xliioper

I wouldn't put much stock in a comment from an FA. From latest OAG changes on a'net. While it's just one route, it doesn't exactly appear like they are planning on beefing up CLE from this.

UA CLE-LAX NOV 1.8>1.0[1.7] DEC 1.9>1.4[1.8]

xliioper

There is no one clamoring to use those gates. In order for someone else to use them, they would need to let UA out of it's lease (they can't make UA pay for them if someone else is using them). So the best option is to let them sit empty and make UA honor it's lease. For comparison, CVG had a different situation in that they wanted to demolish T2, but the only way they could move the airlines located there to T3 was to let DL out of part of it's T3 lease early. They also wanted to use the space occupied by concourse C, so also decided to let DL out of that lease early so they could demolish it.

https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinna...concourse.html

nomad420

I realize that this is coming from basically all second hand sources but the FA state they are NOW able to work directly out of CLE and now they don't have to travel to a hub (ie. ORD) to start work. This has already begun and supposedly, at least for the UA employees, this is a big deal. Whether or not a bunch more routes will be added is another question.
Your point about the city letting UA out of lease is interesting. My suspicion is UA probably doesn't want out of the lease, they now control all that dead space. While a million plus per month seems like a lot to us I suspect it is chump change when you factor in potential competition that would then move into those gates. Seems a shame but that's business.

lincolnjkc

As mentioned up thread a FA friend mentioned that CLE as seen new hire FAs sent to it after being a stagnant base for quite a while.

Given the "decent" traffic out of CLE and it's close proximity to ORD and EWR I see slow but steady growth, bit also CLE being used as a place to pilot new ideas without the big hub risk. I don't see much direct flying outside the hubs but I suspect they'll continue to be opportunistic about it

E.g. the Gate Innovation project I mentioned in another thread thread-- today had a UA suit supervising the boarding (though one gate display was showing the flight going to Dulles and the other was showing the flight going to LGA -- same time and flight number so clearly some bugs to work out..

lincolnjkc

Of course this is a bit of a game of speculation but the CLE-based FAs/pilots have, with few exceptions, always started/ended trips in Cleveland -- but the bases (maybe FA only) have been 'closed' for years -- meaning no one could transfer in to the base and FAs that transferred out weren't being replaced. There was some speculation among (non-CLE based) FA friends that the company was trying to close the base through attrition to both get rid of the base and avoid having to pay moving costs if they just cut the base and forced FAs to relocate to other bases.

What I'm guessing was the root of what you heard (and this is a bit of speculation on my part) is that now that the base is open again and the pmCO/pmUA FA ranks have been integrated... pmUA FAs -- of which there seem to be quite a few in the CLE area and many commute to ORD specifically -- can now transfer to or pick up trips from the CLE base, skipping the commute.

MrGood

It used to be a major hub during the CO days. It would be great for them to re-hub it for the purposes of better competing with DL and AA in the same market.

Kudos to UA if it plans on doing so!

ctownflyer

Was never a major hub. More like a hublet

nomad420

Thank you, yeah that was about what I understood it too be as well but I am not or never have been a UA employee so I don't know exactly how that works.

lincolnjkc

Hey, we were one of CO's top 3 hubs, thank you very much

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomad420

Thank you, yeah that was about what I understood it too be as well but I am not or never have been a UA employee so I don't know exactly how that works.

The contractual ins and outs are detailed enough that I've venture half of the UA employees don't know exactly how it works -- seriously, try reading the FA contract one of these days, great cure for insomnia. E.g. I'm still not sure what differentiates a "Yellow Flag" day from a "Purple Flag" day but they have different compensation associated with them. The short version is, though, (in most cases) your trip sequence/pairing begins and ends at a base. If you live at the base your trips begin/end at great! If not, you commute to your base. One of my FA friends was based in DEN as a new hire, then moved in with his brother in ORD (also in the industry but now based in NYC and commuting there) and was commuting to DEN from ORD, until he transferred to ORD and yeah.... it gets weird.

JimInOhio

Agree... that's probably what the FA base issue is all about (pm-UA FAs being able to get CLE originating trips).

Separately, a UA agent at RSW told me they are adding CLE-RSW sometime this summer as a trial balloon. If it does well enough, it will go year round. That would support some of this talk about route expansion at CLE.

For it's size, CLE is quite elite-heavy for UA. IMHO, there all kinds of UA customers in and around Cleveland who don't want to fly Spirit, Frontier, etc. and are willing to pay more to avoid them.

FreqFlyerCLE

ctownflyer

FLL and RSW were just added back for next winter as a daily mainline flight.

scracer14

And yet they cut back to very limited quantities of PJs on Polaris APAC flights... A million per month could probably make for some decent in flight improvements on long haul polaris flights, even if it's just a couple extra $10 bottles of wine so they don't run out...

lincolnjkc

UA is on the hook for the debt service payments (and that, unlike Polaris service cutbacks, aren't something they can just choose to do -- without someone assuming the liability for the bond holders they're stuck with it) but my understanding is they actually turned over *control* of the building to the City of Cleveland -- or at least that's what I was told when I enquired with UA management about leasing it for an event -- i was told as of shortly after dehubbing it became that it's the city's building to control and I'd need to talk to "someone" in port control about it -- UA has no say or dog in that flight.

CLE isn't currently gate constrained and while D may be the newest and airiest (but to me it always felt cramped) it is by far the least convenient for O&D pax. Also, one side would need significant reconfiguration to be used with anything other than small RJs and props given the cinderblock "fingers" leading directly to the ramp.