Wow, they're sure selling a lot of upgrades
Mar 12, 2012, 7:51 am
#691
Original Member, Ambassador: External Miles and Points Resources
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Digital Nomad Wandering the Earth - Currently in VIENNA, AUSTRIA
Posts: 58,725
Fundamentally, btw, I believe the single biggest issue isn't whether we get upgrades or not, it is how DECEPTIVE the new UA management is. I have no problem with them selling upgrades and doing other shenanigans. But what I do have a problem with is their marketing of CPUs when every process is designed to actually circumvent them having to give CPUs.
One thing I personally think of....if they are willing to lie to us like this to make $49 ow buyups instead of giving the upgrades to us, then think about what else they might be lying about to save money or boost revenue. That thought should send a serious shiver down your spine.
My personal experience is that organizations that are run with a lack of integrity and long-term vision are dead-men walking. They might be making money today, but they won't be making money for long. The wake-up call is approaching for UA, and it won't be pretty. But all this won't happen until Jeff has "retired" with his huge pay package. Then the next CEO will be left to find a way out of the hole that Jeff is digging at record speed right now.
At this point in time, I would rather give my business to DL before I spend another dollar on UA. And I hate the Skymiles program, so that is saying something...
One thing I personally think of....if they are willing to lie to us like this to make $49 ow buyups instead of giving the upgrades to us, then think about what else they might be lying about to save money or boost revenue. That thought should send a serious shiver down your spine.
My personal experience is that organizations that are run with a lack of integrity and long-term vision are dead-men walking. They might be making money today, but they won't be making money for long. The wake-up call is approaching for UA, and it won't be pretty. But all this won't happen until Jeff has "retired" with his huge pay package. Then the next CEO will be left to find a way out of the hole that Jeff is digging at record speed right now.
At this point in time, I would rather give my business to DL before I spend another dollar on UA. And I hate the Skymiles program, so that is saying something...
And in either case, the airline is NOT being honest and forthcoming about it.
And that's a terrible response to it either way.
Last edited by kokonutz; Mar 12, 2012 at 7:57 am
Mar 12, 2012, 8:01 am
#692
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: DEN
Programs: Recovering after 7 years of UA 1K, Still UA Silver (Which means nothing), Marriott Lifetime Plat Pre
Posts: 1,950
Last night DEN-BOS, was offered buy-up for $89 at check in, KVS showed "R" space, but I was not waitlisted or upgraded. Just before boarding the mobile app showed that the F cabin was booked to 18 of 24. They started processing upgrades after the plane boarded, and we were delayed as they moved people from coach to F. But I am thankfully they moved people, I got moved.
The GA stated that they can't just process upgrades anymore, and that upgrades no longer happen automatically, she said its a manual process and take about 5 minutes per person to process.
The GA stated that they can't just process upgrades anymore, and that upgrades no longer happen automatically, she said its a manual process and take about 5 minutes per person to process.
Mar 12, 2012, 8:37 am
#693
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: TX
Programs: UA mm, Marriott PLT, Hilton Dia
Posts: 580
Another data point...flew EWR-IAH on Thursday morning. 26 out of 35 seats sold 3 hours before the flight. I was #9 on list. Total list about 50 elites. By the time of boarding, 35 of 35 seats sold, and I was still #9of about 50 elites.
Rhetorical question: What are the odds that everyone that checked in within the last 3 hours of the flight was 1k or GS or Plat on a higher fare than I, while the total list would remain about the same?
I'm thinking really low odds...especially on the Thursday before Spring Break when more travel than usual is not business related.
Thank goodness I only have one more week of this misery and another week in May. Then, I will be done for good with UA.
Rhetorical question: What are the odds that everyone that checked in within the last 3 hours of the flight was 1k or GS or Plat on a higher fare than I, while the total list would remain about the same?
I'm thinking really low odds...especially on the Thursday before Spring Break when more travel than usual is not business related.
Thank goodness I only have one more week of this misery and another week in May. Then, I will be done for good with UA.
To your rhetorical question, they could also be anyone buying first or Y/B/M or those on an upgrade instrument waitlist that UDU cleared in a sweep.
Flying hub-to-hub on a Thursday afternoon on a non-refundable ticket has found me as low as 28 on the upgrade list as a top tier elite. If you have choices, then exercise them.
Also, do you think that the GA was a PMUA employee new to the shares system that needs additional training and experience? Your statement is a little confusing to me when you say that the GA can't process upgrades, but it takes them 5 minutes to process the upgrade. Also, upgrades to happen automatically until the responsibility passes to the GA.
Good news - you got the upgrade, which according to UA policy should have been assured if they were offering TOD upgrades.
Last edited by iluv2fly; Mar 12, 2012 at 9:09 am Reason: merge
Mar 12, 2012, 9:17 am
#694
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: DEN
Programs: Recovering after 7 years of UA 1K, Still UA Silver (Which means nothing), Marriott Lifetime Plat Pre
Posts: 1,950
You were not on the upgrade waitlist after you checked in? Then, how did you get upgraded? You cannot see yourself on the waitlist prior to check-in.
Also, do you think that the GA was a PMUA employee new to the shares system that needs additional training and experience? Your statement is a little confusing to me when you say that the GA can't process upgrades, but it takes them 5 minutes to process the upgrade. Also, upgrades to happen automatically until the responsibility passes to the GA.
Good news - you got the upgrade, which according to UA policy should have been assured if they were offering TOD upgrades.
Also, do you think that the GA was a PMUA employee new to the shares system that needs additional training and experience? Your statement is a little confusing to me when you say that the GA can't process upgrades, but it takes them 5 minutes to process the upgrade. Also, upgrades to happen automatically until the responsibility passes to the GA.
Good news - you got the upgrade, which according to UA policy should have been assured if they were offering TOD upgrades.
This was a PMUA gate agent. What she said was that the old UA system would automatically process upgrades when space was available, so people would get upgraded before gate control. She said the new 30 year old system they are using now requires someone to manually upgrade people, so upgrades don't get processed before the gate except during sweep times. She said upgrading people now involves a lot more steps and work than before.
I still don't believe the policy was followed as a fellow passenger of mine, who I fly with regularly, was not upgraded on this flight. He is also a 1K. We chatted when we met up afterwords. He was on a lower fare class than I was. He got the same ToD offer at checkin, turned it down, and flew in Y. So the ToD does not assure an upgrade. Needless to say there were 50+ people on the upgrade list, and I saw several 1Ks board with me, who didn't get upgraded.
Mar 12, 2012, 9:23 am
#695
Join Date: May 2005
Location: various cities in the USofA: NYC, BWI, IAH, ORD, CVG, NYC
Programs: Former UA 1K, National Exec. Elite
Posts: 5,485
Mar 12, 2012, 9:32 am
#696
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Houston
Programs: UA Plat, Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,710
Another data point...flew EWR-IAH on Thursday morning. 26 out of 35 seats sold 3 hours before the flight. I was #9 on list. Total list about 50 elites. By the time of boarding, 35 of 35 seats sold, and I was still #9of about 50 elites.
Rhetorical question: What are the odds that everyone that checked in within the last 3 hours of the flight was 1k or GS or Plat on a higher fare than I, while the total list would remain about the same?
I'm thinking really low odds...especially on the Thursday before Spring Break when more travel than usual is not business related.
Thank goodness I only have one more week of this misery and another week in May. Then, I will be done for good with UA.
Rhetorical question: What are the odds that everyone that checked in within the last 3 hours of the flight was 1k or GS or Plat on a higher fare than I, while the total list would remain about the same?
I'm thinking really low odds...especially on the Thursday before Spring Break when more travel than usual is not business related.
Thank goodness I only have one more week of this misery and another week in May. Then, I will be done for good with UA.
It may have been the weekend before spring break, but Thursday is a big biz travel day.
Mar 12, 2012, 9:43 am
#697
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: EWR
Programs: UA Gold, UA MM, Marriott Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 1,329
I have no idea, that's why I put the question mark in. My point was its hard to draw any conclusions using IAH-EWR as an example. There are hundreds of posts in the old CO forum detailing what a hard upgrade it is. Sure it happens but as rule you can expect it not to clear far far more often then having it clear.
Mar 12, 2012, 9:48 am
#698
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA Gold-MM, AA Gold-MM, F9-Silver, Hyatt Something, Marriott Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 6,404
Last night DEN-BOS, was offered buy-up for $89 at check in, KVS showed "R" space, but I was not waitlisted or upgraded. Just before boarding the mobile app showed that the F cabin was booked to 18 of 24. They started processing upgrades after the plane boarded, and we were delayed as they moved people from coach to F. But I am thankfully they moved people, I got moved.
The GA stated that they can't just process upgrades anymore, and that upgrades no longer happen automatically, she said its a manual process and take about 5 minutes per person to process.
The GA stated that they can't just process upgrades anymore, and that upgrades no longer happen automatically, she said its a manual process and take about 5 minutes per person to process.
And yes, just about everything in SHARES is a manual process. And it definitely takes forever. Often measured in hours.
Mar 12, 2012, 9:57 am
#699
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ORD / DUB / LHR
Programs: UA 1K MM; BA Silver; Marriott Plat
Posts: 8,243
Funny, certain guys here on FT love to assure us that if your CO number is on the rez, you're in the UG queue. How much evidence those Globesters need to admit the system DOES NOT WORK???
And yes, just about everything in SHARES is a manual process. And it definitely takes forever. Often measured in hours.
And yes, just about everything in SHARES is a manual process. And it definitely takes forever. Often measured in hours.
Fact: An automated process runs, starting ~6 days prior to each flight, to process CPUs. If your OP number is on the reservation, barring some unusual issue on the reservation, you're in the upgrade queue.
Fact: No manual intervention is required to make this process run
Fact: Once passengers check in starting at T-24, they will go onto an airport-controlled upgrade standby list (the one you can view on the mobile site). The automated system continues to run until around 3 hours prior to departure.
Fact: About 30-45 minutes prior to departure, the GA can clear people in order of their position on the list into any open seats in F. This process can and does continue after boarding if there are no-shows in F. There is no way on earth that this process takes 5 minutes per passenger - more like 5-10 seconds to process a batch of passengers.
Now there may well be issues with some reservations that are extending the time taken to process upgrades but that's related to a significant merger that just took place don't confuse that with an actual process that will govern the process going forward (as it did in the past).
Mar 12, 2012, 10:02 am
#700
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: UA Gold-MM, AA Gold-MM, F9-Silver, Hyatt Something, Marriott Gold, IHG Plat, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 6,404
Now, in light of overwhelming evidence, we're told, 'er, well, maybe something could muck up the process'.
Mar 12, 2012, 10:08 am
#701
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: DEN
Programs: Recovering after 7 years of UA 1K, Still UA Silver (Which means nothing), Marriott Lifetime Plat Pre
Posts: 1,950
Seriously? The misinformation around here gets worse and worse. Here is how the actual process works:
Fact: An automated process runs, starting ~6 days prior to each flight, to process CPUs. If your OP number is on the reservation, barring some unusual issue on the reservation, you're in the upgrade queue.
Fact: No manual intervention is required to make this process run
Fact: Once passengers check in starting at T-24, they will go onto an airport-controlled upgrade standby list (the one you can view on the mobile site). The automated system continues to run until around 3 hours prior to departure.
Fact: About 30-45 minutes prior to departure, the GA can clear people in order of their position on the list into any open seats in F. This process can and does continue after boarding if there are no-shows in F. There is no way on earth that this process takes 5 minutes per passenger - more like 5-10 seconds to process a batch of passengers.
Now there may well be issues with some reservations that are extending the time taken to process upgrades but that's related to a significant merger that just took place don't confuse that with an actual process that will govern the process going forward (as it did in the past).
Fact: An automated process runs, starting ~6 days prior to each flight, to process CPUs. If your OP number is on the reservation, barring some unusual issue on the reservation, you're in the upgrade queue.
Fact: No manual intervention is required to make this process run
Fact: Once passengers check in starting at T-24, they will go onto an airport-controlled upgrade standby list (the one you can view on the mobile site). The automated system continues to run until around 3 hours prior to departure.
Fact: About 30-45 minutes prior to departure, the GA can clear people in order of their position on the list into any open seats in F. This process can and does continue after boarding if there are no-shows in F. There is no way on earth that this process takes 5 minutes per passenger - more like 5-10 seconds to process a batch of passengers.
Now there may well be issues with some reservations that are extending the time taken to process upgrades but that's related to a significant merger that just took place don't confuse that with an actual process that will govern the process going forward (as it did in the past).
Mar 12, 2012, 10:09 am
#702
Join Date: May 2011
Programs: UA GS, UA 2MM, HH LT Diamond, Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 1,820
DEN-MCI-A319 - T-96 R4/RN4 and I didn't clear. T-72, 48 & 24 R3/RN3 and I'm #1 on waitlist. T-12 I drop a place to #2 and it now shows R2/RN2. Mobile app shows 6 booked and 6 checked in so I'm pretty sure I'm getting the upgrade as its an elite light route. By the time I get to the gate F is full and I'm still #2 and the person who was #1 is still there too. I'm guess ToD sales to GM as my option to buy up was $259 one way on a ticket that originally cost $254. I just can't see many elite flyers taking that type of cost increase for a flight less than 1.5hrs.
Mar 12, 2012, 10:10 am
#703
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: ORD / DUB / LHR
Programs: UA 1K MM; BA Silver; Marriott Plat
Posts: 8,243
I am curious about the source of your facts. I have had multiple UA employees tell me information that is contradictory to these facts, and I tend to believe them as they are working in SHARES daily, and have gone through training where they learned what they have shared.
Mar 12, 2012, 10:16 am
#704
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: TX
Programs: UA mm, Marriott PLT, Hilton Dia
Posts: 580
Mar 12, 2012, 10:22 am
#705
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: The World.
Programs: UA MP/UC - "RIP Tulip Plat"
Posts: 1,225