I'm the sucker that paid for my UA "business first" seats
Sep 26, 2012, 3:53 pm
#31
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: BGM/ PHL
Programs: US (Silver, *A Silver), AA, Starbucks (Gold)
Posts: 2,242
US Airways still gets a bad rap sometimes, but the Envoy Suites product between the US and Europe is phenomenal. I'm also a Silver Preferred and see domestic upgrades around 50%-60% of the time (up from 2% as a PMCO Silver)...
Sep 26, 2012, 3:54 pm
#32
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NY, USA
Programs: DL SM Plat, B6 TrueBlue, UA MP, AAdvantage
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Apple is an American product that designs a truly premium product in its category.
Many American fashion designers produce some of the best most-sought after clothes in the world, ranging from Ralph Lauren and Calvin Klein, to Marc Jacobs and Kate Spade.
Some of the most luxurious hotels in the world are owned and operated by American companies.
Top-end American appliances makers are among the best in the world.
Same with top-end American furniture manufacturers.
And, of course, there has been an absolute explosion of high-end American artisans in many product areas, ranging from microbrews, to artisanal cheeses and chocolates.
American wines have been winning awards in the most demanding competition for decades now...
Etc.
Sep 26, 2012, 3:56 pm
#33
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,393
Excellent post. I really dont care about the meals. Just give me some warm nuts and keep my wine / beer glass full while I am awake, give me good IFE (and if there is one thing I love about UA's BF service, it's the staggering array of movies and TV shows, including Caddyshack, Office Space, and a few other cult classics, that are available on IFE for good, brainless entertainment while trapped in the aluminum tube for 8-10 hours), give me a comfy lie-flat seat with enough room for me to work on a laptop for a few hours (including 110v charger), leave a snack cart out, and keep handing me water bottles.
It would be nice to get a smile and at least some semblance of an outward desire to please me, so there UA tends to fall flat, but all the white glove BS isn't necessary. I pay (or, more accurately, my company pays) for good value, and to me, what UA currently offers in lie-flat BF is good value. The food is secondary to me, a legacy of old school flying that is simply no longer a reality in this world. Some airlines serve great food, but I would rather pay less for mediocre food.
Old config 777's do not meet these requirements, with crummy IFE, uncomfortable seats that don't lie flat, and a state of disrepair unbefitting premium TATL or TPAC routes.
It would be nice to get a smile and at least some semblance of an outward desire to please me, so there UA tends to fall flat, but all the white glove BS isn't necessary. I pay (or, more accurately, my company pays) for good value, and to me, what UA currently offers in lie-flat BF is good value. The food is secondary to me, a legacy of old school flying that is simply no longer a reality in this world. Some airlines serve great food, but I would rather pay less for mediocre food.
Old config 777's do not meet these requirements, with crummy IFE, uncomfortable seats that don't lie flat, and a state of disrepair unbefitting premium TATL or TPAC routes.
Sep 26, 2012, 4:18 pm
#34
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I mean it beats a lot of names I can think of...
I don't like surly service, but the fact is that, despite their reputation, foreign carriers have their fair share of surly service, too.
I know many here are very enamored by the obsequious Asian service, but I find it basically annoying.
And plenty of Euro carriers have very hit-and-miss service, with no lack of cold and unhelpful fight attendants.
I'd just as soon deal with a little back-and-forth repartee (even lip) from a U.S.-based flight attendant, even if the service isn't quite as refined and dainty.
Sep 26, 2012, 4:23 pm
#35
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,393
That's bad?
I mean it beats a lot of names I can think of...
I don't like surly service, but the fact is that, despite their reputation, foreign carriers have their fair share of surly service, too.
I know many here are very enamored by the obsequious Asian service, but I find it basically annoying.
And plenty of Euro carriers have very hit-and-miss service, with no lack of cold and unhelpful fight attendants.
I'd just as soon deal with a little back-and-forth repartee (even lip) from a U.S.-based flight attendant, even if the service isn't quite as refined and dainty.
I mean it beats a lot of names I can think of...
I don't like surly service, but the fact is that, despite their reputation, foreign carriers have their fair share of surly service, too.
I know many here are very enamored by the obsequious Asian service, but I find it basically annoying.
And plenty of Euro carriers have very hit-and-miss service, with no lack of cold and unhelpful fight attendants.
I'd just as soon deal with a little back-and-forth repartee (even lip) from a U.S.-based flight attendant, even if the service isn't quite as refined and dainty.
Sep 26, 2012, 4:29 pm
#37
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: LAX
Programs: AA Platinum, DL Platinum, UA Gold, Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, Hyatt Explorist
Posts: 605
I would suggest the OP to fly, LH, LX from LAX, They can also take Air New Zealand from LAX to LHR and onward to pretty much anywhere in Europe.
Being LAX based, US Envoy class is not an ideal situation. The OP still has to fly domestic first class to PHL or CLT, which is about 40% of a trip to Europe. Even if the second half is wonderful in Envoy Class.
Being LAX based, US Envoy class is not an ideal situation. The OP still has to fly domestic first class to PHL or CLT, which is about 40% of a trip to Europe. Even if the second half is wonderful in Envoy Class.
Last edited by iluv2fly; Sep 26, 2012 at 4:40 pm Reason: merge
Sep 26, 2012, 4:38 pm
#38
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SFO South Bay
Programs: UA 2MM
Posts: 3,052
As for whether you are a sucker, I think not so much in this case. I think you were more just unlucky to get the old seats. If you had gotten a new seat, you would have been about as well off as any other airline in C class for TATL.
Of course, for TPAC business class, there are MANY better options and I would never fly UA in C class on my own dime.
And if you have the $$$ for real international F, then you would be INSANE to buy UA. INSANE!!!! LH F is truly fantastic for TATL. Hell, any international F is better by far than UA.
But for TATL C, UA is about as good as any other option I think. Great seat, OK service, terrible food. Averages out to as good as the options.
Of course, for TPAC business class, there are MANY better options and I would never fly UA in C class on my own dime.
And if you have the $$$ for real international F, then you would be INSANE to buy UA. INSANE!!!! LH F is truly fantastic for TATL. Hell, any international F is better by far than UA.
But for TATL C, UA is about as good as any other option I think. Great seat, OK service, terrible food. Averages out to as good as the options.
Sep 26, 2012, 4:41 pm
#39
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: DCA/IAD
Programs: United Premier Gold, AirBerlin Gold, Starwood Gold, Avis Preferred, CBP Global Entry
Posts: 497
It's all about managing expectations. All I really want from UA's C cabin is a bed (though I can sleep in a barcalounger if I need to, but not slanty seats). Preferably in a quiet cabin. I know what airplane food is like in a variety of cabins on a host of carriers, so I don't expect gastronomic bliss. I guess I'm just easier to please, but then I always fly C/F on miles/instruments/CPUs.
That said, it sucks to shell out good money and end up disappointed. Sounds like you might want to consider flying foreign carriers international and crediting to UA for your domestic travel. FWIW, you can also have credit card elite status on UA and the mileage redemption is far better than DL.
That said, it sucks to shell out good money and end up disappointed. Sounds like you might want to consider flying foreign carriers international and crediting to UA for your domestic travel. FWIW, you can also have credit card elite status on UA and the mileage redemption is far better than DL.
Sep 26, 2012, 5:11 pm
#41
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: NYC
Posts: 1,393
Sep 26, 2012, 5:53 pm
#42
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: BGM/ PHL
Programs: US (Silver, *A Silver), AA, Starbucks (Gold)
Posts: 2,242
I disagree, US F has improved over the past few years. Its no United p.s. but for a daytime transcon its certainly an acceptable product.
Sep 26, 2012, 6:18 pm
#43
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 5,825
Since you buy business class, try flying a non-US carrier and see if you like that experience better. (odds are you will.)
I have had very good experiences in Int'l C and F with UA - I certainly would not let one R/T turn you off forever...
Sep 26, 2012, 6:21 pm
#44
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Premium luxury should be what F is about and I don't think US based carriers can deliver in that market. But C should really be where they excel. The ingredients are there: world-class seats (except in the OP's anomalous case) a labor pool of service-oriented workers and a hospitality industry well schooled in dressing mutto up as lamb. However UA seems to employ too many people better suited to the DMV and succeeds in making lamb tougher than mutton (literally on my last flight in C).
Sadly the merger is resulting in the FAs feeling even more aggrieved, and the C food deteriorating from being quite acceptable to becoming totally inedible. How can a reheated greasy and chewy hamburger be considered acceptable in Business class?
Sadly the merger is resulting in the FAs feeling even more aggrieved, and the C food deteriorating from being quite acceptable to becoming totally inedible. How can a reheated greasy and chewy hamburger be considered acceptable in Business class?
Sep 26, 2012, 6:26 pm
#45
Join Date: Jan 2003
Programs: American Airlines Platinum, National Executive
Posts: 3,790
Instead of paying for a business class seat (presumably a business class fare, booked originally as business class), why not either:
(1) Buy a business class seat from a consolidator or
(2) Buy a coach ticket and just pay to upgrade at check-in
Wouldn't those be cheaper ways to get up front?
I've taken only US Airways business class internationally and I thought that the experience was much better than what is described on UA, although my FC flight to Hawaii on UA was very nice.
(1) Buy a business class seat from a consolidator or
(2) Buy a coach ticket and just pay to upgrade at check-in
Wouldn't those be cheaper ways to get up front?
I've taken only US Airways business class internationally and I thought that the experience was much better than what is described on UA, although my FC flight to Hawaii on UA was very nice.