Pilot didn’t show up today at SAV - 24 Dec. 2018
Dec 24, 2018, 8:14 pm
#16
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Silicon wasteland
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I had this on LAX-NRT(!). Third pilot didn't show up, and the captain and purser (or whatever they are called these days) made it clear about their irritation. They didn't know when the replacement pilot could show up (traffic in LA)
I deplaned and went to the GA to get shifted to the soon-departing NH flight, but wouldn't keep my UG J seat to so do, since the flight was not yet in IRROPs(!?)
I talked to a great reservations agent who took 5+ minutes as I was walking toward TBIT who took the time to talk to operations (since they had not yet posted a delay) and communicated to me they had found a pilot and they would be arriving in 30 minutes, so no risk of cancellation. More info than the gate could get.
So, it happens. And UA treats it pretty seriously, especially for a intl flight.
I deplaned and went to the GA to get shifted to the soon-departing NH flight, but wouldn't keep my UG J seat to so do, since the flight was not yet in IRROPs(!?)
I talked to a great reservations agent who took 5+ minutes as I was walking toward TBIT who took the time to talk to operations (since they had not yet posted a delay) and communicated to me they had found a pilot and they would be arriving in 30 minutes, so no risk of cancellation. More info than the gate could get.
So, it happens. And UA treats it pretty seriously, especially for a intl flight.
Dec 24, 2018, 9:43 pm
#17
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: CHS
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This happened several other times I know of, especially when we first started getting mainline planes and it was only like once or twice a week. Now that we have mainline planes daily, it doesn't happen anymore
None of this matters for the OP though as his plane was 99% Mesa from IAH. Mesa should have crews there in hotels from previous flights
Dec 25, 2018, 8:49 am
#18
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BNA
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How long ago was that? It is no longer legal, for the pilots, under 14 CFR 117 which was enacted in 2014.
Dec 25, 2018, 10:04 am
#19
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It doesn't happen any more and it only happened mainline, not UAX (Not sure that matters) but it was when we only got UA on last flight of the day and first flight in the morning and only 1 or 2 times a week
Now we have mainline 2-3 times a day between ORD and EWR in the winter and 5-7 times a day during summer, to include IAH
Dec 25, 2018, 10:34 am
#20
Join Date: Feb 2002
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Hmm, that would be close - if I had to guess I would say 2014 - maybe 2015 - I don't have any records beyond 2016 to look back on - mind you this was IRROPS - typically we got in at 11;30pm and the next flight wasn't until 6am, this just happened to be a delayed flight.
To be legal, you either have to fit the entire trip within that 12-hour flight duty period or you have to have a minimum of a 10-hour layover to break it into two flight duty periods. So, for an 8:00pm departure the night before, you'd have to be scheduled to complete the return no later than 7:00am the following morning. You must be estimated to arrive within those constraints at the beginning of the takeoff roll on each flight which is why you can sometimes taxi out but, after a delay, have to return back to the gate due to crew legalities.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/part-117
Table B is the applicable duty time limits.
Dec 25, 2018, 11:20 am
#21
Join Date: Nov 2012
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The only time that I was supposed to travel and the captain did not show up was on USAirways and he did try to show up. However, when he fainted while going through security was a clear sign that he had a serious health problem that required emergency surgery. Passengers flying Business Class were immediately transferred to LH flights. My wife and I had to wait for a flight the next day to return to the US but we got upgraded in the process. And, the next day, we heard that the surgery went well. We are still glad that it happened at the airport and not mid-air.
Dec 25, 2018, 11:41 am
#22
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: CHS
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A layover must be a minimum of ten hours. Without an intervening 10-hour layover, the pilots would remain on duty all night. The flight duty period limit for an evening report (5pm-9:59pm, with two flight segments) is 12 hours and starts one-hour before schedule departure time.
To be legal, you either have to fit the entire trip within that 12-hour flight duty period or you have to have a minimum of a 10-hour layover to break it into two flight duty periods. So, for an 8:00pm departure the night before, you'd have to be scheduled to complete the return no later than 7:00am the following morning. You must be estimated to arrive within those constraints at the beginning of the takeoff roll on each flight which is why you can sometimes taxi out but, after a delay, have to return back to the gate due to crew legalities.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/part-117
Table B is the applicable duty time limits.
To be legal, you either have to fit the entire trip within that 12-hour flight duty period or you have to have a minimum of a 10-hour layover to break it into two flight duty periods. So, for an 8:00pm departure the night before, you'd have to be scheduled to complete the return no later than 7:00am the following morning. You must be estimated to arrive within those constraints at the beginning of the takeoff roll on each flight which is why you can sometimes taxi out but, after a delay, have to return back to the gate due to crew legalities.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/part-117
Table B is the applicable duty time limits.
The return leaves CHS at 6am and arrive ORD at 7:15 to 7:30ish
So, the entire flight takes roughly 11hrs
Dec 25, 2018, 6:24 pm
#23
Join Date: Feb 2002
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For an 8:00pm departure, the flight duty period would start at 7:00pm. They'd have to be scheduled to block in by no later than 7:00am the next morning. Even at that, there'd be no margin for even a single-minute delay on the departure/taxi-out on the return flight.
Dec 25, 2018, 7:16 pm
#24
Join Date: Sep 2013
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Maybe that is why they don't do it anymore....
Dec 26, 2018, 11:28 am
#25
Join Date: Mar 2011
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I was on an AA flight last year when just before take-off the pilot decided he didn't feel well enough to fly and we returned to the gate. Luckily in DFW they have some standing by.
Dec 26, 2018, 8:31 pm
#26
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The captain flown in from IAD said that the captain who was supposed to fly never even flew in the night before. If this is true, not sure how UA missed the ball on this.
Dec 26, 2018, 8:57 pm
#27
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: CHS
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Was it UA or UAX (Mesa airlines)
I only ask cause this time of year we don't get mainline to IAH and although I am sure you could, I would be surprised if you did.
That said each airlines (even within UAX) manages their own crews and schedules - so even though United's name is on the side of the plane, Mesa or whomever the operator of the flight is DBA as UAX is responsible for scheduling.
Dec 26, 2018, 10:36 pm
#28
Join Date: Jan 2013
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A layover must be a minimum of ten hours. Without an intervening 10-hour layover, the pilots would remain on duty all night. The flight duty period limit for an evening report (5pm-9:59pm, with two flight segments) is 12 hours and starts one-hour before schedule departure time.
To be legal, you either have to fit the entire trip within that 12-hour flight duty period or you have to have a minimum of a 10-hour layover to break it into two flight duty periods. So, for an 8:00pm departure the night before, you'd have to be scheduled to complete the return no later than 7:00am the following morning. You must be estimated to arrive within those constraints at the beginning of the takeoff roll on each flight which is why you can sometimes taxi out but, after a delay, have to return back to the gate due to crew legalities.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/part-117
Table B is the applicable duty time limits.
To be legal, you either have to fit the entire trip within that 12-hour flight duty period or you have to have a minimum of a 10-hour layover to break it into two flight duty periods. So, for an 8:00pm departure the night before, you'd have to be scheduled to complete the return no later than 7:00am the following morning. You must be estimated to arrive within those constraints at the beginning of the takeoff roll on each flight which is why you can sometimes taxi out but, after a delay, have to return back to the gate due to crew legalities.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/part-117
Table B is the applicable duty time limits.
Day 1: EWR 1600 - DTW 1830. 12 hour rest period
Day 2: DTW 0700 - ACY 0930. 12 hour rest period. ACY 2300 - DTW 0130. 5 hour rest period
Day 3: DTW 0700 - ACY 0930. 12 hour rest period. ACY 2300 - DTW 0130. 4 hour rest period
Day 4: DTW 0600 - EWR 0830
IIRC the DTW - ACY flights were either charters or something special. Keep in mind this was either in the late 80s or early 90s, when ACY was worth taking a flight to see.
Dec 26, 2018, 10:56 pm
#29
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: What I write is my opinion alone..don't read into it anything not written.
Posts: 9,686
My father was a CO pilot. Back when he was on the MD-80, he got this trip a few times that he hated. The times are. not exact, but it went something like this
Day 1: EWR 1600 - DTW 1830. 12 hour rest period
Day 2: DTW 0700 - ACY 0930. 12 hour rest period. ACY 2300 - DTW 0130. 5 hour rest period
Day 3: DTW 0700 - ACY 0930. 12 hour rest period. ACY 2300 - DTW 0130. 4 hour rest period
Day 4: DTW 0600 - EWR 0830
IIRC the DTW - ACY flights were either charters or something special. Keep in mind this was either in the late 80s or early 90s, when ACY was worth taking a flight to see.
Last edited by fastair; Dec 26, 2018 at 11:02 pm
Dec 27, 2018, 5:42 am
#30
Original Poster
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Was it UA or UAX (Mesa airlines)
I only ask cause this time of year we don't get mainline to IAH and although I am sure you could, I would be surprised if you did.
That said each airlines (even within UAX) manages their own crews and schedules - so even though United's name is on the side of the plane, Mesa or whomever the operator of the flight is DBA as UAX is responsible for scheduling.
I only ask cause this time of year we don't get mainline to IAH and although I am sure you could, I would be surprised if you did.
That said each airlines (even within UAX) manages their own crews and schedules - so even though United's name is on the side of the plane, Mesa or whomever the operator of the flight is DBA as UAX is responsible for scheduling.