I was kicked out of C many years ago on UA 895 because a full fare customer showed up at the last minute. I don't think we can blame Jeff for something like that (reasonable). PMUA also got me to HKG in C, but via NRT. Late, but ok.

What happened to the OP is outrageous and smells like some of SMI/J's work.

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They owe you the refund per policy. Make sure you cits GG OVS DOWNGRADE so you're on the same page.

They also did not follow the proper protocol, as they should have downgraded an upgrader if there were no volunteers to downgrade.

I don't think an upgrader, who in an oversold situation would surely have cleared weeks before the flight should be downgraded. If the norm is that confirmed upgrades can be routinely rescinded, then this make 1K even more useless than it has become.

Presumably he was downgraded because the other pax in J checked in before he did.

In any case, the problem is that UA/SHARES oversells J cabins.

I agree with the credit card charge back though.

That said, 3 seats in Y, plus $1200 voucher, plus the difference between the business and coach fare seems like a good deal. If UA routinely offered 3 seats in Y and a $1200 voucher for downgrading upgraders that would be cool with me.

This happens. Though usually not from full fare. Are you sure you were on full fare?. You're booking code must be "C" or "J".

Full fare EWR-GRU is more than $3300 IMHO.

I've been downgraded from Z, which is deep discounted business to Y a few times. IAD-DME/IAD. I've also seen a Global Services pax get downgraded on the same route.I should note that carriers do oversell the Business Class cabin, by a few pax.

$1200 is generous. In my case I was offered the difference between Z and full fare Y, which is not much. $300 or so.

This phenomenon is not unique to United. The BRIC markets are high growth sectors, someone I guess offered to pay more for your seat.

As real as anything else other people believe in

I appreciate that you might think $1200 is generous but why not offer others the three seats and $1200 if I don't want it before bumping me involuntarily?

Here are the details. The booking code is "C".

eTicket Number Frequent Flyer Seats
xxxxx 016706342XXXX UA-XXXXXXX Premier 1K / *G ---/6C
FLIGHT INFORMATION
Day, Date Flight Class Departure City and Time Arrival City and Time Aircraft Meal
Wed, 23MAY12 UA31 C NEWARK, NJ
(EWR - LIBERTY) 9:55 PM SAO PAULO, BRAZIL
(GRU) 8:50 AM
Thu, 24MAY12 UA861 C SAO PAULO, BRAZIL
(GRU) 10:20 AM RIO DE JANEIRO, BRAZIL
(GIG) 11:30 AM
FARE INFORMATION
Fare Breakdown
Airfare: 3,198.00 USD
U.S. Federal Transportation Tax: 16.70
September 11th Security Fee: 2.50
Brazil Embarkation Tax: 8.00
U.S. Passenger Facility Charge: 4.50
Per Person Total: 3,229.70
USD
eTicket Total: 3,229.70
USD

Form of Payment:
VISA
Last Four Digits 1414

The airfare you paid on this itinerary totals: 3,198.00 USD
The taxes, fees, and surcharges paid total: 31.70 USD

D might not be "full fare" per your definition but it is still a fare that when bought is strictly for business class. Not "business class if we can accommodate you". And it's certainly a "fuller" fare then Z,P or R

I usually travel on A fares which under your definition is not a "full fare" first ticket either but if anyone tried to downgrade me they would need security to help them. I certainly would not move especially if there were people in F on lower fares. Regardless. It's a SB move by UA and if I were the OP, I would not bother contacting UA for a refund or complaint. I would simply deny the charge on my CC which he can do legally siting the reason: SERVICE BOUGHT WAS NOT PROVIDED

A is discounted First Class. Not full fare. If some sheik/ha showed up to buy the whole F cabin or if an IO + family + maid showed up, you would be bumped.

I've also been downgraded on EK before. Though I think Emirates handled that a little more graciously. UA does this too. Most airlines do (downgrading). In my case: I was offered the option of taking a later flight, but i had to be at my destination that day. So I flew Y.

See notice of "overbooking". You'll find it in your contract of carriage. For hot markets, places where people can and will pay lots of $$$ for a ticket, I recommend showing up at the airport early and boarding early.
As a rule, I do this on : all of the BRICs and certain mid east routes.

I usually like to be last one on the plane, but I know when not do that.

Sometimes when you snooze you lose. I empathize with the OP.

Wow, the tone of the comments here are somewhat off the wall -- gee, let's just use any excuse to beat up on what UA did. :rolleyes:

The fact is this happens on other airlines occasionally. I was on a VS flight a few years ago that was oversold in Upper Class and they were offering something like a $1000 voucher (or refund, can't remember). They asked me at check-in; they weren't making announcements. I declined. I don't know whether they found a volunteer or had to involuntarily downgrade the last person to check in.

The fact is the compensation was pretty generous. OP got a flat bed, which may have actually been better than what was offered in BusinessFirst (assuming they're still using the recliner 767s on this route). He got a $1200 voucher for his personal use. A fare differential refund would likely have gone back to his company. It's arguable whether that differential is also warranted, since technically he got 3 last-minute Y seats which would have cost way more than 1 last-minute J seat. On the downside, he missed a "fancy" meal -- big whoop.

And I have a really hard time believing those who claim that if the situation was reversed they'd be okay with forgoing their upgrade for someone who paid more for the seat. Just doesn't jibe with other commentary on here, notably the FC buy-up program.

There's enough negativity on here regarding UA, some of it probably well-justified. This isn't, IMHO.

I find it mind boggling that you defend UA here.

- Three Y seats is not "a flat bed"
- It's ludicrous that they downgrade a paid C fare before any upgraders. I guess it's another case of COdbaUA "allowing people who don't normally get to sit in C/F to sit there" in these IDB cases
- He basically got no special treatment in coach

The negativity is incredibly well justified in this case.

Maybe because they didn't follow their own policy.

They were supposed to solicit for downgrades, then downgrade in reverse upgrade order (upgraders first) if there were no volunteers.


3 Y seats together is considered a "flat bed?" Ridiculous.

He also didn't buy 3 x Y seats. He bought 1 x BF seat seat, which was not provided. Blocking 2 extra Y seats was a nice courtesy, but it's by no means comparable.


I don't think people would be happy with it, but that is the policy.


If UA follows through with a prompt refund of the fare difference (which he is due per the downgrade policy), and then throws in a goodwill gesture for not properly following policy and making him chase down the refund, then UA will have done okay.

Anything less is a failure on UA's part, mainly because they didn't follow their own procedures.

Complaining about the color of the walls in the lavatory or that the napkins in FC are now 200 thread count Egyptian cotton vs. 400 would be far closer to using "...any excuse to beat up on what UA did..."

Just because "this happens on other airlines occasionally", has exactly what to do with the OP's situation? Adding a dated anecdote about a situation on another airline which you vaguely remember the details of, and where you weren't even downgraded adds exactly this much to the conversation----> 0

No, it (his compensation) wasn't "pretty generous". If I buy (not upgrade into), but buy a BC ticket, I expect to sit in BC. If I am involuntarily downgraded prior to anyone who was upgraded into BC, I would be near apoplectic...how exactly is it even correct to sell a ticket into that class and then make the seat unavailable? It is patently deceptive to sell a ticket in BC, when that seat isn't available.

OP got a flat bed? I'm not a vehement United basher...please refrain from being an obsequious United apologist...

As for the fare differential, a $1200 voucher would be an appetizer to the additional compensation that I would expect from United. My expected compensation would be the fare differential from what OP paid ($3K) and the lowest available economy fare on the day on which he purchased the ticket (not full fare Y, because if he knew that he was going to get stuck in steerage it is doubtful that he/me/anyone would pay the Y price for that "privelege").

I would have to say that the OP's situation and the accompanying posts critical of UA's handling of the situation are absolutely justified.

OP would have made a great Lowly 2P
 

Probably not, but it's less stressful acting as if it were. The OP would have made a wonderful lowly 2P.

There's really nothing at all wrong with considering how your actions might affect others. It's an option many choose. The opposite involves keeping score, making sure you get your fair share, or more if possible. Accept no losses without a fight because you don't know how long it might be before your next win, or because there's no reason anyone else is more worthy than you.

If it works out properly, with the OP getting a refund between the price he paid and the lowest-available Y fare at the time, plus the $1200 travel voucher... and he did, if I'm reading this correctly, get a row of 3 seats to himself... that's pretty reasonable.

Does seem odd that they didn't offer him the choice of whatever leftover meal there might have been from C though. But maybe they were doing him a favor. :D

"A" is a first class fare just as D is a business class fare. I agree if the cabin was oversold someone needs to be bumped BUT, THAT SOMEONE NEEDS TO COME FROM A LOWER FARE CATAGORY. YOU DON'T BUMP A PAASENGER W A "D" FARE IF THERE WERE OTHERS IN LOWER FARE CAT. Knowing UA, There were plenty of upgrades and even Z or P fares to choose from. YOU DON'T BUMP SOMEONE THAT PAID MORE THEN HALF THE OTHERS. I said I travel usually on an A class tkt. that's a FIRST CLASS FARE! If my flight was oversold the ONLY way I would move I'd if everyone else was holding a tkt with F As the fare base. I have NEVER seen EK over book 1st be even 1 seat. They constantly over book C which in some markets, they should not do as they always end up in trouble, but F, I'VE NEVER SEEN IT. I keep a good look usually of the availability on my flights (how many avail/how many sold, etc and in well over 750 flights from short to long to ultra long haul in the last 12 years on EK I HAVE NEVER seen F oversold. (if you look at any flights availability the MOST F seats you'll see for sale are 8 instead of 9 in other classes since most EK flights only havev8 seats in F

I was downgraded from C to Y at the gate on SFO-ICN in December. They told me I was the only upgrader. So UA's policy was definitely to downgrade upgraders first. Is CO's policy to downgrade in order of check-in time? That's as dumb as prioritizing meal choice by row number -- oh wait, CO does that too.

OTOH, maybe this is how I kept my upgrade on UA901 last week when the same flight had been cancelled the day before. I'm sure there were many more displaced paid C pax than there were upgraders.