Pet Peeve - Lap Babies
Mar 30, 2012, 2:02 pm
#16
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Plenty of people couldn't afford a separate airline seat for their kid and would have to drive instead if it were required (I know many people who, once their kids are old enough to require their own seat, wind up choosing to drive instead for trips of 500-1000 miles). So requiring such a thing would move a lot of kids from their parents lap on an airplane into a car seat in a car, which is definitely a less safe place to be.
I don't think it's the extra fare that makes people with older kids travel by car. Heck, my husband and I are 59 and 73, respectively, and WE travel a lot more by car because flights are such an endurance contest.
I made it very clear that I was under no delusion that I owned that extra space. It disappeared, however, because someone else got a seat she did not pay for just by having a meltdown.
Mar 30, 2012, 2:08 pm
#17
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Mar 30, 2012, 2:37 pm
#18
Join Date: Nov 2011
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A lap belt secures the baby in case of turbulence, but does nothing for the extreme inconvenience to the parent in economy. A few years back I was flying on a last minute business trip which landed me in the very last row. A young woman sat next to me with a several-month-old baby. She and her baby were perfectly behaved the entire flight. However, she could not hold the baby in her lap and have her tray table down at the same time. No room. When the FA's brought drinks and snacks, the lady managed to juggle the baby over to her aisle-arm and hold it beside her while she ate. Then in order to clean up and re-situate herself, she asked me to hold her baby for her. (I didn't mind. I'm not a fan, but this one was a real treasure.) It was either that or put the baby on the floor. I couldn't help but feel sorry for the mom. It was discomfort++. (And then the pilot has the nerve to announce over the PA, "I hope you enjoyed your flight with us..." 
)
)Seems like if you are a parent with an infant under the age of 6 months, you are just SOL.
People don't like it if you put the babe in an appropriate safety device and they don't like it if you put the babe on a lap.
Mar 30, 2012, 2:49 pm
#19
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Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
That, and a purse can be stowed while a baby cannot and should not. I can assure the OP that even people who cannot afford to buy a separate seat for their infant would not want to stow their baby. IMHO, baby vs purse is a bad argument.
Mar 30, 2012, 2:59 pm
#20
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,731
Because the people who lobby against changes to the lap baby rules suggest that if you don't allow the lap baby, you are "forcing" people with less money to take a more dangerous mode of transportation.
Not relevant to the discussion at all. I know.
Mar 30, 2012, 3:31 pm
#21
Join Date: Jun 2007
Programs: CO Plat
Posts: 379
I don't understand this attitude at all. Everyone trades safety for money all the time, for themselves and for their kids. It's impossible not to. Some people might decide to drive their kids in a Camry rather than a big SUV, they're saving money but it's not as safe in an accident. Other people get a job which requires them to commute by car, which is less safe than if they were unemployed and stayed at home all day. Whatever. You trade safety for money all the time, in fact you trade safety for all sorts of things. The only real question is which tradeoffs are worth it and which are not.
Mar 30, 2012, 9:19 pm
#22
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: BOS-TLV
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It's definitely safer for kids to have their own seat, but the unfortunate fact is that most people have to trade off safety for money sometimes. Plenty of people couldn't afford a separate airline seat for their kid and would have to drive instead if it were required (I know many people who, once their kids are old enough to require their own seat, wind up choosing to drive instead for trips of 500-1000 miles). So requiring such a thing would move a lot of kids from their parents lap on an airplane into a carseat in a car, which is definitely a less safe place to be.
http://cheezburger.com/3862052608
I don't really care who can afford what, That might make me sound like some sanctimonious rich person, which couldn't be further from the truth. I have two small kids (4 and turning 2 soon), so I am in the same boat as other families, and I still don't empathize with their plight.
Mar 31, 2012, 12:46 am
#23
Join Date: Jun 2007
Programs: CO Plat
Posts: 379
My only comment to that is:
http://cheezburger.com/3862052608
I don't really care who can afford what, That might make me sound like some sanctimonious rich person, which couldn't be further from the truth. I have two small kids (4 and turning 2 soon), so I am in the same boat as other families, and I still don't empathize with their plight.
http://cheezburger.com/3862052608
I don't really care who can afford what, That might make me sound like some sanctimonious rich person, which couldn't be further from the truth. I have two small kids (4 and turning 2 soon), so I am in the same boat as other families, and I still don't empathize with their plight.
Mar 31, 2012, 2:32 am
#25
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like a ps flight ..... i would definitely pay extra for a kid free flight (under 10ish???????)
Mar 31, 2012, 9:08 am
#26
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,508
I agree with the OP. Makes no sense the govt makes you put a baby in a car seat while in a car but allows you to hold the baby on a plane.
I flew with baby in lap once. 4.5 hours each way. First and last time I did that. Bought a seat every time after that. Money well spent.
I flew with baby in lap once. 4.5 hours each way. First and last time I did that. Bought a seat every time after that. Money well spent.
Mar 31, 2012, 9:39 am
#27
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Interesting factoid: Most parents do not use car seats correctly.
Not relevant to the discussion at all. I know.
Not relevant to the discussion at all. I know.
Mar 31, 2012, 9:41 am
#28
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Posts: 22,778
I agree with the OP. Makes no sense the govt makes you put a baby in a car seat while in a car but allows you to hold the baby on a plane.
I flew with baby in lap once. 4.5 hours each way. First and last time I did that. Bought a seat every time after that. Money well spent.
I flew with baby in lap once. 4.5 hours each way. First and last time I did that. Bought a seat every time after that. Money well spent.
Mar 31, 2012, 9:48 am
#29
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Posts: 22,778
I have had people tell me they will pay extra to travel on flights without people of certain ethnicity or looks. That's not likely to happen.
Mar 31, 2012, 10:33 am
#30
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Cars and airplanes make for very bad comparisons. Babies in cars, plenty of well known and well documented risks. Thus plenty of regulations.
In a commercial plane however, how many children were killed in the last 30 years that would have been saved if they had been in a carseat or had their own seat? Good luck finding that one in the NTSB statistics or accident reports. Besides, I am not really sure of how much difference a lapbelt or an own seat belt is going to make.
Just using common sense, what is the probability off being in a crash? What is the probability of the crash being survivable in the first place? (70g deceleration will kill you, regardless of what your seat looks like!) What is the probability that the plane will not explode or burn after the crash?
My own daughter has never been in a car without a baby seat, yet has never been in a plane (commercial or private) in a baby seat.
In a commercial plane however, how many children were killed in the last 30 years that would have been saved if they had been in a carseat or had their own seat? Good luck finding that one in the NTSB statistics or accident reports. Besides, I am not really sure of how much difference a lapbelt or an own seat belt is going to make.
Just using common sense, what is the probability off being in a crash? What is the probability of the crash being survivable in the first place? (70g deceleration will kill you, regardless of what your seat looks like!) What is the probability that the plane will not explode or burn after the crash?
My own daughter has never been in a car without a baby seat, yet has never been in a plane (commercial or private) in a baby seat.