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Do you "do as the Romans do?"

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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:02 pm
  #61  
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Originally Posted by You want to go where?
I have done a quick review of what appears on the web regarding the requirements of Sweden on permanent residency status (and citizenship as well), and indeed, they do not require Swedish language skills as a requirement. That said, I am now curious. Are these people that you know primarily the spouses/significant others of Swedes or did they simply decide to move to Sweden? The government websites sugggest that while you can get permanent residency through employment, it is not easy to get employment approval because Swedes and EU/EEA citizens are in front of you in line (so to speak). Also, I would assume that most employers would want you to speak Swedish (although I know that there are some careers where this is unnecessary).
Of the individuals whom I know, they don't "primarily" fall into any one category; I know people who have spouses/S.O.s and who do not. I also know many Canadians and Americans (amongst others) working in Sweden who didn't speak any Swedish (more than the likes of "hamburger" and "apple" and "hi") when they moved to Sweden for employment and are not spouses/SOs of Swedish nationals. (And I'm not talking just about exec. relocation here either. ) Few of their employers made an issue about Swedish. Some of the people I know in Sweden now speak it ... but that was years after getting residency and even citizenship in some cases.

By the way, Sweden is not the only case in Europe either. Then again, I'm not here to get everyone's research done for them either. Glad to see some take their own initiative.

Some others had doubt that any European country accepted immigrants who didn't speak the official language(s) unless they were rich or famous. Clearly there are some European countries that do accept immigrants who don't speak the official language(s) and are not rich or famous. Unless goal-posts are moved, such doubts were a shot on goal, an own-goal shot.

"In Rome, do as Romans" includes jumping to incorrect conclusions about "local" conditions and accepting local and/or foreign stereotypes? I would hope not.

When in Rome, I do as I deem fit.

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 20, 2006 at 12:13 pm
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:11 pm
  #62  
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What country in Europe would be the easiest for a US citizen to get citizenship in and how?
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:14 pm
  #63  
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Originally Posted by drbond
What country in Europe would be the easiest for a US citizen to get citizenship in and how?
The same answer you got for Canada is the same answer I give you for Europe: it depends on the circumstances.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:18 pm
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
Some others had doubt that any European country accepted immigrants who didn't speak the official language(s) unless they were rich or famous. Clearly there are some European countries that do accept immigrants who don't speak the official language(s) and are not rich or famous. Unless goal-posts are moved, such doubts were a shot on goal, an own-goal shot.
Sorry, I was considering this a discussion, not a competition, or debating tournament. I have moved past the original point-counterpoint that started this. I really am interested in people and how they achieve migration to countries other than the one they were born/raised in. I know plenty about the U. S., its policies on immigration, and how people become green card holders. I am interested in how other people manage to move to "Rome", or in this case, Sweden.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:24 pm
  #65  
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
The same answer you got for Canada is the same answer I give you for Europe: it depends on the circumstances.
US Citizen looking to relocate to the EU zone. Set financially so will not be working or expecting to unless required.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:41 pm
  #66  
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Originally Posted by drbond
US Citizen looking to relocate to the EU zone. Set financially so will not be working or expecting to unless required.
There are several ways to go about this.

See if you have a parent or grandparent or spouse who is, was or could acquire citizenship of one of the EU countries. Italy seems to have worked well for a good number of people I know this way.

Look at at investing in some of the EU countries as a vehcile to get residency and later citizenship.

Find an employer willing to sponsor you.

... and then there are the less routine officially-sanctioned methods and also some more questionable ones that are not officially-sanctioned but do "work".
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 12:44 pm
  #67  
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Originally Posted by You want to go where?
I am interested in how other people manage to move to "Rome", or in this case, Sweden.
For "Rome", see my prior post responding to drbond.

Let's just say a lot of Argentines discovered who could become an Italian citizen a couple of years ago. A bit of the same for Spanish citizenship too. Getting Swedish residency or even citizenship has not necessarily meant "in Stockholm, do as the Swedes".

Do you want to expand the discussion of "immgration" to things like the UK's "indefinite leave to remain/enter" and "settled status"?

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 20, 2006 at 12:54 pm
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 1:13 pm
  #68  
 
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Originally Posted by drbond
US Citizen looking to relocate to the EU zone. Set financially so will not be working or expecting to unless required.
Why do you want citizenship of another country when you could just live there as an immigrant? Don't you have any sort of preferences beyond "somewhere in the EU and not in the US"?
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 1:21 pm
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Originally Posted by GUWonder

Do you want to expand the discussion of "immgration" to things like the UK's "indefinite leave to remain/enter" and "settled status"?
Let me google those terms first and find out more about them. We've dragged this thread pretty far away from the OPs original intent.

I find the whole subject of immigration, what moves people to migrate (especially beyond the most basic reasons of survival or economics), what countries do to either enable or bar immigration, and how people manage that bureaucracy fascinating.

In some sense, it ties in to the travel bug, but at the extreme end.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 1:34 pm
  #70  
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Originally Posted by You want to go where?
Let me google those terms first and find out more about them. We've dragged this thread pretty far away from the OPs original intent.

I find the whole subject of immigration, what moves people to migrate (especially beyond the most basic reasons of survival or economics), what countries do to either enable or bar immigration, and how people manage that bureaucracy fascinating.

In some sense, it ties in to the travel bug, but at the extreme end.
From who has the most visa stamps to who has the most passports.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 2:42 pm
  #71  
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Originally Posted by janeway
Agree. I wonder if there are any other developed countries in the world that accept immigrants who don't speak the "official" language? I doubt that any European countries would (unless said immigrant has mucho dinero or celebrity status).
Please forgive me for wondering. I wasn't aware that wondering whether something is/is not true was equivalent to claiming that something is/is not true.
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Old Oct 20, 2006 | 2:45 pm
  #72  
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Originally Posted by janeway
Please forgive me for wondering. I wasn't aware that wondering whether something is/is not true was equivalent to claiming that something is/is not true.
"I doubt that any European countries would (unless said immigrant has mucho dinero or celebrity status)." Sounds like a bit less than wondering. In any event, it's clear that such doubt applied to European countries writ large is misplaced, for some and then some certainly do accept immigrants who don't speak the "official" language and don't have mucho dinero or celebrity status.

Bolding added for emphasis:

Originally Posted by janeway
I wonder if there are any other developed countries in the world that accept immigrants who don't speak the "official" language? I doubt that any European countries would (unless said immigrant has mucho dinero or celebrity status).
Originally Posted by GUWonder
I don't share your doubt.

Of countries in Europe that weren't in the Soviet sphere, most accept immigrants who don't speak the official language(s). And most such persons accepted as immigrants are neither rich nor holders of "celebrity status".
I'm afraid you are mistaken. I know of at least two countries (France and the Netherlands) that require would-be immigrants to speak the native "official" language prior to acceptance as citizens.
I was afraid I was not mistaken; and I wasn't.

Also, a person who couldn't speak French was made a citizen of France earlier this year too. Unless a miracle happened, she wouldn't be speaking French today either. Perhaps not the norm, but it happens.

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 20, 2006 at 3:13 pm
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