It's Baaaaack - Secure Flight redeaux

Old Aug 9, 07, 1:08 pm
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It's Baaaaack - Secure Flight redeaux

The government proposed a third version of its airline passenger pre-screening program Thursday, stripped of controversial data mining elements that had aroused privacy concerns and blocked earlier versions.

At the same time, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff announced that starting six months from now airlines operating international flights will be required to send the government their passenger list data before the planes take off rather than afterwards, as is now the case.

<snip>

Chertoff said the new domestic system, known as Secure Flight, will avoid the kinds of activities envisioned in earlier versions of the proposal that raised privacy concerns.

The new system will be tested this fall by TSA and is open for public comment after which the government plans to issue a final version and implement the program sometime in 2008.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070809/.../secure_flight

... another waste of time and energy...
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Old Aug 9, 07, 1:09 pm
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Here we go again with "Secure Flight"

Dumb and Dumber are at it again with another version of Secure Flight coming at us.
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Old Aug 9, 07, 1:37 pm
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Sounds like Chertoff's move to require the stupid 48 hour notice for some international travel is his way of passive-agressively reacting to the uproar over prior Secure Flight implementations. "Nyah, since you won't let us collect all that personal data, we're going to make travel tough on you!"
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Old Aug 9, 07, 1:49 pm
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Originally Posted by exerda View Post
Sounds like Chertoff's move to require the stupid 48 hour notice for some international travel is his way of passive-agressively reacting to the uproar over prior Secure Flight implementations. "Nyah, since you won't let us collect all that personal data, we're going to make travel tough on you!"

What will this do for stand by? Will that be pretty much shot? I would think the airlines would hate that.
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Old Aug 9, 07, 2:04 pm
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We had two threads started on this a minute apart so I'm going to merge the two.

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Old Aug 9, 07, 5:45 pm
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Capps I I I.

"Airlines operating international flights" or just for those international flights being operated by commercial airlines?
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Old Aug 9, 07, 6:20 pm
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I can hear Skeletor's laugh now ...
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Old Aug 9, 07, 6:23 pm
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Originally Posted by Superguy View Post
I can hear Skeletor's laugh now ...
Who's going to hire him as payback after all of these funds being wasted by DHS?
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Old Aug 9, 07, 8:13 pm
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Originally Posted by GUWonder View Post
Who's going to hire him as payback after all of these funds being wasted by DHS?
Spiff.

A couple things I was going to post earlier, but my son shut down my PC mid sentence ...

Originally Posted by Skeletor
The Homeland Security chief said he was unaware of any specific, credible threat against airlines. But based on recent car bomb attempts in Great Britain and public statements by terrorists, he repeated his view that "we are entering a period where the threat is somewhat heightened.
How can there be a "heightened" threat when he said there was no specific or credible threat? Just FUD.

Originally Posted by Skeletor
"Look at the history of al-Qaida," Chertoff said. "The airplane has been a consistent favorite target of theirs."
Yeah, 2 attempts by AQ and the rest were idiot wannabes. Yeah, that makes it a consistent and favorite target. AQ goes for targets of opportunity.

Originally Posted by Skeletor
On the domestic side, transferring watch-list checks to Transportation Security Administration officers "should provide more security and more consistency, and thus reduce misidentifications" that have frustrated passengers, Chertoff said.
Yeah, the same TSA that uses Consistent Inconsitency®, can't even get follow SOP or a memo, and is too concerned about the last threat.

Originally Posted by Skeletor
"Secure Flight will not harm personal passenger privacy," Chertoff said. "It won't collect commercial data (about passengers). It will not assign risk scores and will not attempt to predict behaviors."
Then why do they need to collect the data? I'll give you hint ... we don't. I guarantee that that's what will end up happening ... eventually if he gets his way.

Hopefully, he'll be gone, we'll have a new administration that's a lot smarter and this will be scrapped before it gets off the ground. That's the one good thing about gov't in this ... it's excruciatingly slow. I hope it stays that way in DHS's case.

Super
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Old Aug 9, 07, 9:06 pm
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Originally Posted by Superguy View Post
Hopefully, he'll be gone, we'll have a new administration that's a lot smarter and this will be scrapped before it gets off the ground.
Smarter? Excuse me while I laugh myself silly. I don't see any of the candidates out there the are the least bit concerned about individual citizens or their rights. Both parties want data on you, albeit for different excuses -er- reasons.
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Old Aug 9, 07, 9:07 pm
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Originally Posted by Global_Hi_Flyer View Post
Smarter? Excuse me while I laugh myself silly. I don't see any of the candidates out there the are the least bit concerned about individual citizens or their rights. Both parties want data on you, albeit for different excuses -er- reasons.
Yeah, I know it's a pipe dream. Doesn't mean I can't dream though.
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Old Aug 10, 07, 1:13 am
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Another article from wired.com about Secure Flight.

FTA... ...the Center for Democracy and Technology's policy director Jim Dempsey gave a tentative stamp of approval.

"On initial glance, it is by far the most rational and focused description of a passenger screening system we have seen," Dempsey said.


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Old Aug 10, 07, 5:56 am
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DHS would never want to scrub the international passenger manifests before the flight takes off because the diversion of flights due to DHS "false alarms" has eroded DHS's credibility internationally. Never.

Will the airlines' bouncing someone on the ground off the flight at the DHS's urging get the kind of live television news coverage that DHS's no-fly lists causing flight diversions does? I have my doubts.
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Old Aug 10, 07, 5:42 pm
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Of course it wont. I've been on international flights before where someone has been hauled off the a/c after doors initially had been closed, and no mention anywhere in the media.
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Old Aug 10, 07, 6:12 pm
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This honestly isn't too bad, guys. While I strongly believe in privacy, the information we have to provide them is optional (although they may try to sneak it into a requirement in the future, but let's focus on the present for now), and it definitely can help with some victims of the No-Fly list.

However, one thing bugs me. They're required to send off flight itineraties (sp?) 72 hours before a flight, right? But how about those who make last-minute reservations? As far as I know, you can make a reservation 2 hours before a flight. Will this be changed?
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