adults have award tickets.
It's not unusual to hear stories of people buying infant tickets at the last minute and being shocked at the expensive fares that must be used for this, including cases when the adults have award tickets.
Last edited by WineCountryUA; Sep 23, 2022 at 8:21 am Reason: Stick to the airlines in issue
Sep 23, 2022, 7:26 am
#4
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Since this was ticketed by UA, OP's issue is with UA, so I'm moving this to the United forum.
Adam Smith
AC Forum Moderator
Adam Smith
AC Forum Moderator
Sep 23, 2022, 9:06 am
#6
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A few days before his return, he happened to mention to me that his little one seems to drop off the reservation for the return. He called UA and they told his someone would get back to him and that he shouldn't worry; no one called back and make a long story short, he was told after multiple phone calls that with only one seat left on the flight, he'd better buy the last ticket (in premium) for the child-- or he would find his child, and by extension, himself, stuck without a way back.
but still, it seems to me, that if he purchased a ticket for a certain person with a known-to-airline birthday, and leaves as scheduled on all legs (as opposed to a ticket change which would trigger a different fare for an older age), it seems a bit desingenoius legally, for an airline to collect a fare, create a contract with a traveller, and then simply not allow them to board because of an age change? Surely, they could put on the website when you try to book a notice that says "PASSENGER AGE CHANGE DURING TRAVEL MAKES FARE UNSELLABLE" or such?
Had he known, and purchased (half or full) ticket for that child when he did all the others, he would have paid much less-- and in any case, I think that from a legal standpoint, airline acceptance of payment and no notice (and UA agents on the phone saying he would be fine not to worry) is unfair.
I can sympathize, but I don't see a better option for you.
Sep 23, 2022, 9:42 am
#7
Join Date: Jul 2022
Posts: 41
It's considered unsafe for a kid 2 or older to occupy a lap rather than its own seat during takeoff, landing, and turbulence. Hence the regulations forbidding this. AFAIK no airline performs a check/warning but rather they assume that someone buying (since this is international, so the 10% fare + 100% taxes and government fees would apply unlike free domestic travel for lap kids under age 2) an infant ticket is aware of the age limit.
It's not unusual to hear stories of people buying infant tickets at the last minute and being shocked at the expensive fares that must be used for this, including cases when the adults have award tickets.
It's not unusual to hear stories of people buying infant tickets at the last minute and being shocked at the expensive fares that must be used for this, including cases when the adults have award tickets.
Sep 23, 2022, 9:50 am
#8
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It appears that BA and VA will offer a free seat to the infant if said-infant turns 2 during the trip. Maybe OP's friend heard of such stories from other families traveling. Regardless, it's up to the traveler to understand the airline's rules...
https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/...hildren.html#/
To be fair, it's buried in the page as a caveat...
†† The child’s fare applies only to children under age 12. Youngsters age 12 and up will pay the adult fare. If your infant child’s second birthday occurs between the departure and return segments of an international trip, you have the option to pay:
https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/...hildren.html#/
To be fair, it's buried in the page as a caveat...
†† The child’s fare applies only to children under age 12. Youngsters age 12 and up will pay the adult fare. If your infant child’s second birthday occurs between the departure and return segments of an international trip, you have the option to pay:
- The full published child's fare for that flight (and be certain to have a confirmed seat both ways), or
- The infant fare on the departure, and the published child's fare on the return. Call Air Canada Reservations to book this option.
Sep 23, 2022, 9:50 am
#9
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There's actually no good rationale for allowing lap children on intercontinental flights. On domestic flights, they've actually done cost-benefit analyses. It is undoubtedly safer for a child of any age or size to be seated in an approved restraint than to be held in a parent's arms. However, what they found was that if they required infants to be in seats, some people would drive instead. And since flying is orders of magnitude safer than driving, it made more sense to let parents hold lap children than to have them drive as a way to save money.
Sep 23, 2022, 10:03 am
#10
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In the spirit of keeping it airline related: just look at the old carry on sizers, or the current bag weight limits... its (generally/outside of status allowance) 50... not 51, not 52.
Using age is very objective... its defined. Sure, we can all cite 2 year old kids that are SMALLER than 18month olds, and vice versa.
Sep 23, 2022, 10:34 am
#11
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The separate tickets for age 2+ are mandated by law, so they certainly shouldn't have told him that it would work out. Once the airline realized that the child wasn't eligible to sit on a lap as an infant, there was no chance that they were going to allow him to board without a separate seat.
Sep 23, 2022, 12:13 pm
#12
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It is safest for all babies to be strapped into aircraft-certified car seats. If regulation is going to allow lap-infants, and some say that they shouldn't, there has to be a cutoff somewhere.
The argument in favor of the lap-infant rule is that requiring the purchase of an additional seat will result in more injuries overall because more families will choose to drive which exposes them to a statistically higher accident rate. Not sure how you quantify that to calculate a conclusive measure of which is safer.
Sep 23, 2022, 2:38 pm
#13
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The point is that the traveler disclosed to UA the child’s age (by virtue of giving the dob) and UA decided, after that disclosure, to sell the ticket. So UA technically waived its terms and conditions and therefore should not be falling back on them. It’s akin, in a way, to a mistake fare in that UA didn’t mean to sell the ticket but did so mistakenly. You can argue whether the traveler should have, or might have, known. But the principal blame lies with UA and it should be UA’s responsibility to sort it out at no, or reasonable, cost to the OP.
Sep 23, 2022, 2:52 pm
#14
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The point is that the traveler disclosed to UA the child’s age (by virtue of giving the dob) and UA decided, after that disclosure, to sell the ticket. So UA technically waived its terms and conditions and therefore should not be falling back on them. It’s akin, in a way, to a mistake fare in that UA didn’t mean to sell the ticket but did so mistakenly. You can argue whether the traveler should have, or might have, known. But the principal blame lies with UA and it should be UA’s responsibility to sort it out at no, or reasonable, cost to the OP.
You get airlines involved and suddenly everyone's a lawyer looking for a loophole.
Sep 23, 2022, 2:58 pm
#15
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What is missing in this discussion is an appreciation of how many miles United’s newest MileagePlus member will earn on his last minute one way ticket.