Dovster

As I stated during in the OP, I do stand when the rest of the congregation does so, no, I have no issue with that at all.

If you are asking if I would stand when everyone else is kneeling, I would simply do what I had been doing before the kneeling started. If I was sitting, I would remain seated. If I was standing, I would remain standing. If memory serves -- and correct me if I am wrong -- Catholics are generally standing before kneeling.

wideman

I mentioned earlier on that I feel the responsibility rests on the visitor to understand the proper behavior before going into someone else's place of worship. (And I define "proper behavior" as behavior that the regular membership of that worship-place would deem to be proper.)

So, if there's a conflict between the visitor's beliefs and the behavior that is proper for that place of worship, I believe that the visitor should elect to not attend the service.

Lehava

I am curious about how you all react if/when you are at the service of another faith and your beliefs are "commented on" (during the sermon or prayers or group statements). For example for someone non-Christian when the preacher begins talking about needing to convert non believers and saving them from hell.

I have to admit it is this type of stuff that worries me more when going to to a church or mosque than things like whether I should kneel or not or cover my head or not.

Lehava

There is a difference though between understanding the behaviors of a group and participating in them. I totally understand why those praying kneel. But if I am not praying I do not feel a requirement to kneel.

JHattery

duplicate

JHattery

Within Christianity, same thing can still be encountered when visiting services of one sect/denomination as a member of another sect/denomination. No longer a "non-believer" issue, but rather a "you're doing it wrong, and will be damned for eternity as a result unless you change over to my way of doing it."

Lehava

Exactly, and how do you handle it? My question was about reaction/behavior not about whether those beliefs belong to one group or another. I know this is also a big issue for people who are "inter-married", I have a good friend who is protestant, his wife is catholic and they are raising their children catholic. He took his children to mass recently as his wife was unavailable and the priest gave a speech on how non-catholics were damned and he was mortified.

How do you all handle this. Do you just gulp and let it go?

Dovster

I expect a clergyman to preach what he believes to be God's truth. If that includes saying that his flock should try to convert Jews in order to save our immortal souls from an eternity of damnation, I have absolutely no problem with that.

If you look at it as I do, he is attempting to protect me. True, I disagree that I need such protection, but he has the right to believe it -- and the right to teach that to others.

I see a major difference between such a clergyman and one whose hatred of a group (Jews, Blacks, or any other) leads him to exhort his congregation to take actions against its members. I have never run into such a situation but if I were I would -- at a very minimum -- walk out of the church immediately.

JHattery

Easier in a group setting than one-on-one.

In a group, e.g. at a Service, it is not directed at me so I simply ignore it. at those times, the topic is a manifestation of particular doctrine or dogma delivered impersonally.

One-on-one, it is both more touching and more difficult. A very close friend of mine tries every few years to "convert" me to his particular brand of Christianity. I know he is doing it out of care and concern for me as a friend, from his particular point of view and set of beliefs. We generally then have one of those conversations that I am very comfortable with my beliefs as I am sure he is with his. I thank him for his concern, and asure him I am secure in my own faith and salvation. then we go on with our visit. Out of friendship, he feels obligated to try. Out of friendship, I know I am obligated to let him try.

This has been going on since we were roommates in college oh so many years ago.

kapitman

I think the most important thing to do is just be respectful in everyway you can. From my travels and religious experiences, it is important to give the utmost respect for the place you are in. Of course, if I (as a Baptist) go into to a Buddhist temple, I am NOT going to pray to Buddha, but I love to take in the atmosphere and observe how others worship.

peteropny

This is quite interesting. We were in Venice (start of a cruise) and on a ship excursion that included a visit to the Jewish Museum (essentially a collection of small historical synagogues). Upon entering the first of the synagogues, the guide from the museum tried to insist that I put on a yamulke (most of the others were in baseball caps). I'm Thai and as many of you know, touching our heads is not done unless by very close family/friends. As such I declined and said that I would wait in the vestibule. The guide then created an ugly scene saying that I can't wait there because she needed to see everyone at all times. I simply refused and sat down. I wonder how she would feel if she was required to put on a crucifix when entering a Catholic church.

Dovster

Jewish law does not require a man to cover his head upon entering a synagogue but the synagogue, itself, might have such a requirement.

I do not see it as the same thing as requiring someone entering Catholic Church to wear a crucifix. A fairer comparison would be requiring someone entering the church to take off his hat or, as happened with OzStamps in Nazareth, to cover his bare legs.

I am a little confused about the issue of touching your head. I know that Thais do wear hats so that can not be the problem and there is never a need for someone else to put the yamulke on you.

As far as the guide needing to see you at all times, that may be a security question. If you ever go to the Venice ghetto area during a period of heightened tension in the Middle East you will see carabieneri carrying assault rifles patrolling in the square.

eastwest

I disagree. Sitting quietly is always appropriate. Maybe you don't respect the person being honored...whether it's Jesus or the President or whoever else. However...sitting quietly at least shows respect for the people around you who have different feelings than you do. If you see me in a Mass by chance, I'll be sitting quietly and it won't be out of ignorance. It'll actually be out of respect...for you.

ksandness

[QUOTE=letiole]While I basically do what everyone else has noted here, I didn't notice anyone mentioning participating in Shinto, Buddhist or Hindu rituals. I have participated in the purification before entering shrines in Japan. I've also participated in many other Buddhist rituals. Looking back, I don't know if I was being respectful or disrespectful, but my intent was the former (and I first did these things with a Buddhist who signaled that it was appropriate for me to do, so I assume it was). I kneel in Buddhist temples and don't point my feet toward Buddha. I toss monetary offerings where that's done. At Balinese temple ceremonies, I dress in a sarong and sash. I try to never be above a Buddhist monk.

Japanese people are very eclectic religiously, so if you're visiting a sacred site *with* a Japanese person or family (not as a tourist just looking around), they may expect you to take part, not in a coercive "You must become Buddhist/Shinto," but in a sort of "That's what everybody does" sort of way. They simply don't understand the attitude of "My religion forbids me to participate in these rites." They also don't understand the attitude of "I'm an atheist, so I don't participate in these rites." To them, it's just what Japanese people do.

I'm a Christian, but I believe that we're all worshipping the same Force Behind the Universe, so I have no problem going to a Shinto shrine on New Year's Eve and saying a prayer with my hosts. writing a wish on a piece of wood and throwing it on a bonfire, sitting through the chanting of sutras at a monastery, or burning incense in front of the portrait of a recently deceased person when visiting someone's home (this is considered common courtesy).

However, I realize that not everyone has the free and easy attitude of the Japanese.

rives21

Okay, we may have to "agree to disagree" here.

You say that you will sit out of respect for me, but I will take it as disrespect. It's doesn't make a lot of sense. You say that you "disagree". With what do you disagree? Do you disagree that I'm offended when people sit during the Consecration of Christ? Seems like I'd be in the best position to know when I'm offended... Or do you disagree with my justification for being offended? If that is the case, then I think you may have strayed off topic a bit here. This thread is not for discussing the merits or conduct of one's religion. Throughout this thread, the manner in which one worships has been taken as a given - whether it's lighting candles, not pointing feet at the Budha, kneeling, or other.

To sum up, do you disagree with the fact that I am offended or my justification for being offended? Either way, I think you're a bit off base on this one.