Hello guys, I'm new here and I hope to get some good suggestions from you. I don't fly as much as many of you, only 2~4 long-haul trips a year. Currently I'm using China Southern Airline Sky Pearl FFP for easy status earning. I fly primary on discounted economy tickets on round flights HEL-AMS-PVG-WUH or HEL-CDG-WUH and I'm using majority only AF/KL. The nice thing why I have chosen CZ FFP is because they used to give 100% miles for discounted L, T classes so that I can easily earn Elite with only 2 return flights a year or Elite Plus with 4 per year. CZ even allows free lounge access with Elite status on CZ flights, and also it costs little miles to redeem a short-haul domestic ticket in China (10000km to redeem domestic flights above 800km). But unfortunately they have revised the rules after 10th Apr 2012 that discounted classes such as L, T on AF/KL are counted only 40%. They still give 100% for all classes on Aeroflot, but I'm not so keen to use Aeroflot instead of AF/KL. I found similar threads on this forum asking which Skyteam FFP to choose, but I think their situations were quite different than mine. I'm trying to find a best substitution FFP for Sky Pearl since I can't earn so easily Elite Plus or Elite any more if I go on with their new rules. My primary goal is to earn status as easy as the previous Sky Pearl FFP by flying 2~4 round trips per year with AF/KL discounted classes, and secondary goal is to redeem some tickets for short-haul domestic flights. I think Skymiles is the only one at the moment which gives 100% for AF/KL discounted classes, but it costs a lot of miles to redeem a domestic ticket (15000miles compared to 10000km on CZ), also Skymiles cannot have lounge access with only Elite status as in some years I cannot earn enough miles for Elite Plus. Then with FB it's impossible for me to earn status based on the miles since it gives only 25% or 50% on those discounted classes but only possible with number of qualifying flights. Again it cannot have lounge access with only Elite status and obviously even worse to redeem flights since I will get much less FB miles than Skymiles. I think Sky Pearl has really been the most generous FFP at least for me in the past, but now which FFP should I switch to? Skymiles or FB, or some even better FFP do you recommend? Thank you in advance.

You need to decide what is the priority for you - and make your decision on that.

You don't really explain why you prize status so highly. For someone who only flies 2-4 times a year (or is there lots of shorthaul flying as well that hasn't been mentioned?), status is pretty meaningless - status is something that has value the more that you fly.

If lounge access is your thing - then perhaps getting a Priority Pass (etc) or just investigating the paid lounge options at each of the relevant airports may work out to make more sense (you'll be paying "extra" for lounge access - but you can decouple it from your FFP decision).

If it's other status "perks" such as additional baggage, these may indeed turn out to be much more expensive to replicate - but do you always need/use this extra allowance?

If the miles are your priority, then you do realise that by walking away from your existing FFP, you're potentially "orphaning" or abandoning those miles (perhaps you will be able to do something with the miles you already have, though). But check the rules of any other FFP carefully - as you know, Flying Blue earns only 25% on lots of economy fare classes on AF, DL and KL - but on some of the other SkyTeam airlines, the cheapest economy fares earn absolutely nothing on Flying Blue.

When comparing on the basis of miles, don't forget to factor in how easy it may be to actually spend them. Availability of awards and ease of redemption seems to vary wildly - so don't solely focus on the earning/burning rates (though these should be also carefully studied!).

Thanks for your reply. I do only 2~4 round trips a year and it's totally possible to earn Elite Plus/Elite because each one-way trip like HEL-AMS-PVG-WUH gives me around 11000km, and as long as the FFP like CZ Sky Pearl used to give 100% for the miles I flown, then 2 round trips already give me 44000km to be Elite and 4 round trips would be more than enough for Elite Plus. In last year alone I have earned 100000+km on my CZ FFP. As I mentioned my top priority is status earning with flying only 2~4 round trips a year like before, I would like to keep the benefit I can have from the status such as priority boarding, extra baggage and free lounge access. Actually my Diners Club card issued in Finland already enables free lounge access in most airports I visited, but I still prefer Skyteam lounge if I'm possible to use it with my status. A good point you did mention was how easily I can spend the points. I redeemed quite a number of times on CZ domestic flights and every time I didn't have any problem to get a flight as I wanted, probably they have lots of flights everyday on the same routes. I don't know how easy I can redeem with Skymiles or FB. Perhaps I should still stick to CZ? If I make 4 round trips plus a few short trips a year I can still barely manage to earn an Elite at least.

Have you looked into MU? They seem to before generous on mileage accrual.

Compare the China Southern and China Eastern programs. Also compare prices for your typical tickets; it might be possible to earn a lot more miles by paying a little bit more for a slightly higher fare code, although the tickets might need to be booked by phone or with a travel agent rather than on line. If four trips has been earning ElitePlus easily, that same travel should be close to earning Elite at 40%. Even with Elite, you would still get use of the CZ lounges in China and you can use the Diners Club lounges elsewhere. How much is a slightly more preferred lounge worth to you? It doesn't sound to me like switching to the AF/KL or DL programs is a good idea, although you might want to investigate KE.

Yet another idea would be to think about switching to a *A program. I'm not sure which partner serves WUH; Asiana, TG, and SQ are the main Asian members. Wuhan might basically restrict your choices to CZ or MU, assuming you want to avoid CAAC as well as the very new small Chinese carriers, but Shanghai airlines might be *A now.

Hmmm.... I'm not sure that MU Eastern Miles would be that much more generous for the OP. Looking at their earning chart, they give only 50% miles for most economy booking classes on AF/KL. It's only Y and B that seem to earn 100%.

Also, you need 100,000 points (I assume this is km, not miles) across 2 years to get Silver status, which the OP wouldn't manage with the mentioned 44,000km/year - even on 100% mileage earning.

Would you better off looking at segment qualification? Flying Blue will give Elite status for 15 qualifying flights in a year, and Elite Plus (with lounge access for international flights) for 30.

Thank you all for your replies. I have been looking into KE or MU before and I don't think any of them can earn miles or status so easily. I used to use Oneworld (Finnair Plus) and Star Alliance (SAS EuroBonus) over past 10 years and none was possible to earn even silver status, but with CZ just in one year it was possible. Also I have been very happy with the services provided by AF/KL, and to Wuhan CZ/MU serves most of the flghts, so Skyteam is the one I should stick to. I know Flying Blue is already quite generous in segment qualification, but the number of flights I can take a year will be hardly enough to qualify Elite Plus. Perhaps I should either stick to CZ to manage with 40% earning to barely keep Elite, or try with DL Skymiles for 100% miles earning to get Elite Plus. Somehow I feel that there should be a better solution, but just need to find out, and that's why I post here wishing to find out how.

I doubt there is a better solution. The times when you could get both high status and loads of miles to spend, with just a couple of cheap flights per year, are gone, in all 3 alliances.

As a very general rule, DL imposes high fees on award tickets originating outside of the USA. DL also has long blackout periods on KE, much longer than the carrier imposes on its own FF because DL blacks out all KE flights on any date where a particular route/direction is blacked out by KE.

IMO the DL program is best for those who can do high mileage, 75K for PM or 125K for DM, while the best benefit is free upgrades into FC on DL "domestic" (North American) flights. There is also concern on the DL forum about rumored possible changes to make the program more revenue based, so there could soon be major changes not to your advantage.

They only apply fuel surcharges as a general rule on award tickets originating in Europe. For the rest of the world, you'll pay YQ based on the carrier(s) involved, and DL would collect YQ on those carriers (MU, CZ, and CI, for instance) even if you originated in the US.

This is definitely worth making sure those not familiar with DL know. The worst of it all is that KE is such a great airline to fly (at least in J) and they are NOT on the DL YQ list. (In fact, they're also often the best redemption value out of Europe, as they usually don't publish a YQ/YR on their fares, so DL won't collect it. This has changed with tickets originating in Germany, but that's the only report so far.)

Another strategy might be to try for SkyTeam Elite status if you're close, presumably on CZ since that's where your redeemable miles are, but largely fly the best schedule and cheapest ticket for you. You already have Diners Club lounges.

For additional lounges, think about a DL SkyClub membership, but this is expensive if you're not a DL elite, although the DL Chinese website might offer cheaper memberships for nonUSA residents.

If you have Diners Club, you might be able to get an AmEx Plat card, which is good for DL lounges when flying DL, AA lounges when flying AA, and US lounges anytime. This would cover very nice lounges in NRT when you are connecting there to/from a DL flight.

A cheaper alternative is to take a Priority Pass membership; the cheapest is under $150 per year but charges about $30 for every lounge visit. There are a bunch of PP lounges in China, including IIRC some CZ lounges, but AFAIK no Wuhan lounge is on the list.

Hi there,
welcome to FT.

If you are trying to select some other ST FFP, each of them would have some benefits as well as some disadvantages. And you would have to weigh in the priorities between them. Unfortunately, most FFPs are getting stricter. Gone are the days of BMI, and similar others.

After reading several of your posts, I think it would be better for you to stick to CZ FFP. At least CZ gives you 40% mileage for the lowest economy fares. Most other FFPs in ST, with few exceptions, only give you 25% for the lowest economy fares.

Then again, there's nothing wrong with airlines giving 25% or 40% for their lowest fares. It's a frequent flyer programme, meant to reward the frequent travellers. It's their product, and the travellers would reap the rewards or benefits if they meet certain thresholds. Not the other way around. Definitely not designed to suit the average traveller's travel patterns.

Perhaps, if the minimal fares is all you are willing to pay for (which is not a bad thing), then Star Alliance carriers may be a better suit. Most of their economy fares are flat out 100% fares. However, I cannot comment on Star Alliance offerings in Wuhan.

There's quite a bit of information already given by other FTers above, so you would have to make your own choice. But in my opinion, stick to CZ, and work a bit harder to get the top tiers.

Good luck!

I have finally decided to stick to CZ, because I think compared to other FFP, CZ still gives some unique advantages on CZ flights. With only Elite status you can have such as VIP boarding, priority baggage, access to CZ lounges which are much better than the Diners Club lounges at least in China.

I have also found some alternative "shortcut" to maintain my SkyTeam status. I can book DL tickets for AF/KL so that I can always get 100% miles on CZ FFP even with discounted economic class (because ticket number is DL), and the price is actually similar to booking on AF/KL own websites. Only problem is that you can't get easily connection flights in China with DL's booking.

I have recently traveled with Aeroflot on route HEL-SVO-PEK, even I would prefer to use AF/KL. At least Aeroflot is quite cheap and it gives always 100% miles on CZ FFP, no matter whatever discounted economic class you book. The aircraft is very new A333 with personal entertainment system which I'm quite happy with. Of course the on-flight service is not comparable to AF/KL, no wine served even it's on the menu, but in overall not too bad. The lounge at SVO is chaotic - noisy, full of people that you can hardly find a space to sit down - worst I have ever been. Any of you here have ever traveled with Aeroflot and what is your experience?

I never traveled on SU but I have used their lounge at the old SVO airport a number of times. It was tired and dark and at one time was mostly smoking, which permeated the entire lounge. I don't remember crowds when I used it before KLM flights, but the food tended to disappear as soon as it was put out, especially the smoked salmon. Breakfast foods looked dry and stale, totally unappealing but they did have Russian sparkling wine and imported mineral water.

This arrangement had pros and cons compared to the former lounge arrangement which was to give 15-20 Euro coupons for the Irish bar across from the gate, good for food/alcohol/souvenirs and hard to spend the full amount unless you wanted a T-shirt or something. Irish coffee, their specialty, was cheap.