Chargeback rejected

Old Jun 20, 20, 8:20 am
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
Chargeback rejected

Fyi, in the last week, Thai rejected my chargeback saying they're already going to refund but within the 180 days. It's already been nearly 100 but heyho. We shall see what happens I guess.
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 20, 20, 9:48 am
  #2  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: RNO, NV, USA.
Programs: UA 1K 2MM
Posts: 4,212
Originally Posted by Dan1113 View Post
Fyi, in the last week, Thai rejected my chargeback saying they're already going to refund but within the 180 days. It's already been nearly 100 but heyho. We shall see what happens I guess.
Could you clarify further? What did your credit card company have to say about this? It is my understanding that TG does not plan under the bankruptcy code, to offer cash refunds. (I have a similar chargeback pending with American Express.)
restlessinRNO is offline  
Old Jun 20, 20, 10:57 am
  #3  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
I was offered a cash refund back in March. They are going to reply again and try again effectively. But that restarts the 45-50 day MasterCard time period!
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 20, 20, 2:35 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Programs: SK*G, FB-G
Posts: 57
I did a chargeback in early april and got the money back 1-2 weeks later, no problem whatsoever
miles_collector is offline  
Old Jun 20, 20, 3:44 pm
  #5  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
You'd have thought them saying "yes, we did offer a refund, but 180 days is what we can do" wouldn't fly but... :/
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 21, 20, 3:29 pm
  #6  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 3,991
sorry?
"yes, we did offer a refund, but 180 days is what we can do"
Your card-issueing bank sided with Thai Airways here?
warakorn is offline  
Old Jun 21, 20, 3:34 pm
  #7  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DCA
Programs: UA US CO AA DL FL
Posts: 46,941
OP - Would you please provide the full set of facts here. When did TG cancel and when did you make your chargeback request to your card issuer? What was the card issuer's response. What led you to a chargeback in the first place?
Often1 is online now  
Old Jun 21, 20, 4:05 pm
  #8  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 3,991
I also wonder about the full story.
What will the card-issueing bank do once the 180-day period has passed?
Will they say:
A -> "Sorry, it's too late to attempt another chargeback." LIKELY!
B -> Or will they say: "Ok, we will approve the chargeback" UNLIKELY!
warakorn is offline  
Old Jun 22, 20, 3:44 am
  #9  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
So:

On 17 March, Thai cancelled my flights and I phoned and was granted a refund. Obviously it has not come through yet.

Just about 50 days ago, I filed a chargeback, with Revolut, which goes via MasterCard, showing proof of the cancellation granted refund (which Thai sent to me by email).

I spoke to Revolut to get an update since we got to their/MC deadline past 45 days and the money was still not back in my account, and they informed me that Thai rejected the chargeback on the basis that they have granted the refund but that it will take 180 days. Thai responded in the last few days before the deadline.

Revolut/MasterCard is not siding with me as a result, HOWEVER, they have said that they will respond today (Monday) by saying that the answer is not good enough, because if they accept it, we lose the case and yet the refund may not appear and then the case cannot be revived again. This means that from today, they will have another 50 days to respond (Revolut apparently considers 50 days rather than MC's 45.)

So now it is a waiting game again, and I won't have another update until 11 August.

(180 day mark from 17 March is 13 September 2020, though their email saying they actually processed the refund came in mid-April, so if they are counting 180 days from then, that's mid-October.)
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 22, 20, 6:54 am
  #10  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: PVG, FRA, SEA, HEL
Programs: UA Premier Gold
Posts: 3,991
and they informed me that Thai rejected the chargeback on the basis that they have granted the refund but that it will take 180 days. Thai responded in the last few days before the deadline.
Translation: Thai represented the charge.

This means that from today, they will have another 50 days to respond (Revolut apparently considers 50 days rather than MC's 45.)
Translation: A representment chargeback in the cards.

Did Revolut ask you to provide more documents? It is advisable to turn in more documents or a clearer explanation why the representment chargeback should be granted.

by saying that the answer is not good enough, because if they accept it, we lose the case and yet the refund may not appear and then the case cannot be revived again.
This was a good reaction from your bank. If your bank is not filing the representment chargeback in time, the case gets closed - and the representment charge will stick, meaning Thai will keep the money.
Again - do not expect a cash refund, freely given out by Thai, after the 180-day period.
This is just a scam attempt (done by other airlines, as well) to trick the passenger into thinking "ok, I will get my money eventually", but the more time passes, the more likely it is that the passenger will forget about that claim. That would result in a win for Thai.
warakorn is offline  
Old Jun 22, 20, 7:21 am
  #11  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
Revolut did not ask me for anything else, just that they were going to respond to say 180 days was not good enough. I am not sure what else I could present them with other than the fact that they granted the refund after cancelling the flights. Since then I have contacted them once or twice only to get the same sort of default email with the 180 day refund notice.

If Thai rejects it again, can we do this one more time? 50 days at this point won't take us to the 180 day mark, but another 50 after that would, so at least then Revolut would be able to see if they actually refunded within the 180 day period or not.

Again - do not expect a cash refund, freely given out by Thai, after the 180-day period.
Do you think they have no intentions of actually processing this refund, wether during the 180 day window or not?
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 22, 20, 7:26 am
  #12  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BKK
Programs: SK EBG for Life (*G), BA Gold, HH DIA, IC Platinum Ambassador, Hertz President's Circle, Sixt Plat
Posts: 1,106
If you asked Thai for a refund and they said they will grant it, then you CC chargeback is unlikely to succeed, regardless of the timeline. TG is unable to make cash disbursements while undergoing the restructuring under bankruptcy law.
SKT-DK is offline  
Old Jun 22, 20, 7:49 am
  #13  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,403
Originally Posted by SKT-DK View Post
If you asked Thai for a refund and they said they will grant it, then you CC chargeback is unlikely to succeed, regardless of the timeline. TG is unable to make cash disbursements while undergoing the restructuring under bankruptcy law.
Thus far, my experience is that credit card companies are considering 15 days as a reasonable timeframe for refunds, and after 15 days, they are happy to proceed with the chargeback if a refund has not come within that 15-day window.

I will be able to know over the next week or two if that is indeed the case as the expiration window for two other chargebacks are coming up soon. Both said yes to the refund but with no actual refund in sight after several months.
Dan1113 is offline  
Old Jun 23, 20, 8:57 pm
  #14  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hong Kong
Programs: FB AF Silver, BA Gold
Posts: 12,323
Originally Posted by Dan1113 View Post
Thus far, my experience is that credit card companies are considering 15 days as a reasonable timeframe for refunds, and after 15 days, they are happy to proceed with the chargeback if a refund has not come within that 15-day window.

I will be able to know over the next week or two if that is indeed the case as the expiration window for two other chargebacks are coming up soon. Both said yes to the refund but with no actual refund in sight after several months.
Many credit cards seem to be currently rejecting chargeback if the airline replies that it will provide refund (whatever the timing).
But it seems to depend on the bank, the country, the itinerary and how insistent you are.
brunos is offline  
Old Jun 28, 20, 10:11 am
  #15  
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Seat 2A
Programs: AA EXP LT GLD 1MM, BA GLD, NH/UA*G, Hyatt Dia, Marr Tit LT GLD, IHG Spire,HH Dia, MGM NOIR,Hertz PC
Posts: 9,654
The result of a chargeback depends on the quality of your bank which issued the CC. I had three successful ones with Amex USA while DKB which issues my Lufthansa Mastercard was totally useless.
chris63 likes this.
skywalkerLAX is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Search Engine: