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Collective agreement for the pilots being negotiated

Collective agreement for the pilots being negotiated

Old Mar 30, 2022, 5:02 pm
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Collective agreement for the pilots being negotiated

Today the current collective bargaining agreement between
SAS and the pilots expires. And it does seem the negotiations are not progressing well. It seems the point of view of the pilots is that there are no reason for them to pay for a pandemic recovery. Underlying, I guess that means they are seriously unhappy with SAS Link and SAS Connect.

Sorry, articles in Danish, but Google is your friend...
​​​​​
https://check-in.dk/sammenbrud-i-forhandlingerne-med-sas-piloterne/

The union view on the new production companies

https://check-in.dk/dansk-metal-sas-slaaet-ind-paa-fatal-kurs/
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 12:05 am
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Another show-down where it is evident that the unions have zero grasp of reality, and just expect money to miraculously appear to grant them salary increases while the rest of the world still struggles.... Great way to run a company into the ground
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 7:12 am
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Originally Posted by SKT-DK
Another show-down where it is evident that the unions have zero grasp of reality, and just expect money to miraculously appear to grant them salary increases while the rest of the world still struggles.... Great way to run a company into the ground
The pilot union isn't helping, but it isn't running the airline into the ground. The CEO is doing that. Both the current and the past---
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 10:08 am
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Originally Posted by SKT-DK
Another show-down where it is evident that the unions have zero grasp of reality, and just expect money to miraculously appear to grant them salary increases while the rest of the world still struggles.... Great way to run a company into the ground
Isn’t there a pretty strong demand for pilots nowadays that is getting stronger as the world increasingly moves beyond pandemic control travel restrictions? This is probably not the best of times to try to blame pilots for the airline’s financial situation following from the pandemic.

The airline has gotten bailouts more than its employees, hasn’t it?
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 10:54 am
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Originally Posted by SKT-DK
Another show-down where it is evident that the unions have zero grasp of reality, and just expect money to miraculously appear to grant them salary increases while the rest of the world still struggles.... Great way to run a company into the ground
The problem of unions and how this part of the world can't seem to leave it behind them. Giving one party in a dispute absolute power through striking but not letting the other party defend or retaliate is so absurd that I can't believe we still let this happen.

Don't like your pay? Go work somewhere else that allows for increased productivity so you can be paid more. Don't like your net pay? Vote better and move somewhere with lower or no taxes.

I hope that their union backed Scandinavian pilot count is shrinking with SAS Connect and SAS Ireland.
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 10:55 am
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
Isn’t there a pretty strong demand for pilots nowadays that is getting stronger as the world increasingly moves beyond pandemic control travel restrictions?
Wouldn't an increased demand for pilots give these pilots then opportunity at other employers that pay better?

Unclear why we need unions unless these pilots expect to get paid more for the same productivity while the airlines financial results aren't there to support that? Which is like wishing for a unicorn for Christmas.
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 11:19 am
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Never got the idea how unions insist on negotiating for salary hikes while the company just is in a bad shape. I work for the same salary for years. Why? Because I like my job, I am loyal to my company and know that the current economic situation doesn't allow for salary increases. Of course I expect the company to remember this once we recover our business. But I would never ask for a raise right now. Or even strike and put the company in an even more crappy situation which leads to more business lost and even less a chance of returning to old glory.

On the other hand, I also expect the senior management to lead by example and do not hike their renumeration, hiring more senior managers, spend 3-digit millions on nonsense change management and digital transformation consultants or cash in millions in $ in performance bonuses based on "increased financial performance" which were achieved by starving the company on OPEX (and often enough CAPEX).
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 2:16 pm
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Employers aren’t all that loyal to employees when employers are in questionable financial shape. Corporations like this aren’t even generally loyal to employees beyond what the law requires. So the “loyalty” back is a two way street.

Just think about how loyal airline and hotel loyalty programs are to their members. Not at all when the devaluation serves management’s interests.
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 10:24 pm
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Originally Posted by FlyingMoose
The problem of unions and how this part of the world can't seem to leave it behind them. Giving one party in a dispute absolute power through striking but not letting the other party defend or retaliate is so absurd that I can't believe we still let this happen.

Don't like your pay? Go work somewhere else that allows for increased productivity so you can be paid more. Don't like your net pay? Vote better and move somewhere with lower or no taxes.

I hope that their union backed Scandinavian pilot count is shrinking with SAS Connect and SAS Ireland.
Historically, I do not think we have agreed on much when it comes to SK, but we definitely do here! And to add to your point about how absurd it is, just think of the last time the baggage people walked out, the strike was deemed illegal by the courts yet they did not give a damn and kept striking...
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Old Mar 31, 2022, 10:45 pm
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
Isnt there a pretty strong demand for pilots nowadays that is getting stronger as the world increasingly moves beyond pandemic control travel restrictions? This is probably not the best of times to try to blame pilots for the airlines financial situation following from the pandemic.

The airline has gotten bailouts more than its employees, hasnt it?
There is a strong demand for pilots. But the longer tenured pilots are loth to change airline, as seniority can't be transfered, and they would have to restart at the bottom of the seniority ladder at the new airline.
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Old Apr 1, 2022, 6:55 am
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Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer
There is a strong demand for pilots. But the longer tenured pilots are loth to change airline, as seniority can't be transfered, and they would have to restart at the bottom of the seniority ladder at the new airline.
Sounds like a more worthwhile problem to solve than keeping collective bargaining a thing for a profession that pays x5 median wage?
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Old Apr 2, 2022, 6:59 am
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Originally Posted by FlyingMoose
The problem of unions and how this part of the world can't seem to leave it behind them. Giving one party in a dispute absolute power through striking but not letting the other party defend or retaliate is so absurd that I can't believe we still let this happen.

Don't like your pay? Go work somewhere else that allows for increased productivity so you can be paid more. Don't like your net pay? Vote better and move somewhere with lower or no taxes.

I hope that their union backed Scandinavian pilot count is shrinking with SAS Connect and SAS Ireland.
Seems to not just be a Nordic issue....

https://www.q13fox.com/news/alaska-a...-pilots-picket
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Old Apr 2, 2022, 9:51 am
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Originally Posted by CPH-Flyer
There is a strong demand for pilots. But the longer tenured pilots are loth to change airline, as seniority can't be transfered, and they would have to restart at the bottom of the seniority ladder at the new airline.
Thats a function of the unionization and/or of other agreements covering relations between employer and employee/employee group?
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Old Apr 2, 2022, 7:14 pm
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
Thats a function of the unionization and/or of other agreements covering relations between employer and employee/employee group?
It is a thing both at unionised and non-unionised airlines.

Another aspect that might make the SK pilots less likely to change employers, who is the alternative employer? Which they might also want to ask themselves, if (when?) SK goes belly up, who will come in and fill the void? European traffic, a host of LCCs and the majors trying to feed their European hubs? Long haul, additional flights from non European airlines?
If SK were to go bankrupt, I doubt a new airline with long haul operations would be created in the Scandinavian region.
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Old Apr 4, 2022, 4:40 am
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The handful of ex-SK pilots I know now primarily work for EK/QR and one for LX. Plenty of alternative employment provided you're willing to take better pay, better benefits and lower taxes as a reward for moving.
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