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Observations of SouthWest from a UA MM

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Old Jun 15, 2021, 5:41 pm
  #16  
 
Join Date: May 2008
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
I'm not sure you understand, but the hotel + transportation + meals is not upto WN's discretion. It's a FAA rule. I'll file a DOT complaint today and end up getting it for sure, but they've left a bad memory. Also, as I mentioned earlier, I think they take adavantage of their customer's lack of flying experience.
I’m afraid you must be someone with a lack of flying experience. FAA has zero rules concerning the above issues. If, perhaps you are confused about the difference between the FAA and the DOT, the DOT explicitly states that an airlines is Not required to provide hotel, transportation or meal vouchers.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:00 pm
  #17  
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Originally Posted by hat attack
I’m afraid you must be someone with a lack of flying experience. FAA has zero rules concerning the above issues. If, perhaps you are confused about the difference between the FAA and the DOT, the DOT explicitly states that an airlines is Not required to provide hotel, transportation or meal vouchers.
Hey? Their are very explicit rules on Involuntary Disembarking. I could not be accomodated on my next flight as it was overbooked hence I had to stay overnight.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:14 pm
  #18  
 
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
Hey? Their are very explicit rules on Involuntary Disembarking. I could not be accomodated on my next flight as it was overbooked hence I had to stay overnight.
Denied boarding is a completely different situation vs. an operational delay or cancellation. You're comparing apples and oranges.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:21 pm
  #19  
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
Hey? Their are very explicit rules on Involuntary Disembarking. I could not be accomodated on my next flight as it was overbooked hence I had to stay overnight.
There was no disembarking. The airline SHUT DOWN.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:23 pm
  #20  
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
.....

I'm curious on your comparison between DL and WN?
Delta does an overall great job. I would normally prefer to fly them and get to pick my own "special" seats due to status and maybe first class.

BUT - WN flies to more places with better schedule for us. And the ability to book, cancel, change, rebook, etc is well worth it to us. And of course the companion pass is awesome.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:29 pm
  #21  
 
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
So there are two separate issues: i) Compensation which is as you say carrier driven and ii) FAA rules. The FAA requires meal vouchers, transportation and hotel rooms if the delay is caused by the carrier (i.e. crew times out or in my case a vendor had IT issues) and results in a prolonged delay.
no it's not

FAA doesn't regulate this consumer item. DOT does

DOT explicitly says they dont have such a rule (unlike EU's EC261)

https://www.transportation.gov/indiv...-cancellations
My flight is delayed - am I entitled to money or other compensation from the airline?

No. There are no federal laws requiring airlines to provide passengers with money or other compensation when their flights are delayed. Each airline has its own policies about what it will do for delayed passengers. If your flight is experiencing a long delay, ask airline staff if they will pay for meals or a hotel room. While some airlines offer these amenities to passengers, others do not provide any amenities to stranded passengers.
===
If my flight is cancelled, is the airline required to provide me with a hotel room, cab fare, a food voucher, or reimbursement for any other non-airline ticket costs associated with my trip?

No. Airlines are not required to provide passengers with money or other compensation for costs that fall outside of the cancelled airline ticket and fees tied directly to the airline ticket (such as baggage fees, seat upgrades, etc.) when flights are cancelled.

Each airline has its own policies about what it will do for passengers whose flights have been cancelled. If your flight is cancelled, ask the airline staff if they will pay for meals or a hotel room. While some airlines offer these amenities to passengers, others do not provide any amenities to stranded passengers.

https://www.southwest.com/assets/pdf...commitment.pdf
southwest just has this. no meal voucher
If circumstances within our control, such as aircraft “swaps,” cause you to miss the last possible flight (or connection) of the
day to your destination, our Customer Service personnel have the authority to arrange at no additional cost to you:
● Overnight lodging
● Ground transportation to the overnight facility
If the cause of your inconvenience is not within our means of control, we will do our best to assist you by securing a
discounted rate at a hotel at or near the airport
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Last edited by paperwastage; Jun 15, 2021 at 6:35 pm
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 6:39 pm
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by _fx
UA left me stuck in SFO for a full 24 hours (on top of a 3 hour delay onboard) a year-ish ago.

Their best offer? $300 voucher. No hotel. No transportation. No meals. I attempted to escalate, and was politely told to pound sand.

Bonus? This was on *full J* international ticket.

So, as you can see, UA isn't necessarily much better than WN when it comes to compensation for non-status passengers.
if you know your stuff, you might have gotten hotel/meal reimbursement (unfortunately it comes to having to refer to FT gurus) under *A rules... as long as it's a inter-continental int'l J
Hotels? for 1K irrops (WX, MX, ...)? [Consolidated Q&A 2015-forward]

http://rg.star-allianceemployees.com...-handling.html
In the event of an uncontrollable delay, Star Alliance member carriers will provide amenities to premium customers (First, Business and Star Alliance Gold status customers and customers requiring special assistance) travelling on an "intercontinental" journey including "intercontinental connection" to/from domestic services. An "intercontinental connection" is defined as one which does not exceed 24 hours. Intercontinental services are defined as those operating between Europe, Asia, North America (including Central America), South america, Australia & New Zealand and Africa.

Minimum Amenities

Access to phone and/or Wi-Fi and/or other means of communication and/or provide information about communication access;
Meals and/or refreshments when delay exceeds two hours;
Hotel accommodation for more than 8h delays if it occurs in overnight period;
Ground transportation between airport/hotel/airport must be provided upon customer request;
For those customers who decline airport accommodations, carrier should provide ground transportation options to allow customers to travel to/from their residence if within 80 km from the airport, or provide ground transportation compensation fee.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 7:11 pm
  #23  
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
Right. And to be clear the compensation and the FAA rules are two very different things. The FAA clearly states they are supposed to provide meals and hotel when the fault is with the airlnes.
So what address do you write to in the FAA to complain?
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 8:01 pm
  #24  
 
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Originally Posted by Lomapaseo
So what address do you write to in the FAA to complain?
FAA takes discrimination complaints. DOT takes other air travel complaints.
https://www.transportation.gov/airco...umer-complaint
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 8:46 pm
  #25  
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Originally Posted by paperwastage
if you know your stuff, you might have gotten hotel/meal reimbursement (unfortunately it comes to having to refer to FT gurus) under *A rules... as long as it's a inter-continental int'l J
Hotels? for 1K irrops (WX, MX, ...)? [Consolidated Q&A 2015-forward]

http://rg.star-allianceemployees.com...-handling.html
Yes, this is exactly my my point. You only get fair compensation if you have status AND you are aware of esoteric policies the average customer isn’t AND have enough free time to research and push for the right results
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 9:05 pm
  #26  
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 71
Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
Hey? Their are very explicit rules on Involuntary Disembarking. I could not be accomodated on my next flight as it was overbooked hence I had to stay overnight.
Southwest does not overbook, so unfortunately you’re misinformed.
Take the voucher and head out, bud.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 9:28 pm
  #27  
 
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Originally Posted by usedtobeimportant
Not quite. WN could have:

a) Given me a hotel room and booked me on the 11am flight allowing me to catch some sleep.
b) Flew me out at 6am (after arrving at 1am).

WN refused to entertain a) and refused to give me a hotel room for b) saying I didn't need one. Again as I mentioned earlier, they had a system wide grounding of all planes so they were trying to save money but FAA rules are the rules but I think WN takes adavantage of a leisure travel customer base who are not informed.
Yes they could have. But you still slept at an airport although you are a United 1K million miler. So you are bragging about sleeping in an airport when your status suggests you could afford a cab or uber, and stay at a hotel for a few hours. I get it if this is a spirit thread and you spend your last $49 of stimulus money to return home, but in your situation I would have paid for a room, taxi, and meals and fought this out later. Southwest is a low cost carrier and I am too old to sleep in an airport if other options exist. I, too, am a United 1K million miler and $100-$200 is chump change if confronted with the choice of sleeping in a real bed in a hotel vs. the airport. If you have the money to fly, you need to be able to afford the consequences of IRROPS on a low cost carrier
.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 10:02 pm
  #28  
 
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The observation from this UA MM about all airlines, not just Southwest, is that sometimes you get dealt a bad hand with no way to turn the L into a W. That's when you use the skills you've accumulated as a FF to make the L as painless as possible and then move on.
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 10:03 pm
  #29  
 
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Should this be moved to the DYKWIA thread !
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Old Jun 15, 2021, 10:30 pm
  #30  
 
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Why didn’t OP book with Citi Prestige, Chase Sapphire Reserve, etc with good trip delay insurance? Any astute FTer should be doing so at this point versus chase after (no pun intended) the airport customer service during a delay for hotel accommodation
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