Rapid Rewards devaluation coming April 17, 2015
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: UK & US
Programs: BA Gold, UA Plat, A3* Gold, WN A+ CP, Marriott Plat Prem (LTP), Hilton Gold, Avis First, Hertz PC
Posts: 93
Rapid Rewards devaluation coming April 17, 2015
A small note in the February 2015 Report, leads to this link:
https://www.southwest.com/html/rapid...am-update.html
"We created Rapid RewardsŪ because we think you deserve to actually feel rewarded. And, from time to time we must make some updates to our program. Beginning April 17, 2015, the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors. However, there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate. And don’t forget that when fares go on sale, so do the points needed for redeeming for a reward flight on those fares."
I'm sure it won't work in our favor
(Thread title changed by moderator from "changes" to "devaluation", which is admittedly a conjecture at this point but is a necessary heads-up)
https://www.southwest.com/html/rapid...am-update.html
"We created Rapid RewardsŪ because we think you deserve to actually feel rewarded. And, from time to time we must make some updates to our program. Beginning April 17, 2015, the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors. However, there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate. And don’t forget that when fares go on sale, so do the points needed for redeeming for a reward flight on those fares."
I'm sure it won't work in our favor
(Thread title changed by moderator from "changes" to "devaluation", which is admittedly a conjecture at this point but is a necessary heads-up)
Last edited by nsx; Feb 12, 2015 at 1:16 pm
#2
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Maryland
Programs: SPG plat,Hyatt plat, HH Gold, AA Gold, WN A list, IHG Plat, Delta pittance
Posts: 64
Southwest jumping up redemption points needed on 4-17-15
Just got this e-mail.
Program Updates
We created Rapid RewardsŪ because we think you deserve to actually feel rewarded. And, from time to time we must make some updates to our program. Beginning April 17, 2015, the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors. However, there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate. And dont forget that when fares go on sale, so do the points needed for redeeming for a reward flight on those fares.
As an active Rapid RewardsŪ Member, you know first-hand about the great benefits of our frequent flyer program including:
Unlimited reward seats
No blackout dates
Points that dont expire
You may also know that were all about creating flexibility for you to use your Rapid Rewards Points:
We dont charge a fee of any kind if you wish to change or cancel your reward flight at any point.
We dont charge a fee of any kind for you to use your points, even if you are redeeming at the last minute.
And, there is no minimum point balance requirement to redeem for reward travel.
One thing well never change is our continued goal to bring you the best rewards program in the business.
Thank you for your business and continued loyalty.
Program Updates
We created Rapid RewardsŪ because we think you deserve to actually feel rewarded. And, from time to time we must make some updates to our program. Beginning April 17, 2015, the number of Rapid Rewards Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors. However, there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate. And dont forget that when fares go on sale, so do the points needed for redeeming for a reward flight on those fares.
As an active Rapid RewardsŪ Member, you know first-hand about the great benefits of our frequent flyer program including:
Unlimited reward seats
No blackout dates
Points that dont expire
You may also know that were all about creating flexibility for you to use your Rapid Rewards Points:
We dont charge a fee of any kind if you wish to change or cancel your reward flight at any point.
We dont charge a fee of any kind for you to use your points, even if you are redeeming at the last minute.
And, there is no minimum point balance requirement to redeem for reward travel.
One thing well never change is our continued goal to bring you the best rewards program in the business.
Thank you for your business and continued loyalty.
#5
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
Rapid Rewards changes coming April 17, 2015
It sounds like changes are being implemented in about 2 months, but, they can't provide specific details?
For the first RR 2.0 Devaluation, notice began 9/23/2013 for a 3/31/2014 implementation. And, notices contained the specifics. Here's that thread: [Wiki] WN 14% Devaluation of RR2 points for WGA redemption effective March 31, 2014
For these vague changes, notice began 2/12/2015 for a 4/17/2015 implementation. And, notices contained no specifics.
Is Southwest following Delta's lead and obfuscating the details/requirements of award redemptions?
the rest of the update reads:
For the first RR 2.0 Devaluation, notice began 9/23/2013 for a 3/31/2014 implementation. And, notices contained the specifics. Here's that thread: [Wiki] WN 14% Devaluation of RR2 points for WGA redemption effective March 31, 2014
For these vague changes, notice began 2/12/2015 for a 4/17/2015 implementation. And, notices contained no specifics.
Is Southwest following Delta's lead and obfuscating the details/requirements of award redemptions?
the rest of the update reads:
As an active Rapid RewardsŪ Member, you know first-hand about the great benefits of our frequent flyer program including:
Unlimited reward seats
No blackout dates
Points that don’t expire1
You may also know that we’re all about creating flexibility for you to use your Rapid Rewards Points:
We don’t charge a fee of any kind if you wish to change or cancel your reward flight at any point2.
We don’t charge a fee of any kind for you to use your points, even if you are redeeming at the last minute3.
And, there is no minimum point balance requirement to redeem for reward travel.
One thing we’ll never change is our continued goal to bring you the best rewards program in the business.
Thank you for your business and continued loyalty.
Unlimited reward seats
No blackout dates
Points that don’t expire1
You may also know that we’re all about creating flexibility for you to use your Rapid Rewards Points:
We don’t charge a fee of any kind if you wish to change or cancel your reward flight at any point2.
We don’t charge a fee of any kind for you to use your points, even if you are redeeming at the last minute3.
And, there is no minimum point balance requirement to redeem for reward travel.
One thing we’ll never change is our continued goal to bring you the best rewards program in the business.
Thank you for your business and continued loyalty.
Last edited by FindAWay; Feb 12, 2015 at 1:15 pm
#7
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Blue Ridge, GA
Posts: 5,512
Points needed to redeem for certain flights will vary based on destination, time, day of travel, demand, fare class, and other factors.
Where the points are already completely linked to cash value, a devaluation should not happen. This is just the company saying, Sorry, there are too many points out there and were going to confiscate XX% of your points in April.
#8
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,624
My reaction reading this news was unprintable.
IMHO this is a huge mistake by Southwest. It's much worse than the first devaluation of points. That devaluation was a loss of 1/7th of the value per point. This one could be a lot worse. It makes the value of your points a complete unknown, at the same time opening the door to unlimited devaluation without notice, continuing forever. I could hardly imagine a more adverse change to the program.
The only possible ray of sunshine is the statement "there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate". If that means that the low buckets of WGA fares will remain at 70 points per dollar, Southwest needs to come out and tell us that. Immediately and unambiguously. Otherwise we will presume the worst.
IMHO this is a huge mistake by Southwest. It's much worse than the first devaluation of points. That devaluation was a loss of 1/7th of the value per point. This one could be a lot worse. It makes the value of your points a complete unknown, at the same time opening the door to unlimited devaluation without notice, continuing forever. I could hardly imagine a more adverse change to the program.
The only possible ray of sunshine is the statement "there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate". If that means that the low buckets of WGA fares will remain at 70 points per dollar, Southwest needs to come out and tell us that. Immediately and unambiguously. Otherwise we will presume the worst.
#9
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
Or, they could make only flights departing between 1:19pm & 2:37pm local time on Sundays, Wednesdays, and Thursdays, from airports with IATA codes that end in vowels to airports with IATA codes that end in consonants price at 2x the 70pts/$1 ratio of other flights, unless the flight is the second non-stop between such destinations on that day, in which case, it will price at 3x the ratio.
To me, it is the lack of transparency and vagueness in the announcement that is scary.
Another random guess is that flights with less than [__] seats remaining at WGA fares will price as AT award rates. And that all Friday/Sunday WGA flights will price at 80 pts/$1.
I *hope* that this is simply changes to language with zero real changes implemented.
#11
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
Other factors could include whether booked online or over the phone. Whether the person booking has A-List/A-List Preferred status. Etc.
+1. ^ As I said with the first RR 2.0 devaluation:
#12
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
My reaction reading this news was unprintable.
IMHO this is a huge mistake by Southwest. It's much worse than the first devaluation of points. That devaluation was a loss of 1/7th of the value per point. This one could be a lot worse. It makes the value of your points a complete unknown, at the same time opening the door to unlimited devaluation without notice, continuing forever. I could hardly imagine a more adverse change to the program.
The only possible ray of sunshine is the statement "there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate". If that means that the low buckets of WGA fares will remain at 70 points per dollar, Southwest needs to come out and tell us that. Immediately and unambiguously. Otherwise we will presume the worst.
IMHO this is a huge mistake by Southwest. It's much worse than the first devaluation of points. That devaluation was a loss of 1/7th of the value per point. This one could be a lot worse. It makes the value of your points a complete unknown, at the same time opening the door to unlimited devaluation without notice, continuing forever. I could hardly imagine a more adverse change to the program.
The only possible ray of sunshine is the statement "there are still many flights which will stay at the current redemption rate". If that means that the low buckets of WGA fares will remain at 70 points per dollar, Southwest needs to come out and tell us that. Immediately and unambiguously. Otherwise we will presume the worst.
I'm thinking that:
- Rapid Rewards 2.0 existed from 3/1/2011-1/26/2014 (60 pts/$1 RR redemptions - with 3 month advance notice);
- Rapid Rewards 2.0.1 existed from 1/27/2014-3/30/2014 (Earnings/Redemptions changed to Base Fare Only {formerly Base Fare + Excise Tax} - with no advance notice) (edited to add);
- Rapid Rewards 2.1 existed from 3/31/2014-4/16/2015 (70 pts/$1 RR redemptions - with 5+ month advance notice); and
- Rapid Rewards 2.2 will exist from 4/17/2015-[???????] (To be explained - with 2 month advance notice).
At this pace of devaluation, should I expect another devaluation before the end of 2015 with only a 3 week advance announcement?
Last edited by FindAWay; Feb 13, 2015 at 11:11 am
#13
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,624
The WGA fare category contains several buckets, from very cheap to almost Anytime fare. I believe that the intent of this change is to charge more points per dollar in the higher buckets and keep the lowest buckets at 70 points per dollar.
If this is correct, I highly recommend that Southwest say so ASAP to head off a major panic among members. The current announcement sets the value of points completely adrift. It will result in many cut up Southwest Visa cards if some reassurance is not forthcoming this week.
If this is correct, I highly recommend that Southwest say so ASAP to head off a major panic among members. The current announcement sets the value of points completely adrift. It will result in many cut up Southwest Visa cards if some reassurance is not forthcoming this week.
#15
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Chicagoland, IL, USA
Programs: WN CP, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 14,192
Not good, WN. I am heading over to their Facebook page right now to vent my displeasure and to tell them they better announce details SOON.