florin

Intra-EU flights can not be considered domestic because it's going from one country to another, but most importantly - there's lounge access.

Ryan Air the standard? - that's a pretty typical European sarcastic yet pessimistic remark. I for one respectfully disagree. I've had good flights with good service. Just last week on AF I had excellent service and decent food (by plane food standards, of course).

I don't look down on people who travel less, but I do admit - it is kinda funny when a guy at a party goes on about how much he travels and it turns out he racked up about 15,000 miles in the past 2 years!

mjcewl1284

I don't really roll my eyes at these so-called travellers but I usually counter with my experiences. When people hear that I do a DTW-NRT/KIX run each month, they usually have nothing else further to say.

tjl

They have probably seen the news stories and heard secondhand stories about how much of a hassle flying is -- huge lines at checkin and security, strange security check rules, flight delays, being stranded overnight after missing a connection, etc..

Being essentially newbie flyers, the chances are high that they will make newbie mistakes like booking a tight connection at ORD so that they will misconnect and spend the night at the airport, packing too much baggage that needs to be checked so that it can be lost, stolen, or delayed, not doing on-line or kiosk checkin and getting stuck in a slow moving checkin line resulting in missing the checkin deadline and being denied checkin, etc..

You probably need to handhold them every step of the way, from choosing flights to minimize trouble, to baggage packing tips, to reminding them to do on-line checkin, etc. if you do not want to hear endless stories of air travel disasters from people who missed your wedding because of such disasters.

Flaflyer

It all has to do with the frame of reference. If you did not know airplanes existed, driving everywhere would be the norm. But once you learn your 3 day drive can be replaced by a 3 hour flight, driving seems less fun. Things are never the same once you learn that an alternative exists.

I hear folks complan about that looong five hour flight from the east coast to LAX and that horrriiiiible 3 time zone jet lag once you get there. I used to think so too, until the first time I made the 22 hour trip to Asia and learned what 12 time zones will jet lag you too. Lucky for us, you can't do more than 12 no matter if you fly east or west.

Now when I hear the "LAX jet lag whine" I have a hard time telling them this 5 hour flight is my local commuter flight, I'm going to LAX to catch another plane and fly for 18 more hours. If they have never done it, the blank stare they give you is priceless. It also makes me more tolerant of truly minor details. A bad seat or a RJ or gasp the FT FF worst nightmare No Upgrade for an hour or two is tolerable, as long as I know I have a good seat waiting for the 12 hours to Tokyo.

PTravel

I'd agree with you . . . but. . .

Recently, I've had to go back and forth between SFO and LAX on the weekends quite a bit. For a while, I was flying. The drill was this:

- leave my car at my office in Santa Monica
- take a taxi (usually nasty) to LAX (30-45 minutes)
- Get through security, grab a bite and have a few in the RCC (2 hours)
- Flight delayed -- some more drinks in the RCC (1 hour)
- Fly to SFO (1 hour)
- Get picked up and drive to house in SF (30-45 mintues)

Total time: 5 to 5-1/2 hours.
Total cost (round trip): About $450, including airfare, meals, drinks, taxis and car service.

Then I bought a new car in LA and started driving. Now the drill is this:

- Leave the office when I want
- Drive to SF (I usually take the 101, because it's more scenic than the 5)

Total time: 6 to 6-1/2 hours
Total cost (round trip): About $150, including gas and snacks

I also find that I enjoy the drive -- I listen to music, relax, watch the scenery and don't have to deal with TSA, grubby RCCs, rude FA's, flight delays, etc.

I know planes exist and, obviously, wouldn't drive cross-country or trans-oceanic (that would be a good trick). However, I find a drive in a nice car with comfortable seats and a good sound system preferable to the hassle of a 21st century airport.

nako

As someone who has not set foot outside of the US for about a year (and someone who has not set foot outside of North America for about four), I find the question asked here to be asinine, bordering on insulting. That, perhaps, is just me.

Mike

Flaflyer

But at least you have set foot elsewhere.

Travel, domestic or international, hopefully educates and broadens the enlightenment of the traveler. International travel informs us how the rest of the world is different yet still exists.

A person who has never seen another country would have a hard time crafting a good foreign policy for his country, due to a limited frame of reference, don't you think?

Name someone who never visited a foreign country until AFTER he became President of the United States? That would be current President George Bush.

WHBM

Interesting how this is reversed for travellers in Britain.

The infrequent, inexperienced flyer will make maybe one trip a year or less down to the Mediterranean on holiday, or even over to Florida. But domestic flights are pretty much the province of well-travelled business users, even on the low-fare carriers (look at all those suits in an Easyjet weekday flight).

RustyC

I'm probably a bit of an oddity here, maintaining gold-level status on 100% leisure travel that has to be very cost-conscious, and redeeming almost totally for free trips. The earning is usually on domestic trips and the redeeming usually on longer international trips.

I think it's fair to say that travel to other parts of the U.S. is much less exotic than it used to be. Wal-Marts and chains are everywhere and you have to hunt for good local restaurants. Shopping is so homogenized that anything distinctive from a place can be ordered online, and someone's tiki motel just got bulldozed for a Holiday Inn Express. The banjo-playing old cuss or other repositories of folklore are passing away and the kids would rather play the video games. "The Simpsons" made fun of this in an episode where Homer said, "I want to watch TV in a different time zone! (& some other stuff)." Even the old thrills like going to Nevada because it was the only place with casinos are obviously gone. Thankfully, scenery and natural attractions can still deliver, even if some are really overvisited at times.

Nonetheless, I think there are a lot of people who'll limit their travel horizons to the U.S. The RV business pretty much banks on them, and many who think of traveling a lot more in retirement think of the U.S.

I think the more useful divide, though, is between terrestrial travelers and air travelers. All the flying-for-miles has ruined me on the idea of longer car trips like the family vacations of many years ago. Seems that every time I have to do a trip somewhere of 200 miles or more on one of the interstates it's irritating and dangerous because of high truck volumes, speeders and weavers, people who don't keep the right following distance or otherwise drive unsafely. I probably notice it more because I do it much less frequently. But it's no wonder that the U.S. had about 1,000 more traffic deaths than usual for the period in the 3 months after 9/11.

bhd87

:-:

nako

Aside from being completely off-topic (this is TravelBuzz!, not OMNI), it's patently false.

http://quest.cjonline.com/stories/12...16007443.shtml

Mike

SkiAdcock

To your question - one of the few. And as noted, outside one's home culture is not limited to international travel.

I'm still a bit confused as to why substantial travel to - what's posted as some decent domestic destinations - is not considered 'travel'.

I have a number of friends who rarely travel internationally, but travel quite a bit in the US & think nothing of getting on a plane just to visit people or sightsee in some place they've not been. They're pretty up there in terms of airline status & mileage accrual, so why would they not be considered to have traveled 'much'?

The other part I'm trying to sort out is why you feel condescending towards a domestic traveler rather than enjoying the fact that someone else likes to travel & is excited about it. That enjoyment certainly beats all the moaning & groaning we hear frequently on FT from 'those who travel much'.

Cheers.

KosraeTV

Trust me, I know how you feel. Most of trips require crossing the dateline, and most folks (except on FT ) can't relate to that one. You gotta love leaving at 3 pm and arriving the same day at 3 AM, or leaving on one day arriving tomorrow even if they are only 8 hour flight. (HNL - KSA) Plays heck with hotel bookings till you get used to it.

But I'd still rather do that then fly the little commuter flights.

jmpeace501

Wow. You must be a very important and prestigious person! How silly of those lowly peons to consider going to another city/state for business or leisure "travel" if it's just within the United States.

(thats me rolling my eyes at your asinine, belittling and pompous comments).

jmpeace501

Well said!!! ^