I also questioned in the private forum whether the Like button is indeed feasible and how high would be the time and resource requirements to do this. Furthermore, I questioned how easy it would be for the developers to make the Like button available for only one forum or indeed, for only some FT members if we were to recommend that only people meeting some post/time on FT requirement be able to use the Like button, of course only when logged into FT.

Many people seem to be concerned about IB's ease of implementation. I agree with this concern. TalkBoard should not ask for the Moon on the basis that maybe it will work and maybe it won't. Otherwise we lose our influence for crucial upgrades.

Accordingly, I need to find out exactly what IB can do with their existing software and what would need new coding. I pledge to do that and incorporate my findings and TalkBoard member preferences before any call for a vote.

I wanted to start with a sky is the limit discussion so as not to bias our thinking toward what IB already has. I think that has been accomplished. At this point I think it's OK to peek at what vBulletin can do for us and let that inform our preferences.


As to pushing a proposal, I have stated my objective: to find the best consensus proposal. If the best does not turn out to have 6 supporters, so be it. I have made no effort to count votes for drafts because I know I haven't yet addressed all concerns. I'm not even sure all the concerns have been mentioned yet. This process seems slow because it is slow. I want to measure many times before cutting.

Assuming that proprietary information isn't involved, I think you should report your findings from the technical discussion with the IB people here, in TBT, and allow time for discussion in light of that information before proceeding to attempt to draft a motion.

Agreed. Just as we had an extensive "sky is the limit" discussion, we will have a discussion of what is our best option within the set of capabilities IB can give us with little or no development effort.

Straw man argument. If IB says "we can either get you a Like Button OR a better mobile app" your argument would be compelling, but without actual proof that working on this (especially as nsx is hinting it wouldn't be difficult) is going to burden IB and take away from more active complaints, I don't think your argument holds water.

Bolding mine: Will you be sharing this publicly or keeping it as "inside information" as you noted in your post here?

Bolding mine: "Hinting" due to inside information which should be shared publicly!

I'm operating under the assumption that IB has a limited number of tech people who could focus on either option, and that with a limited labor supply, it would be one or the other.

Yes. I shouldn't have used a loaded term like inside information to refer to what was merely knowledge that some relevant capabilities do exist within vBulletin. I don't yet know what they are, but I'm sure many users of vBulletin do.

When I learn more specifically what capabilities exist I am confident that IB will have no problem with discussion of those capabilities here. After all, these are features available to any customers of the forum software.

Discussion of what IB might or might not want to develop just for us would probably be proprietary. That's where the TalkBoard might have to just document our wishes.

Bolding mine:. Yeah, but you did :rolleyes: and are you saying that TalkBoard gets to know but the members whom TalkBoard represents don't get to know and the members have to take TalkBoard's word for it? Doesn't seem very transparent, does it?

I have gotten some information and Carol's permission to share it. IB's existing software has a reader feedback plug-in that apparently only needs to be configured and turned on. Because it already exists, it will not delay other developments, such as the mobile improvements we all crave.

That's the good news. The bad news is that it can be turned on by categories of members (like access to The Coupon Connection or OMNI) but it cannot be enabled or disabled forum by forum. That's disappointing to me.

Carol decided on her own (I didn't even think of asking her) to turn this feature on for moderators to get their reactions on how it looks and works in the moderators' private forum. If IB can easily give the same capability to non-moderator TalkBoard members, that would be even better.

After getting initial reactions, Carol could proceed on her own to turn the feature on for more users, shut the thing down, or ask TalkBoard for advice.

TalkBoard could provide advice on whether an FT-wide trial should take place, its duration, membership requirements (posts and tenure) to use the reader feedback button, the wording of the button, and any other configurable features (of which I do not yet have a list). Since there's no hurry, I think TalkBoard should stand by on these questions until the internal trial occurs.

I would have preferred a single-forum public trial, but we will not get that unless someone at IB decides to write some code just for us. I do intend to find out how much effort that would be for them. I will ask permission to share that information with Carol and TalkBoard and our members in this forum.

If users need the opinionated, over-simplified assessment/communication of others to make up their own mind about any given post, then I'm not sure how that adds value to my reading experience on FT. Popularity contests don't really float my boat, but I'm sure they float the boat for others. I'm just not sure how it would improve the reading experience of those who don't need or want another popularity contest on FT when reading FT.

Same here.

I agree.

It had entertainment value but then it became a distraction and left the place seemingly full of cliques (friendly as they were/are) but not much else in the way of information or even entertainment.

Indeed. If these kind of things are to be "tested", a larger scale trial by fire would perhaps -- if done over a longer period -- provide a better window into what may happen as a result of such things. Not that I am in favor of even that.

At my request, the trial approach was used for The Delta Forum Lounge Thread — Everybody is Welcome! back on October 10, 2005:It apparently worked.I completely support posting a poll.

Agree with both.

And of the folk who have posted in the two threads in this forum, 50% are against having a Like feature yet it seems to be moving forward. Heck, even some of the TB members are against it yet it seems to be moving forward. Neither a poll nor sitewide announcement has been done to garner further input, yet it seems to be moving forward. :(

Is IB planning to use this too to try to generate content to try to grab more eyeballs? If so, then the following comes to mind: "'money talks".

I guarantee you there's no conspiracy. IB is not pushing this, nor is the CD. I am. I want to find out if it will help or not. Period.