Agreed that this is a country of individuals, and people are free to give their own money to whomever they wish.

One comment: gratuity creep (to coin a phrase) has a negative effect on those of us with the standard waiters and bartenders 15%policy. Tipping everyone in sight ruins it for the rest of us.

Also, it may have the effect of demeaning the value of work for wages -- a significant problem in certain parts of the US.

Well put!

And if any aggressive tip-mongering is encountered at a restaurant, hotel, or other business, a complaint to the management is the duty of the traveler.

The stories about aggressive tip-seekers at hotels reminded me of a very pleasant surprise I experienced at a hotel in Hawaii. My wife and I checked in for our honeymoon, and the woman at the registration desk walked us to our room and then proceeded to show us every little gadget and switch in the room. She explained everything so cheerfully and in such detail, I was sure she was after a tip. So imagine my surprise when I held a tip out toward her as she was leaving the room, and she refused! She simply smiled and said, "It's my pleasure!"

Later on, we were surprised with free champagne and free desserts delivered to our room. It was a wonderful hotel, with people who gave great service simply because they wanted their guests to be happy.

It was the Kahala Mandarin Oriental in Oahu.

[edited for spelling]

[This message has been edited by KGruendel (edited 09-12-2002).]

As a veteran of the hotel industry, allow me to add some insite. Without making any comments about what I think about tipping in general, it is part of the American travel culture. No one is forcing you to tip, but I think we all know that you will get better service if you do. (Whether this is right or wrong is up to you decide, I will decline comment).
To clear up some misconceptions:

1) Not all hotel bellhops pool their tips, in fact most do NOT.

2) It is common to tip only the person who delivers your bag, but it is nice to tip both people.

3) $1 or $2/bag is a minimum tip (especially for a nice hotel).

4) IMHO, If you can afford a $400 dinner, you can afford to give the guy in the bathroom a buck or two. He works in the BATHROOM for goodness sakes!!!! Give him a break. If you don't have small bills, get change from the bar.

Please keep in mind that bellhops, valets, waiters, bartenders, bathroom attendants, etc. make very little (if any) base wage. Tips are their livelihood.
For more information on tipping in hotels please see my thread:

http://www.flyertalk.com/travel/fttr...ML/007472.html

Feel free to ask any questions.

Edited because I posted the wrong link.

[This message has been edited by g_leyser (edited 09-12-2002).]

Thanks g_leyser you expressed my opinions on the matter concisely.
It you dont feel like tipping, just don't.
The little jars at the pizza place are there because some people do feel like leaving a small something, if nobody did the jars would diappear real quick.

Why should you feel guilty if you don't want to leave a few quarters, even when I order Chinese take-out I will give the girl who hands it to me a buck. It makes me feel good, so what?

And it not only a US thing its done else-where too, all be it more subtley, the restrooms near the Piazza Cisterna in San Gimignamo have have little old ladies with a coin jar they wave in front of you when you exit and at the Certosa di Pavia, the monks approach you shaking a little box for a "voluntary" donation.
A lot more irritating is the attempt by some waiters in some European countries who lie to (American)tourists and tell them service is not included, when it is. Which do you prefer being expected to leave a discretionary amount or being blatantly ripped off??

Mike



[This message has been edited by MIKESILV (edited 09-12-2002).]

As Fastflyer has said, while the US Federal minimum wage is $5.15 per hour, habitually tipped employees may be paid as little as $2.13 hourly if the tips are >= double the difference. However, in Canada min. wage is a Provincial matter C$5 to C$8(BC) per hour & ALL TIPPED EMPLOYEES GET >= FULL MIMIMUM WAGE.
What I hate is that esp. in bars, if you give 'only 15%' you can be called a cheapskate because many bartenders are spoiled by customers (esp. of the opposite sex ) who tip >=$1 a beer!

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Play the travel game 3 vacations into the future!

I generally agree with g_leyser and Mikesilv's comments. However, my pet peeve is restroom attendants. They really make me uncomfortable. I don't like someone standing over me while I'm washing my hands or combing my hair. I would really prefer the "service" didn't exist and find it intrusive. I sometimes tip just because I feel badly for the person. Recently, I've tended not as a matter of principle.

I have pretty low self esteem and always tip big. It makes me feel like "the man".

I tip well for true service.

The tip jars at coffee stands, bagel counters, etc. bug me because of what it says to me about our culture and what it's becoming. To me it's no different than begging on a street corner with a cup. There is absolutely no service involved and yet those jars say give me money for nothing. By and large they're on the counters of places staffed by young people who I get the idea think they somehow deserve extra money simply because they did their basic job. Does pride no longer exist? To me it shows a decline in the work ethic and general laziness. I would be embarrassed to work at a counter and have a tip charge at the register. I would boycott every place that had one of these, but I'm afraid I'd have no place left to go.

I lived in the US for some time and never got used to that tipping thing.

Why am I supposed to pay any additional money for service ? Isn't service part of an hotel or a restaurant's business ?

Is it because the waiters do not get a decent wage ? Aren't the hotels & restaurants supposed to pay for their employees' work ?

This thing makes no sense whatsoever to me, and you may call me a "cheap steak".

Tres bonnes questions, Yann!
Doctors & shoe salesmen don't get tipped for their services. I would prefer a system with an honest menu price (European model comes close) including service & sales tax/ taxe de valeur ajoutee.
The whole point of having a job is to not have to beg nor rely on charity/generosity of strangers!

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Play the travel game 3 vacations into the future!

So how did you crack the block?

As far as tipping mechanics goes, it doesn't happen often, and is a welcome gesture. I used to work in a small garage (3 bays). Among other responsibilities, I was a glorified service manager--I wrote up most of the work orders and handled most of the incoming customers. Not infrequently, you'd have a not-regular customer come in, who must have his car fixed by the end of the day. Problem is, we're already busy, and can't promise anything.

Maybe once a year someone would offer a tip for the mechanic (usually at least $20) if he could get the car fixed that day. It almost always worked. I was surprised how few people thought of this.

A question for the Europeans (do not mean to lump all of you in one category, but would be interested in the standards in different countries):

When the service is included in the bill (ie, added to the total), and you feel the service was really bad, do you just pay it or do you ask for a reduction? I would probably do the former and be a bit steamed about it.

One other question: when the credit card slip has no line for service/tip, can one assume that it has been included? This came up often on a recent trip to Italy and I was a bit unsure. A few times, after really excellent service, I left a tip in cash on the table.

Boo Boo Too,

American tip-craziness probably has a lot of different roots. The whole American Dream is the idea that every one of us can make money and elevate themselves, no matter how humble or lowly their current position. I think underlying that, then, is the idea that workers have a "right" to put out a jar, as uncomely as it may seem.

We also have a very different social welfare system all around from the UK and most of Europe. Our minimum wage is well below the poverty level, and the "safety net" has a lot more holes in it than in the UK. And wealth disparity, the gap between the rich and the poor, is quite high in the US.

I'm NOT making a political statement or advocating any position. I'm simply pointing out that non-apparent circumstances can sometimes dictate differences of behavior in seemingly familiar situations. This is true, of course, whenever travelling to any foreign country.

I, too, find it rude when hotel employees in particular dig for tips. Maybe, though, it is a uniquely American trait to be cold hearted and just treat this like any business transaction. But then, I'll always remember how hard it was for me to make ends meet when I was waiting tables and carrying luggage, and how challenging it really was to provide consistently good service. I enjoyed the challenge, but realized that if I had a bad day at work (distracted by something personal, under the weather) I could lose 50% of my income for the day. So usually, I just dig in and hand over a tip.

Here's one thing I do: I go to a bank and get some $2 bills and $1 gold coins. The uniqueness of this tender inflates their value. If I tip a with a two, the look on the recipient's face is often similar to if I had just handed over a fiver.

Meanwhile, if you're interested in learning more about wage and welfare issues in the US, http://www.epinet.org/ is one place to start, though they have a generally liberal agenda. And, of course, those on the right have some very different opinions at http://www.epionline.org/.

that's a mighty big stretch ...here at least, coffee bars and the like are an implied "service industry" and the employees there are paid fairly poorly ...not min wage at every place but low just the same. so the tip jars, to me are not a sad comment on what our culture is becoming. It's more a reflection that most of the low paying jobs that immigrants, young people etc can get are in a service industry where you are waiting on people. in our culture, for as long as I can remember, it's implied that if you wait on people then you deserve a tip.

edited for typing and incredibly poor grammar

[This message has been edited by squeakr (edited 09-14-2002).]