Got it from ATA both directions!
Apr 11, 2008 | 3:21 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5
Got it from ATA both directions!
Here is one crazy story. If I didn't see it happen I would think it a little wild.
Sunday March 30. our party of 6 departs PHX on ATA for OGG-Maui.
Along with our luggage we brought one box of Alcohol. Box had previously been used to ship wine back to the mainland. Still had individual shipping styrofoam inside, and so we were using it to keep separated the following....
4 750ml bottle Johnny Walker Black
2 750ml bottle Wild Turkey Rare Breed
3 750ml bottle Absolut Grapefruit Vodka
1 bottle triple distilled Smirnoff Black label 100 proof
1 bottle of Zaya Rum
11 bottles in a 12 bottle styro box...inside a cardboard shipping box.
At the ticket counter our box was accepted. No issues. A Baggage Claim tagged was attached to it.
At the Gate, we were told they wouldn't accept the box, there was an issue with the quantity of high proof alcohol packaged in the same container. It was considered a possible explosion hazard....(Never heard of anything like that before!!)
After much discussion about separation of the box into our individual suitcases, the decision was made to just pick the box up on our return, Saturday April 5th. The box had a complete home address on it, along with cell and home numbers.
On our return (finally) on April 10th, due to the bankruptcy, at the airport our box was no where to be found.
Found the original gate agent who thankfully works also for another airline, to help to locate the box. Unable to locate.
Upon return home, we had 2 voicemail messages.
The first one was from April 3rd, at approx 11am Arizona Time, by an ATA employee, telling us we needed to come pick up our alcohol that day!! And that if we can't get there, we need to send a friend.
Mind you we aren't scheduled to return until April 5th....
(asked a friend w/o knowledge of the phone calls, to pickup our box for us...as he is a mechanic with usair...said no go, they aren't allowed to leave with anything!!)
Next voicemail message April 3rd, at approx 1pm Arizona Time, SAME AGENT! 2 hrs later ...."we had to DESTROY it."
over $400 of alcohol!!! "DESTROYED"
they couldn't have had TSA care for it? The main airport office?
Thoughts? Ideas? Recourse?
Sunday March 30. our party of 6 departs PHX on ATA for OGG-Maui.
Along with our luggage we brought one box of Alcohol. Box had previously been used to ship wine back to the mainland. Still had individual shipping styrofoam inside, and so we were using it to keep separated the following....
4 750ml bottle Johnny Walker Black
2 750ml bottle Wild Turkey Rare Breed
3 750ml bottle Absolut Grapefruit Vodka
1 bottle triple distilled Smirnoff Black label 100 proof
1 bottle of Zaya Rum
11 bottles in a 12 bottle styro box...inside a cardboard shipping box.
At the ticket counter our box was accepted. No issues. A Baggage Claim tagged was attached to it.
At the Gate, we were told they wouldn't accept the box, there was an issue with the quantity of high proof alcohol packaged in the same container. It was considered a possible explosion hazard....(Never heard of anything like that before!!)
After much discussion about separation of the box into our individual suitcases, the decision was made to just pick the box up on our return, Saturday April 5th. The box had a complete home address on it, along with cell and home numbers.
On our return (finally) on April 10th, due to the bankruptcy, at the airport our box was no where to be found.
Found the original gate agent who thankfully works also for another airline, to help to locate the box. Unable to locate.
Upon return home, we had 2 voicemail messages.
The first one was from April 3rd, at approx 11am Arizona Time, by an ATA employee, telling us we needed to come pick up our alcohol that day!! And that if we can't get there, we need to send a friend.
Mind you we aren't scheduled to return until April 5th....
(asked a friend w/o knowledge of the phone calls, to pickup our box for us...as he is a mechanic with usair...said no go, they aren't allowed to leave with anything!!)
Next voicemail message April 3rd, at approx 1pm Arizona Time, SAME AGENT! 2 hrs later ...."we had to DESTROY it."
over $400 of alcohol!!! "DESTROYED"
they couldn't have had TSA care for it? The main airport office?
Thoughts? Ideas? Recourse?
Last edited by leahjewell; Apr 11, 2008 at 3:52 pm
Apr 11, 2008 | 3:45 pm
#3
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ohio
Programs: HHonors Diamond, SPG Platinum, Marriott Gold, United 1K
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It wasn't just the passengers who got sc***ed by ATA - I sure hope those poor employees at least had a nice goodbye party thanks to the OP! 
Seriously, it sounds like a sad and highly weird case. Sorry for your loss and I hope you were able to hit up a "packie" in Hawaii!
Seriously, it sounds like a sad and highly weird case. Sorry for your loss and I hope you were able to hit up a "packie" in Hawaii!
Apr 11, 2008 | 4:42 pm
#5
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: DEN
Programs: Back to UA, missing DL; Marriott Gold
Posts: 12,253
The lesson here is that you should never leave your property with an airline while you go on a trip. Even for an airline that doesn't become insolvent while you're away, the number of staff members and the busy nature of airport operations does not lend itself to storing things for pax. And this is not their job anyway; they are only responsible for transporting the luggage that goes with you. Next time call a friend who can pick it up from you before departure, or mail it, or do anything but hand it over to the airline!
Apr 11, 2008 | 5:20 pm
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5
The lesson here is that you should never leave your property with an airline while you go on a trip. Even for an airline that doesn't become insolvent while you're away, the number of staff members and the busy nature of airport operations does not lend itself to storing things for pax. And this is not their job anyway; they are only responsible for transporting the luggage that goes with you. Next time call a friend who can pick it up from you before departure, or mail it, or do anything but hand it over to the airline!
and we were told it was going to be kept under lock and key due to its valuable content
oh yeah, and we expected them to do "their job" and transport the luggage we brought with us. does anyone have anything TSA related that says you can't ship alcohol in checked baggage beyond a certain quantity? Shouldn't TSA be held partly responsible? It was there decision to pull the box off of the flight. We flew the flight we were expecting the alcohol to be transported on, we aren't on any terrorist watch list or any such thing. It was at best a HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS and COMPLETELY ARBITRARY decision to pull the box and not transport it with the passenger
Last edited by leahjewell; Apr 11, 2008 at 5:25 pm
Apr 11, 2008 | 5:24 pm
#8
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: ?
Posts: 7,544
(Thanks! I'll be here all week...)edit: OK, I did read that wrong, you did check it. But since they (rightly or wrongly) decided they couldn't transport it, was it still considered baggage?
Apr 11, 2008 | 5:42 pm
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5
if anyone can find anything that indicates how much alcohol can be transported in checked baggage i would be most appreciative.
i did notice that ATA has indicated a lack of responsibility for pilferage of baggage...
it's a sad commentary on things when we accept as acceptable the act of pilferage and then don't have the courage to call it what it is....THEFT!
i did notice that ATA has indicated a lack of responsibility for pilferage of baggage...
it's a sad commentary on things when we accept as acceptable the act of pilferage and then don't have the courage to call it what it is....THEFT!
Apr 11, 2008 | 5:51 pm
#10
Moderator: Hawaii-based airlines & Hawai'i forums
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The industry standard appears to be five liters per person. Several airline sites I've scanned seem to futher restrict this to no more than five liters in a single luggage item - http://www.tsa.gov/travelers/airtrav...rial_1189.shtm
Apr 11, 2008 | 6:01 pm
#11
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: North America
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Posts: 6,559
if anyone can find anything that indicates how much alcohol can be transported in checked baggage i would be most appreciative.
i did notice that ATA has indicated a lack of responsibility for pilferage of baggage...
it's a sad commentary on things when we accept as acceptable the act of pilferage and then don't have the courage to call it what it is....THEFT!
i did notice that ATA has indicated a lack of responsibility for pilferage of baggage...
it's a sad commentary on things when we accept as acceptable the act of pilferage and then don't have the courage to call it what it is....THEFT!
Code:
Alcoholic beverages
Alcoholic beverages placed in checked baggage must adhere to the following
size restrictions and package guidelines.
For all alcoholic beverages:
* When placed in checked baggage, glass bottles must be in a
Styrofoam-type insert that is molded to the shape of the bottle
and completely encloses the bottle
* Customs regulations outside the U.S. may have additional alcohol
transport restrictions
Proofs of alcohol vary. The guidelines for the varied proofs of alcohol
are as followed:
Alcoholic beverages – less than 24 percent by volume (48 proof)
* Includes most beer and wine
* No limit on amount that can be accepted
Alcoholic beverages – 24 to 70 percent by volume (48 - 140 proof)
* Covers most alcoholic beverages
* Limited to 5 liters (1.3 gallons) per passenger
Alcoholic beverages more than 70 percent by volume (140 proof) are
not permitted onboard the aircraft.
Apr 11, 2008 | 6:03 pm
#12
Join Date: Jun 2005
Programs: AS MVPG
Posts: 2,281
Unfortunately alcohol is flammable, so airlines and government regulations limit the amount allowed on board. It's not a TSA thing, this link has a little more information http://www.iata.org/whatwedo/cargo/dangerous_goods/
It's a little complicated, so just trust them if they say you can't bring that much
Also, it seems like ATA didn't really have any option but to destroy it, since they closed up shop.
It's a little complicated, so just trust them if they say you can't bring that much
Also, it seems like ATA didn't really have any option but to destroy it, since they closed up shop.
Apr 11, 2008 | 6:13 pm
#14
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Posts: 36,111
Apr 11, 2008 | 10:55 pm
#15
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 5
Here is United's Policy
Code:
Alcoholic beverages
Alcoholic beverages placed in checked baggage must adhere to the following
size restrictions and package guidelines.
For all alcoholic beverages:
* When placed in checked baggage, glass bottles must be in a
Styrofoam-type insert that is molded to the shape of the bottle
and completely encloses the bottle
* Customs regulations outside the U.S. may have additional alcohol
transport restrictions
Proofs of alcohol vary. The guidelines for the varied proofs of alcohol
are as followed:
Alcoholic beverages less than 24 percent by volume (48 proof)
* Includes most beer and wine
* No limit on amount that can be accepted
Alcoholic beverages 24 to 70 percent by volume (48 - 140 proof)
* Covers most alcoholic beverages
* Limited to 5 liters (1.3 gallons) per passenger
Alcoholic beverages more than 70 percent by volume (140 proof) are
not permitted onboard the aircraft.
All of the above references were what I had already found. None of it would seem to restrict my (our, as in all 5 of us) ability to take 11 bottles of alcohol.
As for the theft comment, that was generic on my part, you will notice there was no accusation of theft, simply the acknowledgment that we (society) call it pilferage rather than theft when someone takes something that isn't their's.
Personally at this point, I think (imho) that I have a much stronger case for destruction of private property rather than theft, as they accepted the box, agreed to keep it until I returned and therefore accepted what is known in the legal system as CARE, CUSTODY and CONTROL.
What they did was inappropriate. My only real question is, what is my best recourse?